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According to the bible, God is the source of all evil and suffering
- Thread starter Imagist
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Jeremy Mason
Well-Known Member
Heartfelt
Member
God didn't create evil...it came in allowing free will...God didn't want a bunch of robots...He Hopes for our love and devotion but He doesn't force it on us.
Evil came when ONE angel thought too much of itself and decided to become it's own sort of god.
It's not that God is punishing His people...he tests their devotion to prove to them what they can or can't overcome then is standing by with the answers should we be wise enough to ask. God's timing is everything in life...He began in creating the whole picture we only see bits of...He knows how and who will do what.
Jeremy Mason
Well-Known Member
I agree with just about everything you've said. God does not create evil, but he very well might punish those who are in need of correction.
Heartfelt
Member
Jeremy Mason
Well-Known Member
Yes He does...and if in doubt just try Him out right?
LOL!!! Yes, cause and effect is live an well.
Imagist
Worshipper of Athe.
God is the source of all evil and suffering.........My God, if only I had $20. 00 for everytime I've heard this same argument, I would be rich........
There are very few new things under the sun. For example, it's nothing new to me that you don't actually have a response.
Imagist
Worshipper of Athe.
It's not truly free will if you are punished for all eternity for not doing what he wants.
Imagist
Worshipper of Athe.
Seems to me that if I was omnipotent, I would just make them so they don't need correction.
Jeremy Mason
Well-Known Member
Wow! You thought real hard about that one...
But God didn't want soulless robots. He decided that our decision to love Him was what He was after and His Son showed us the value of our decisions.
Tell me, are you going to get a mail order bride or are you going to look for a bride that thoroughly knows you an says, "I want to grow old with you."?
I like these thoughts of Saint Augustine and the definition of evil as the lack of good
CHAPTER IV. The Problem of Evil
12. All of nature, therefore, is good, since the Creator of all nature is supremely good. But nature is not supremely and immutably good as is the Creator of it. Thus the good in created things can be diminished and augmented. For good to be diminished is evil; still, however much it is diminished, something must remain of its original nature as long as it exists at all. For no matter what kind or however insignificant a thing may be, the good which is its "nature" cannot be destroyed without the thing itself being destroyed. There is good reason, therefore, to praise an uncorrupted thing, and if it were indeed an incorruptible thing which could not be destroyed, it would doubtless be all the more worthy of praise. When, however, a thing is corrupted, its corruption is an evil because it is, by just so much, a privation of the good. Where there is no privation of the good, there is no evil. Where there is evil, there is a corresponding diminution of the good. As long, then, as a thing is being corrupted, there is good in it of which it is being deprived; and in this process, if something of its being remains that cannot be further corrupted, this will then be an incorruptible entity [natura incorruptibilis], and to this great good it will have come through the process of corruption. But even if the corruption is not arrested, it still does not cease having some good of which it cannot be further deprived. If, however, the corruption comes to be total and entire, there is no good left either, because it is no longer an entity at all. Wherefore corruption cannot consume the good without also consuming the thing itself. Every actual entity [natura] is therefore good; a greater good if it cannot be corrupted, a lesser good if it can be. Yet only the foolish and unknowing can deny that it is still good even when corrupted. Whenever a thing is consumed by corruption, not even the corruption remains, for it is nothing in itself, having no subsistent being in which to exist.
http://www.ccel.org/ccel/augustine/enchiridion.chapter4.html
CHAPTER IV. The Problem of Evil
12. All of nature, therefore, is good, since the Creator of all nature is supremely good. But nature is not supremely and immutably good as is the Creator of it. Thus the good in created things can be diminished and augmented. For good to be diminished is evil; still, however much it is diminished, something must remain of its original nature as long as it exists at all. For no matter what kind or however insignificant a thing may be, the good which is its "nature" cannot be destroyed without the thing itself being destroyed. There is good reason, therefore, to praise an uncorrupted thing, and if it were indeed an incorruptible thing which could not be destroyed, it would doubtless be all the more worthy of praise. When, however, a thing is corrupted, its corruption is an evil because it is, by just so much, a privation of the good. Where there is no privation of the good, there is no evil. Where there is evil, there is a corresponding diminution of the good. As long, then, as a thing is being corrupted, there is good in it of which it is being deprived; and in this process, if something of its being remains that cannot be further corrupted, this will then be an incorruptible entity [natura incorruptibilis], and to this great good it will have come through the process of corruption. But even if the corruption is not arrested, it still does not cease having some good of which it cannot be further deprived. If, however, the corruption comes to be total and entire, there is no good left either, because it is no longer an entity at all. Wherefore corruption cannot consume the good without also consuming the thing itself. Every actual entity [natura] is therefore good; a greater good if it cannot be corrupted, a lesser good if it can be. Yet only the foolish and unknowing can deny that it is still good even when corrupted. Whenever a thing is consumed by corruption, not even the corruption remains, for it is nothing in itself, having no subsistent being in which to exist.
http://www.ccel.org/ccel/augustine/enchiridion.chapter4.html
Imagist
Worshipper of Athe.
AK4
Well-Known Member
You know its funny that the law of the universe is cause and effect. Science proves this. God made it so man could figure this out as further proof of His existence.
God caused the big bang because He is THE Creator, so if God caused the big bang and then we end up to the present time and there is evil in the world, well that was part of the effect.
God admits in His Word He uses evil---but its for the purpose of good. When you understand what the outcome will be you will understand why this world/mankind was created subject to vanity.
God caused the big bang because He is THE Creator, so if God caused the big bang and then we end up to the present time and there is evil in the world, well that was part of the effect.
God admits in His Word He uses evil---but its for the purpose of good. When you understand what the outcome will be you will understand why this world/mankind was created subject to vanity.
wanda jane
Member
Christianity, Judaism and Islam are brought to an end as the true
identity of Jesus becomes part of man's positive knowledge. Man's
release from guilt is a source of new energy for him. Whatever man has achieved hitherto is in spite of Christianity, Judaism and Islam and in a struggle against guilt.
Man has opened '2000 A.D.' with a stock of strength he acquired all by himself in that process along with the new energy he is about to acquire from true Gnänamphenomenal knowledge. Christianity, Judaism and Islam will disappear from the collective memory of the race. But the memory of these will continue to cause shudder to the great as pseudo religions responsible for the most frightful epoch of history."
identity of Jesus becomes part of man's positive knowledge. Man's
release from guilt is a source of new energy for him. Whatever man has achieved hitherto is in spite of Christianity, Judaism and Islam and in a struggle against guilt.
Man has opened '2000 A.D.' with a stock of strength he acquired all by himself in that process along with the new energy he is about to acquire from true Gnänamphenomenal knowledge. Christianity, Judaism and Islam will disappear from the collective memory of the race. But the memory of these will continue to cause shudder to the great as pseudo religions responsible for the most frightful epoch of history."
wanda jane
Member
That jesus is Lucifer is the reality. This reality is sought to be undermined by the contrary claims of jesus and his so-called church that jesus is god or perfection of goodness. It is then necessary, even wholesome, to underline the reality by demonstrating it a fact.
It is uncontested that Lucifer is the fallen rebel archangel and devil supreme. He is further defined, uncontestedly again, as one who affects to be a god after having lost that status. According to yet another christian tradition, Lucifer is the father of lies.
All these various definitions converge on jesus and jesus alone, either in his historical manifestation in that title or in his neo­classical form as found prominently in the so-called old testament.
The clinching evidence concerning jesus identity is apprehended in the episode of the assassination of Abel. (See below.) From incontestable internal evidence in the bible itself, we demonstrate, firstly, that Cain is not the assassin, secondly, that the so-called jehovah is the one that committed the crime in reality, and lastly that jesus is the same being as this jehovah by virtue of the fact that he is privy to the exact site of the deed of assassination, a secret known only to jehovah.
Moreover, jesus utters a lie while pattering on the site in the so-called new testament. This lie while palpable is still rebellious. This demonstrates him, more than everything else, as the identical being as Lucifer.
It is uncontested that Lucifer is the fallen rebel archangel and devil supreme. He is further defined, uncontestedly again, as one who affects to be a god after having lost that status. According to yet another christian tradition, Lucifer is the father of lies.
All these various definitions converge on jesus and jesus alone, either in his historical manifestation in that title or in his neo­classical form as found prominently in the so-called old testament.
The clinching evidence concerning jesus identity is apprehended in the episode of the assassination of Abel. (See below.) From incontestable internal evidence in the bible itself, we demonstrate, firstly, that Cain is not the assassin, secondly, that the so-called jehovah is the one that committed the crime in reality, and lastly that jesus is the same being as this jehovah by virtue of the fact that he is privy to the exact site of the deed of assassination, a secret known only to jehovah.
Moreover, jesus utters a lie while pattering on the site in the so-called new testament. This lie while palpable is still rebellious. This demonstrates him, more than everything else, as the identical being as Lucifer.
AK4
Well-Known Member
Maybe by people you hang around or blinded to find the truth in scriptures but Lucifer is a hoax!
Wanda Jane, This is what Gnosticism teaches and it has not made any inroads, so your prediction that all Abrahmic religion are going to be brought to an end it is laughable, The whole of the OT and NT identifies Jehovah as the only true living God, a triune God, Jesus is identified in the NT as the word incarnated, God tabernacled on earth, His perfect image. From the story of Abel and Cain we clearly understand that it was Cains envy that let him to murder his brother, yes it was an internal impulse, that was the consequence of his progenitors Adam and Eve treason, their disobedience, and rejection of God hierarchical assignments. God looked more favourably to Abels offering is what is stated in the story, this discussion is on what the Bible says. What scriptures are you using to support your claim that Jesus/Jehovah is Lucifer? The Abel and Cain story is a crap shot and I think you know it, so try to do better.