Another malicious, outrageous lie

[Shadow Wolf]

The medical community is always honest and sincere. Just unsubstantiated rumors thats all.

Hospital Price Gouging in the Age of COVID

Pay no heed to those gawd awful lies.

And, of course, many healthcare providers, including myself and my own providers, have committed insurance fraud so a patient can get what they need because insurance wouldn't have covered the needed services otherwise. For myself, I was given a few different whacky diagnoses so insurance would cover my hormones. For one of my clients, I just lied by omission and was exactly entirely truthful with what I did with this client so I could assist him with activities in daily living as I was supposed to, but because of insurance idiocy and bureaucratic nonsense I wasn't supposed to directly assist with "certain" activities in daily living.
So there is definitely a side of insurance fraud that isn't malicious and done with the intention to cheat patients and the system. It's imposed on us by a stingy system that sometimes imposes burdens that are impossible to clear by normal means (I helped a diabetic client cheat to get better treatment when insurance told him he had to do stuff that he couldn't afford but they wouldn't cover).

 

[Mr Spinkles]

Maybe Trump was just inaccurate rather than malicious, confusing doctors with hospitals. I presume hospitals pay their physician’s salaries, though...

Trump said COVID patients are being over-counted. Is there credible evidence that is true?

We all know Trump would say it, whether true or not.

Hospitals get paid to treat patients. They get paid more to treat more costly / less desirable patients. The more patients they treat, the more they get paid. This is not unique to COVID. Welcome to American healthcare.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

I have seen any statistics tracking covid cases to Trump rallies as super-spreaders. I am sure if this were the case the media would be blasting such news.

First: if a packed, largely maskless rally of thousands chanting in close proximity doesn’t help spread the virus ... what does? The President himself literally got infected and had an outbreak at the White House from exactly this type of event - but smaller.

If this kind of event isn’t helping to spread a contagious respiratory virus ... how is it spreading?

Second: the media is, in fact, all over it. According to one study, 18 Trump rallies have lead to 30,000 additional infections and 700 deaths.

Many of the people who died were not attendees ... they are people infected by people who attended.

This is unnecessary. It’s keeping our economy shut down more than it has to be. It’s inexcusable. I thought conservatives believed in personal responsibility - this is highly irresponsible.

COVID kills many times more Americans each day than drunk driving. What do you call it when someone drives drunk and gets someone else killed? That’s what is happening at these super-spreader rallies.

Source: Trump campaign rallies led to more than 30,000 coronavirus cases, Stanford researchers say

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I have seen any statistics tracking covid cases to Trump rallies as super-spreaders. I am sure if this were the case the media would be blasting such news.

I've seen them blasting spring breakers, college partiers, beach goers, and other large and reckless gatherings. Even Sean Hannity said to young people who generally aren't hit as bad and who aren't caring "wear a mask for grandma."

 

[Shadow Wolf]

COVID kills many times more Americans each day than drunk driving. What do you call it when someone drives drunk and gets someone else killed? That’s what is happening at these super-spreader rallies.

Let's not be modest. It's killed half as many as tobacco. That is no easy feat. It has soared far above the death toll of alcohol, and that stuff is strictly regulated. People talk about the dangers of drugs, well, in America Covid has killed more than all of them except tobacco. And it may exceed that number as well.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

Let's not be modest. It's killed half as many as tobacco. That is no easy feat. It has soared far above the death toll of alcohol, and that stuff is strictly regulated. People talk about the dangers of drugs, well, in America Covid has killed more than all of them except tobacco. And it may exceed that number as well.

Thanks.
Doesn't it kill more per day than tobacco though?

COVID is killing 1,000-2,000 Americans per day. I thought that exceeds any cause of death except heart disease and cancer. It greatly exceeds all accidental causes of death combined. Drunk driving kills 30 per day last I checked.

By the way: it’s incredible that we are even having this conversation, SEVEN MONTHS into this, because some people need convincing that Trump’s rallies are irresponsible. Words fail me.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Thanks.
Doesn't it kill more per day than tobacco though?

Some days not quite but close.
And heart disease and cancer are still way out ahead.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Maybe Trump was just inaccurate rather than malicious, confusing doctors with hospitals. I presume hospitals pay their physician’s salaries, though...

People twisting themselves into tortuous rhetorical knots in a pathetic attempt to excuse a fascistic President is one of many shameful characteristics of this vile presidency and this consequential election.

Addressing this rot is likely to be a difficult and long lasting challenge. We failed after the Civil War, and there is no guarantee that we'll do better moving forward, but perhaps Trump and friends are what we need to internalize the importance of that effort.

 

[Revoltingest]

How is price gouging possible if our free market healthcare system is the best in the world?

It is very far from a free market, except in a few areas
where it works well, eg, concierge health care.
Why Not Try Free Market Health Care?
Our system is hampered by government regulation, tax policy,
medical culture, tort law, lack of price competition, reliance
upon employer provision, etc.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

It is very far from a free market, except in a few areas
where it works well, eg, concierge health care.
Why Not Try Free Market Health Care?
Our system is hampered by government regulation, tax policy,
medical culture, tort law, lack of price competition, reliance
upon employer provision, etc.

Bingo - it is not a free market, yet tries to act like one. As a percentage of total spending on healthcare, the US is more private and less public than almost every other comparable nation.

We thus get all the shortcomings of a market failure and not all the benefits.

Free markets work best when you have informed consumers making rational choices. Take buying a TV, for example. You don't lose consciousness and wake up with with a new TV and a giant bill weeks later. There's no moral and legal obligation that if someone stumbles into a TV store in desperate need of some comedy programming, the store has to provide it. My employer, insurer, medical provider, and I don't get into a four-way battle-royale every time I need a new TV to figure out (a) what is the bill and (b) who pays which portions of it. The cashier at the store doesn't look at you like you are insane if you demand to know what what the price is before you buy a TV. If you decide to purchase a TV at a different store, the first store doesn't have to rush you there by ambulance or helicopter.

See the differences?

Our system is complex and burdensome because we have tried to jam a square healthcare peg, into a round free-market hole. Other countries have been a lot more free-thinking about this, and with better results.

I am a big fan of the free market 90% of the time. Just not 100% of the time.

 

[ecco]

"Our doctors get more money if someone dies from COVID. You know that, right?" Trump asserted in front of a crowd in Waterford Township, Michigan, according to Bloomberg. He claimed doctors are paid "like $2,000 more" for deaths from the coronavirus.

There's probably a few doctors in Walter Reed thinking:\

Dang, If Ida known that I could get an extra two grand if he died...​

 

[InChrist]

People twisting themselves into tortuous rhetorical knots in a pathetic attempt to excuse a fascistic President is one of many shameful characteristics of this vile presidency and this consequential election.

Addressing this rot is likely to be a difficult and long lasting challenge. We failed after the Civil War, and there is no guarantee that we'll do better moving forward, but perhaps Trump and friends are what we need to internalize the importance of that effort.

While I find it disappointing and sad, I’m not surprised to see a haughty response from you since your posts usually appear to lean heavily on the progressive side. I really find it concerning that so many fall in line with the rallying cry of the globalist minded media, Democrats and multi- national/international corporate voices calling Trump a fascist, when the opposite is actually the case. Donald Trump is a lot of things, some which are very negative, but he’ s no fascist, nor a globalist and that is the number one reason for the constant hate being stirred up and targeting toward him. He’s not following the plan, he rocks the boat and stands up for individual FREEDOM.


“It is not unreasonable to observe that, in general, when you scratch a progressive you uncover a fascist underneath, and this discovery is in no way discredited by the fact that said progressive will be calling you a fascist.

Covid, as has been seen everywhere, is an intensely authoritarian phenomenon. The first measures introduced by governments practically everywhere were directed not at protecting pubic health but awarding powers to themselves to restrict and coerce their citizens and impose draconian penalties for breaches or dissent. This kind of thing suits leftists just fine and dandy. Not only do they enjoy seeing the boots of the regime on the face of fellow citizens, but they themselves seem to enjoy, like masochists under the whip of the master, the lick of leather on their own hides.”


The Ideological Stripe of Covid-19 - Frontpagemag

 

[InChrist]

I've seen them blasting spring breakers, college partiers, beach goers, and other large and reckless gatherings. Even Sean Hannity said to young people who generally aren't hit as bad and who aren't caring "wear a mask for grandma."

Haven’t seen much in the way of massive protests or politically correct crowds being called out. Last spring when college kids were being condemned for going to the beaches, there was huge gay gathering of thousands at a festival in Miami, were they shamed as virus spreaders? How about Al Sharpton’s 50,000 rally in D.C.? Or what about violent rioters screaming right in the faces of police officers in many major cities, who have to just stand there and stand down? As tragic as George Floyd’s death was, how come he got three huge funerals, but everyone else had to limit or forgo funerals for their loved ones? Why are Jews targeted in NY for their gatherings by Governor Cuomo and Mayor de Blasio threatening to shut down their synagogues, but huge crowds of Muslims gathered to commemorate Saddam Hussein? I didn’t hear anything about those crowds spreading the virus or threats about shutting down mosques. No Democrat or leftist would dare point their finger at an LGBQT crowd or threaten a Muslin gathering or to close mosques. Yet, shame on Jews gathering for prayer or Christians attending church or citizens going to Trump rallies.

The way much of the media reports and leftists or Democrats rant about Trump rallies, church or synagogues as virus spreaders, but are silent on massive protest crowds or in your face violent rioting mobs, or any politically correct woke gatherings you would think the covid virus is quite discriminating in choosing which crowds to spread through. I won’t even get into the essential and non-essential businesses the virus seems to be able to distinguish between, according to so many governors, except to say it sure appears to me it’s more about hypocritical, politically motivated doublethink going on than actual consistent, science based concern about the virus spreading.


Anti-Semitic Democrats Blame Orthodox Jews for the Coronavirus - Frontpagemag



I wear a mask when I go to town, but as a grandma, I don’t want anyone wearing a mask for me. I not going to live in fear and I want to see the smiles of my grandkids.

 

[InChrist]

First: if a packed, largely maskless rally of thousands chanting in close proximity doesn’t help spread the virus ... what does? The President himself literally got infected and had an outbreak at the White House from exactly this type of event - but smaller.

If this kind of event isn’t helping to spread a contagious respiratory virus ... how is it spreading?

Second: the media is, in fact, all over it. According to one study, 18 Trump rallies have lead to 30,000 additional infections and 700 deaths.

Many of the people who died were not attendees ... they are people infected by people who attended.

This is unnecessary. It’s keeping our economy shut down more than it has to be. It’s inexcusable. I thought conservatives believed in personal responsibility - this is highly irresponsible.

COVID kills many times more Americans each day than drunk driving. What do you call it when someone drives drunk and gets someone else killed? That’s what is happening at these super-spreader rallies.

Source: Trump campaign rallies led to more than 30,000 coronavirus cases, Stanford researchers say

First: if a packed, largely maskless rally of thousands chanting in close proximity doesn’t help spread the virus ... what does? The President himself literally got infected and had an outbreak at the White House from exactly this type of event - but smaller.

If this kind of event isn’t helping to spread a contagious respiratory virus ... how is it spreading?

Second: the media is, in fact, all over it. According to one study, 18 Trump rallies have lead to 30,000 additional infections and 700 deaths.

Many of the people who died were not attendees ... they are people infected by people who attended.

This is unnecessary. It’s keeping our economy shut down more than it has to be. It’s inexcusable. I thought conservatives believed in personal responsibility - this is highly irresponsible.

COVID kills many times more Americans each day than drunk driving. What do you call it when someone drives drunk and gets someone else killed? That’s what is happening at these super-spreader rallies.

Source: Trump campaign rallies led to more than 30,000 coronavirus cases, Stanford researchers say

I have seen that same Stanford study being broadcast by every major news outlet, but not sure if it’s peer reviewed or how accurate it is. As far as I can tell, that’s the only study. It would be informative if there had been a study or studies done on how much all the huge protest gatherings and mob riots over the past several months have contributed to spreading the virus.
You would think with the thousands upon thousands that have been going to Trump rallies the numbers would be much higher.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

I have seen any statistics tracking covid cases to Trump rallies as super-spreaders. I am sure if this were the case the media would be blasting such news.

They have been communicated over here, I heard it late last night on the radio.
Give me 5, I'll see if I can find a written source...

 

[InChrist]

They have been communicated over here, I heard it late last night on the radio.
Give me 5, I'll see if I can find a written source...

Okay

 

[lewisnotmiller]

I have seen any statistics tracking covid cases to Trump rallies as super-spreaders. I am sure if this were the case the media would be blasting such news.

Same Stanford study, so I won't bother posting any links.
One of the issues with getting a more definitive picture is that there is very limited contract tracing being conducted. So whilst they can track whether numbers have increased in the areas in which rallies have been held, it is correlation, rather than causation.

Personally, I'd be more concerned about the seeming limited contract tracing being conducted (which I imagine is not only due to Federal decisions, but also state decisions), but to be honest with your infection rates where they currently are at, it almost doesn't matter.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I don’t want anyone wearing a mask for me.

Too bad.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

Donald Trump is a lot of things, some which are very negative, but he’ s no fascist

Then why does he act like one? Exhibit Lafayette Square, where he ordered security forces to brutally crush peaceful protestors in violation of their First Amendment rights. (Because he insists Black lives do not matter, no less.)

Just to pick one example.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

This kind of thing suits leftists just fine and dandy. Not only do they enjoy seeing the boots of the regime on the face of fellow citizens, but they themselves seem to enjoy, like masochists under the whip of the master, the lick of leather on their own hides.”

Holy mixed metaphors, Batman!

Let’s see, in that one sentence we’ve got boots on a face, masochists under a whip ... but also slaves under a master ... and “the lick of leather on their own hides”.

This has all the hallmarks of coming from an alt-right pseudo intellectual website ... like seals clapping for fish, the right runs like dogs to their master’s call, oblivious as pigs going to slaughter. See how mixed metaphors make it seem like I said something?

Kidding aside ... I don’t think anyone enjoys lockdowns and school closures. Some of us think that if y’all would just wear a ***-damn MASK, at a minimum, and maybe occupy every OTHER chair at Trump’s super-spreader rallies, then we might be able to open businesses and schools sooner.