Arming Teachers

[Revoltingest]

I moved stuff around so I can address related points together.
No, I do not agree that if guns used in self defense are likely to be used wrongfully, then it would follow that there would be more cases of accidental injury than cases of successful self-defense. That doesn't follow at all.
This would assume that every time someone uses a gun, or more, that someone would get hurt. That is obviously not the case.
The point is that MORE people than otherwise will be hurt because MORE people than otherwise are utilizing guns.
Here's an analogy since I know you love mine Say a bar owner knows that when there are 50 people in his bar, it is probable that at least 2 of them will get into a fight. But he also knows that when that number jumps up to 75 people, at least 6 people will begin to fight. The ratio of fighters to non-fighters is small, but increasing the number of people exponentially increases the number of fighters. The same with guns in self defense and guns in wrongful accidents ratio.
And yes, questioning whether guns were a necessary or exacerbating component in the self-defense is exceedingly relevant. Because you could claim that since 10 people were saved by guns via self-defense, we should then ignore the 2 people who get shot. But if guns were not necessary, or in fact caused the problem in the first place, then the trade-off of 2 lives for the 10 suddenly doesn't seem like a good trade after all.

My eyes & brain are starting to hurt (too many simultaneous discussions), so I'll just agree to disagree.

 

[Falvlun]

My eyes & brain are starting to hurt (too many simultaneous discussions), so I'll just agree to disagree.

That's pretty weak, Rev. You are utilizing those statistics to support a point they don't support. Tell me where my analysis is incorrect.

 

[Revoltingest]

That's pretty weak, Rev. You are utilizing those statistics to support a point they don't support. Tell me where my analysis is incorrect.

Now, now....you're just covering thoroughly trampled ground.
Rest assured, I'll be back after a headache & pressing matters in the real world subside.

 

[LuisDantas]

Because it isn't going to change any time soon.

That is neither known nor a reasonable premise.

Although I can see that once you accept that as true, then yes, of course there is no way out of a true domestic arms race.

 

[Revoltingest]

That is neither known nor a reasonable premise.

We'll have to agree to disagree about American gun culture not changing any time soon.
It's being very entrenched in the culture is what I see living in Americastan.
I'll seek out solutions which are more immediately reasonable & practical than revamping the culture.

This brings up an interesting analogue.
Why does Brazil have such rampant violent crime & kidnapping?
Why don't they just change their culture to eliminate this propensity?

 

[LuisDantas]

Ok, it was fun talking with you about this.

 

[Revoltingest]

Ok, it was fun talking with you about this.

Good! Likewise.
I try to be interesting instead of annoying.
(It works better sometimes than others.)

 

[Twilight Hue]

Yeah that's right, we'll just train them to jump in front of bullets fired from the criminals guns (I take it this is your way of seeking population control you would significantly increase the population ratio of criminal vs law abiding).

Well you know. The common arguement is that guns kill people, so I figured to cave in to the gun control folks we get rid of them like they want and the problem is solved.

Unfortunately cops qualify as people, so my apologies to the boys in blue. Hand them over fellas. ......we need peace and safety. Guns are too dangerous.

 

[Wirey]

I'd say your view is reasonable for Canuckistan. But the US is a different place,
ie, different cultures & far more guns. My proposal suits us more than it would you.

Actually, Canadians own about as many guns as Yanks. Hell, I own three. But our culture doesn't seem to accept using them as a problem solver. Yours does. Canadians get even with each other by making fun, or drinking your beer while you're at work. It seems like every American movie, TV show, and even cartoon always solves the problem in the show by shooting someone. The real world just doesn't work that way.

 

[Revoltingest]

Actually, Canadians own about as many guns as Yanks. Hell, I own three. But our culture doesn't seem to accept using them as a problem solver. Yours does. Canadians get even with each other by making fun, or drinking your beer while you're at work. It seems like every American movie, TV show, and even cartoon always solves the problem in the show by shooting someone. The real world just doesn't work that way.

There's no doubt that Americastan's cultural difficulties are the lion's share of the problem.
But dang near no one wants to give up violent movies, violent songs, violent video games,
violent TV shows, or A Prairie Home Companion.....the sources of our woe.

The face of evil has a face for radio....

 

[4consideration]

Actually, Canadians own about as many guns as Yanks. Hell, I own three. But our culture doesn't seem to accept using them as a problem solver. Yours does. Canadians get even with each other by making fun, or drinking your beer while you're at work. It seems like every American movie, TV show, and even cartoon always solves the problem in the show by shooting someone. The real world just doesn't work that way.

Wirey, do you really believe that the American people actually think and behave the way they are portrayed in movies and TV? They can't even get a New Orleans accent right, and there are a lot to choose from -- but none of them are the southern drawl you often see.

What is reflected by the TV shows and movies is the perspective and attitudes of a close circle of Entertainment industry people, not the American people as a whole. And -- most of the world consumes at least some of what comes out the Amercian Entertainment industry, so if watching it makes it so -- welcome to the club.

 

[Revoltingest]

Wirey, do you really believe that the American people actually think and behave the way they are portrayed in movies and TV? They can't even get a New Orleans accent right, and there are a lot to choose from -- but none of them are the southern drawl you often see.
What is reflected by the TV shows and movies is the perspective and attitudes of a close circle of Entertainment industry people, not the American people as a whole. And -- most of the world consumes at least some of what comes out the Amercian Entertainment industry, so if watching it makes it so -- welcome to the club.

Hey, since you'd know.....what do you think of the HBO show, Treme?
(It's take on violence is interesting.)

 

[4consideration]

Hey, since you'd know.....what do you think of the HBO show, Treme?
(It's take on violence is interesting.)

I only saw a small snipet. Didn't really watch much of it, so I can't comment. (It ticks me off to see movies show people from N.O. speaks that way, so I either complain the whole time and point out all the errors -- or I give everyone a break and change the channel.)

 

[Revoltingest]

I only saw a small snipet. Didn't really watch much of it, so I can't comment. (It ticks me off to see movies show people from N.O. speaks that way, so I either complain the whole time and point out all the errors -- or I give everyone a break and change the channel.)

Since Treme was created by The Wire guys (Simon & Overmyer), I'd expect greater attention to realistic detail.
So I have an assignment for you......watch it......all episodes....from the beginning.
It's different from the Wire, but shares multiple story lines from different points of view.
I like it. Your Nawleans background requires that you comment.
The way the cops relate to the citizens is of greatest relevance to this thread.