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Appeal of the Latin Mass

pearl

Well-Known Member
Most significant were conversations with three prominent Indigenous spiritual leaders who grew up Catholic but now focused on traditional Indigenous ways. All three elders expressed frustration with various church teachings and anger at the abuses at residential schools. Two were no longer Catholic and wanted nothing to do with the church, and the one who was still Catholic also spoke highly of the inculturated Native American liturgy. But all expressed nostalgia for the Latin Mass. One even described a deep congruence between Indigenous ceremonies and the traditional Latin liturgy.

This feeling became clearer to me as I learned about Indigenous ceremonies. Praying all night at a Native American church ceremony or all week at a sun dance took me out of my preconceived notions and allowed me to surrender to this ceremonial way of knowing. The absolute focus on the actions of the ceremony, the rich detail, and layer upon layer of meaning opened up another world that absorbed and redefined this world.

I have seen the similarities between Indigenous ceremonies and Catholic Mass, but I was surprised to meet any Native practitioners who did as well. Most fascinating was one Indigenous elder’s opinion that Latin resonates with the holistic character of the Indigenous languages. That is, our everyday English language is not up to the task of conveying deep spiritual truths. Older languages, unsullied by our mechanized, digitized way of life, can.

Unquestionably, there are differences in the purpose and sacrifice asked of participants in ceremonies such as the sun dance and Latin Mass, but there is a similar way of engaging the spirits and engaging God. The witness of Nicholas Black Elk, who is now being promoted for sainthood, draws this out. Black Elk, one of the most important figures in Native American cultural revitalization during the 20th century, sang his grandchildren to sleep with Latin hymns from the high Mass. “I understand why Black Elk loved Latin so much,” Mr. Twance shared with me. “It has a connection to traditional Native chant."
Don’t get the appeal of the Latin Mass? Look to an Indigenous sun dance | America Magazine
 

exchemist

Veteran Member
Most significant were conversations with three prominent Indigenous spiritual leaders who grew up Catholic but now focused on traditional Indigenous ways. All three elders expressed frustration with various church teachings and anger at the abuses at residential schools. Two were no longer Catholic and wanted nothing to do with the church, and the one who was still Catholic also spoke highly of the inculturated Native American liturgy. But all expressed nostalgia for the Latin Mass. One even described a deep congruence between Indigenous ceremonies and the traditional Latin liturgy.

This feeling became clearer to me as I learned about Indigenous ceremonies. Praying all night at a Native American church ceremony or all week at a sun dance took me out of my preconceived notions and allowed me to surrender to this ceremonial way of knowing. The absolute focus on the actions of the ceremony, the rich detail, and layer upon layer of meaning opened up another world that absorbed and redefined this world.

I have seen the similarities between Indigenous ceremonies and Catholic Mass, but I was surprised to meet any Native practitioners who did as well. Most fascinating was one Indigenous elder’s opinion that Latin resonates with the holistic character of the Indigenous languages. That is, our everyday English language is not up to the task of conveying deep spiritual truths. Older languages, unsullied by our mechanized, digitized way of life, can.

Unquestionably, there are differences in the purpose and sacrifice asked of participants in ceremonies such as the sun dance and Latin Mass, but there is a similar way of engaging the spirits and engaging God. The witness of Nicholas Black Elk, who is now being promoted for sainthood, draws this out. Black Elk, one of the most important figures in Native American cultural revitalization during the 20th century, sang his grandchildren to sleep with Latin hymns from the high Mass. “I understand why Black Elk loved Latin so much,” Mr. Twance shared with me. “It has a connection to traditional Native chant."
Don’t get the appeal of the Latin Mass? Look to an Indigenous sun dance | America Magazine
I'm not convinced this is anything specific to Latin or the Tridentine Mass. What it seems to me this recognises is the value of ritual and ceremony in creating an atmosphere of prayer, meditation and holiness. This is something the Catholic and Orthodox churches have always recognised, as have many other religions. Music can also generate, or contribute to, the same atmosphere. It's a performance and, as with any performance, its intention is to move and transport the audience in some way.

At the Reformation there was a tendency to see all this kind of thing as an unbiblical accretion, mumbo jumbo etc and it was stripped away, thereby depriving worship of a lot of its magic (intentionally.) The same rationalist mindset is at work in even the Catholic church today, though some of the recent efforts to reintroduce music and so on seem to realise, dimly, what has been lost.
 

pearl

Well-Known Member
The same rationalist mindset is at work in even the Catholic church today, though some of the recent efforts to reintroduce music and so on seem to realise,

It seems that the attempt to restore the early liturgy of the Church was/is misunderstood as taking away from, instead of any appreciation of its long history. There is a very interesting book, written before Vat II, which compares the ancient history of the liturgy, 2nd/3rd century, to the elements of the Latin Mass. 'The Early Liturgy'.

At the Reformation there was a tendency to see all this kind of thing as an unbiblical accretion, mumbo jumbo etc and it was stripped away, thereby depriving worship of a lot of its magic (intentionally.)

I think, unfortunately, what some experience is a loss of Mystery in the vernacular. As for the music, we've had this discussion before, even though it 'hurts' hour ears, those in the pew also want to raise their voices in this Mystery of the Mass.

"The Church has been singing since the time of Jesus and the apostles, for they sang in the synagogue and brought that singing into the Church."
From Thomas Aquinas, 'vocal worship is necessary, not for God's sake, but for the sake of the worshiper.' "Vatican II was well advised only to indicate very general standards: music must "accord with the spirit of the liturgical action", it must be "suitable", or be capable of being "made suitable, for sacred use", it must accord with the dignity of the temple" and "truly contribute to the edification of the faithful." In discussing musical tradition from the 'great treasury of European church music', the 'treasury of sacred music is to be preserved and cultivated with great care..'
excerpt from 'Feast of Faith', Ratzinger
 

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
I've been involved in drumming with Ojibwe on a fair number of occasions, plus I've attended mass at a NA Catholic Church in Brimley, Michigan on Lake Superior: Blessed Kateri Tekakwitha Church. I don't see any direct connection, but both do allow for contemplative meditation. The speed of the mass is purposely slow to allow for this, and this is also what one does in NA chanting.

BTW, note that I am a Me'tis with three of my four grandparents being as such, but I was not brought up within "the tradition of the elders". As an anthropologist, I've spent gobs of time on reservations in Michigan and out West, especially Wyoming and Montana. I'll be on two this summer here in Michigan: one in Brimley [Ojibwe] and the other near Battle Creek [Potawatomi].

Got any [Indian] fry bread with some cinnamon sugar? :) To die for-- literally in my case since I'm a diabetic.:emojconfused:
 

pearl

Well-Known Member
And the struggle continues. Pope Francis seems really becoming 'pissed'.

"I underline again that liturgical life, and the study of it, must lead to greater ecclesial unity, not to division,'' the pope told the institute's participants. "When liturgical life is a bit of a banner for division, there is the odor of the devil being inside there, the deceiver.''

"It's not possible to render worship to God and at the same time make a battleground of liturgy for questions that aren't essential,'' Francis added.
Pope decries divisions caused by old-school liturgy fans (msn.com)
 
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