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According to the bible, God is the source of all evil and suffering

Imagist

Worshipper of Athe.
God created the heavens and the earth, in the process creating evil (or allowing it to be created).

He then allowed this evil to infect humans, then punished these humans for doing the obvious thing.

He let off the first murderer with a slap on the wrist.

After a few generations, he all but wiped out humanity with a flood for doing stuff he didn't like (seems like a toddler with too much power).

He then wiped out two whole cities with fire for doing things that he didn't like.

Then, after promising a guy that he would choose his descendants as his people, he allowed this people to be enslaved.

After a few years, he freed these people, but not without inflicting many plagues on their captors (whose hearts he hardened so that they wouldn't be able to free the people willingly).

After forcing his people to walk around the desert for forty years, he ordered them to commit genocide in Canaan.

(to be continued, suddenly something came up)
 

Riverwolf

Amateur Rambler / Proud Ergi
Premium Member
I think there's a connection to this and the story of Prometheus and Pandora from Greek mythology. The God of the Torah does seem very childish to me. But I think that's on the part of the writers, who were writing from their own perspectives. (If you believe the documentary hypothesis).

The argument is that man is free to do either good or evil because when Adam disobeyed God and ate from the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil, he learned then about evil and good, and became like God, without immortality. So the fault is entirely on man using this argument. Of course, why did God plant the tree there, anyway? "As a test." But if they(Adam and Eve) didn't know what good or evil was, how would they even conceive disobeying God? So I feel that it wasn't a test at all, but rather the same situation of Pandora, who was created with infinite curiosity, and Zeus gave her a box and instructed her never to open it. Out of the curiosity she was born with, she peaked inside and released evil into the world.

I really don't think the Torah is a good window into the supernatural, and unless one is Jewish, shouldn't be used for understanding what God is, unless the readings of it aren't literal.
 

zenzero

Its only a Label
Friend Imagist,
Thats a good preface as you have the readers attention already.
Surely the main story will be equally riveting.
Love & rgds
 

gnostic

The Lost One
If God is real and he does exist, then ultimately he is responsible.

After all, he created this world, if you actually believe in the scriptures; he created man and he created Satan. He also planted the fruit trees in the vegetable garden. So he is responsible for his own creation.

If he didn't create evil, then what does this verse mean?

Isaiah 45:7 (KJV) said:
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.
 

emiliano

Well-Known Member
If he didn't create evil, then what does this verse mean?
Isa 45:7 forming the light and creating darkness; making peace and creating evil. I Jehovah do all these things.

I missed count of how many times this mutilated out of context verse have been presented to say that God creates evil, evil is defined as something no good, harmful, and what this is saying is that God is raising a powerful King, King Cyrus that will executed correction/punishment on the oppressors of God’s chosen people the Israelites.
“So says Jehovah to His anointed, to Cyrus, whose right hand I have made strong in order to humble nations before him” This is not an Israelite, but he will execute punishment on all the powerful nations, that oppressed the Israelites
For Jacob My servant's sake, and Israel My elect, I have even entitled you. I have named you, though you have not known me.
 

Heneni

Miss Independent
I always thought humans were responsible for all evil and suffering. God didnt give us an earth full of war and hunger and depravity and debouchery. That was all our doing.

Heneni
 

Jeremy Mason

Well-Known Member
suddenly something came up

YouTube - Men At Work - Who Can It Be Now (1981) :shrug:

18367---grim-reeper_476x357.jpg
 

emiliano

Well-Known Member
I always thought humans were responsible for all evil and suffering. God didnt give us an earth full of war and hunger and depravity and debouchery. That was all our doing.

Heneni
No, or at least not to us Christians, we get the answer from the bible in Eph 6:12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the world's rulers, of the darkness of this age, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
And this is where the wise counsel “love the sinner, hate the sin” comes from.
 

gnostic

The Lost One
emiliano said:
I missed count of how many times this mutilated out of context verse have been presented to say that God creates evil, evil is defined as something no good, harmful, and what this is saying is that God is raising a powerful King, King Cyrus that will executed correction/punishment on the oppressors of God’s chosen people the Israelites.

Just as Christians deliberately mutilated context of their scriptures.

They frequently say that the serpent is Satan.

And then there is quote that say the Son of Morning in Isaiah, through Jerome's translation that this Morning Star to Lucifer, which Christians adamantly linked Lucifer to Satan. The proper context is that the morning star is a prophecy linked to the current king of Babylon, and that the morning star fall is directly proportional to the king of Babylon's fall, not Lucifer, and certain not Satan...unless you think Satan is mortal king.

Christians and Muslims are famous for twisting words to suit themselves in what they believe, rendering the original context of passages meaningless.
 

emiliano

Well-Known Member
Just as Christians deliberately mutilated context of their scriptures.

They frequently say that the serpent is Satan.

And then there is quote that say the Son of Morning in Isaiah, through Jerome's translation that this Morning Star to Lucifer, which Christians adamantly linked Lucifer to Satan. The proper context is that the morning star is a prophecy linked to the current king of Babylon, and that the morning star fall is directly proportional to the king of Babylon's fall, not Lucifer, and certain not Satan...unless you think Satan is mortal king.

Christians and Muslims are famous for twisting words to suit themselves in what they believe, rendering the original context of passages meaningless.

I even heard it as saying that this refers to Adam, as he was brought to the ground and weaken the nations, made us all mortals by his sins, which was to wish to be like God, in essence what he said is “I will go up above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the Most High” anyway knowing this is not what saves us, repentance and change is what saves. This is what creates the different denominations (interpretations), but these are not the source of our Salvation either, it only God’s merciful Grace that allows us to change and be saved.
 

AK4

Well-Known Member
I even heard it as saying that this refers to Adam, as he was brought to the ground and weaken the nations, made us all mortals by his sins, which was to wish to be like God, in essence what he said is “I will go up above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the Most High” anyway knowing this is not what saves us, repentance and change is what saves. This is what creates the different denominations (interpretations), but these are not the source of our Salvation either, it only God’s merciful Grace that allows us to change and be saved.


How can you say that knowing this is not important? When people know they can maybe stop doing the opposite of what Job did which was not saying that what God is doing is wrong

[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Job 1 Read This Chapter[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]1:22 In all this, Job did not sin by charging God with wrongdoing. [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Isnt that what most of mankind is doing? They charge God with wrongdoing because"...It is an experience of EVIL God has given to the sons of humanity to HUMBLE them by it" (Ecc. 1:13, Concordant Old Testament Version).[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]And since they dont understand Gods plan and that He is the source of everything, they charge Him with the way He is running His plan as wrong.[/FONT]
 

Charity

Let's go racing boys !
God is the source of all evil and suffering.........My God, if only I had $20. 00 for everytime I've heard this same argument, I would be rich........:rolleyes: Of course the Bible does say there is nothing new under the sun...and this thread confirms that :sarcastic
 

AK4

Well-Known Member
God is the source of all evil and suffering.........My God, if only I had $20. 00 for everytime I've heard this same argument, I would be rich........:rolleyes: Of course the Bible does say there is nothing new under the sun...and this thread confirms that :sarcastic

God is the source of all good and blessings also.....but really did you have to comment on this thread if you are sooooo tired of seeing the same thing under the sun? Let me guess you are also tired of seeing all the other threads too. Do i need to put down a list?
Anyway i will just say this---why respond to a thread you are tired of seeing the same subject on? Why?---(i really dont want an answer just responding to your post)
 

Katzpur

Not your average Mormon
Anyway i will just say this---why respond to a thread you are tired of seeing the same subject on? Why?---(i really dont want an answer just responding to your post)
And I will just say this... Why ask a question if you really don't want an answer?
 

Jeremy Mason

Well-Known Member
God is the source of all good and blessings also.....but really did you have to comment on this thread if you are sooooo tired of seeing the same thing under the sun? Let me guess you are also tired of seeing all the other threads too. Do i need to put down a list?
Anyway i will just say this---why respond to a thread you are tired of seeing the same subject on? Why?---(i really dont want an answer just responding to your post)

Go hassle Ben.
 

emiliano

Well-Known Member
How can you say that knowing this is not important? When people know they can maybe stop doing the opposite of what Job did which was not saying that what God is doing is wrong

[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Job 1 Read This Chapter[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]1:22 In all this, Job did not sin by charging God with wrongdoing. [/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Isnt that what most of mankind is doing? They charge God with wrongdoing because"...It is an experience of EVIL God has given to the sons of humanity to HUMBLE them by it" (Ecc. 1:13, Concordant Old Testament Version).[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]And since they dont understand Gods plan and that He is the source of everything, they charge Him with the way He is running His plan as wrong.[/FONT]

Even if one attain the right interpretation of this scripture, but does not repent and change from unbelief to belief one remains a reprobated, when God have mercy on us, on that day and at that precise time we will be drawn to the Saviour, this is the only way Joh 6:37 All that the Father gives Me shall come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will in no way cast out.
Joh 6:44 No one can come to Me unless the Father who has sent Me draw him, and I will raise him up at the last day.
It is pretty clear to me that we are not saved by what we know, but by Grace trough faith, it is pointless to show the truth to those that God does not draws to the Lord, you won‘t turn them around, only God does that. He knows the heart of all mankind. What damage do you think that their accusations causes to almighty God?
 
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