About a deity full of love and compassion

[Skeptisch]

I'm sorry, I have to say: I think that's a strange question, coming from a pantheist.

The OP wonders about a loving and compassionate God. The scientific pantheist’s god is nothing more than the laws of nature. So you are right when you find it a strange question, coming from a pantheist. It was obviously done with a healthy dose of sarcasm.

Scientific pantheism is called scientific not because science endorses pantheism but because scientific pantheism adopts a scientific approach to reality. It denies the existence of a supernatural god and is considered by many “souped up atheism”.

 

[Thief]

OK, it might have had a lot of effect on what form life takes, but isn't God doing the magic poofing anyway?
[/color]
Then how is he loving?

It's not 'poofing'.....

And death always was part of the scheme of things.
THEN, the spiritual life.

All you gotta do is step up to it.(when the hour arrives)

 

[Gharib]

With the earthquake and tsunami in Japan in mind, how can anyone believe that s/he exists? What more evidence do we need before we start using a little critical thinking on the whole notion of a lovable God? Or maybe the Japanese people have not prayed enough, or maybe not to the right God?

i hope the link below answers your question:

Mercy and Wisdoms Behind the Disasters and the Calamities

 

[Beta]

If God is loving, God is at fault if He does nothing

But God IS doing something !!!
He is telling man - has told man - to keep His Commandments from the beginning to the end.
We are now at the end and reaping the consequences of 'disobedience'.
There is nothing complicated about God - He means what He says.
It's OUR CHOICE not to do - why blame God ? Man must learn to take responsibility for his own actions and decisions.
To please ourselves is to die - to please God is to live ! :yes:

 

[atanu]

The whole complexion of this discussion might change if death was seen as freeing a bird from its cage.

(ducks to avoid rotten tomatoes).

Just saying.

 

[cottage]

But God IS doing something !!!
He is telling man - has told man - to keep His Commandments from the beginning to the end.
We are now at the end and reaping the consequences of 'disobedience'.
There is nothing complicated about God - He means what He says.
It's OUR CHOICE not to do - why blame God ? Man must learn to take responsibility for his own actions and decisions.
To please ourselves is to die - to please God is to live ! :yes:

What you say is perfectly intelligible, providing it is accepted that such a God cannot be loving and compassionate.

The second point to be made is that, if there is a God, whatever we are we are the work of God. Humans are finite, imperfect, contingent creatures, and as such cannot fail to fall into error and make mistakes and misjudgements, for that is the way we were made. But, if it is the case that we were not made that way by God then it is the case that we've successfully challenged God's will and thus undermined his so-called omnipotence.

But the fact of matter is that of course we take responsibility for our actions and decisions, and it make no sense under from any understanding, theist or sceptic, to speak of 'blaming God'. It would be a contradiction for a theist to believe in God and yet to condemn him, and it is absurd to speak of an unbeliever blaming the very thing he or she believes not to exist!

 

[Skeptisch]

i hope the link below answers your question:
Mercy and Wisdoms Behind the Disasters and the Calamities

Your link above attempts to explain that all troubles and calamities; briefly anything seeming outwardly unfavourable and evil are actually favourable and pleasing.


But how about this stuff from the Bible?

1. "I will destroy ... both man and beast."
   God is angry. He decides to destroy all humans, beasts, creeping things, fowls, and "all flesh wherein there is breath of life." He plans to drown them all. 6:7, 17
2. "Every living substance that I have made will I destroy."
   God repeats his intention to kill "every living substance ... from off the face of the earth." But why does God kill all the innocent animals? What had they done to deserve his wrath? It seems God never gets his fill of tormenting animals. 7:4

Or the Quran?

1. Allah says that you must keep fighting until there is no more persecution and everyone on earth is a Muslim. Then you can stop killing people. 2:193a

2. But if there are any wrong-doers around after you've killed off all the disbelievers, persecutors and aggressors, then you'll have to kill them too. 2:193b

 

[Willamena]

The whole complexion of this discussion might change if death was seen as freeing a bird from its cage.

(ducks to avoid rotten tomatoes).

Just saying.

No, you're right.

 

[Willamena]

The OP wonders about a loving and compassionate God...

The scientific pantheist’s god is nothing more than the laws of nature...

Just so.*



*sans sarcasm

 

[Koldo]

I agree with that.

But have you heard the starfish story? I see it online a lot, and apparently it was inspired by Loren Eiseley.
Source for this particular version:
A Single Starfish by Loren Eisley - From All Creatures Animal Stories, love, compassion, hearts, souls, spirits, funny, happy, sad, relationships, people, animals, animal rights, Jewish, Christian, Lord, God, Jesus, Christ, Holy Spirit, cruelty free,

One day an old man was walking along the beach. It was low tide, and the sand was littered with thousands of stranded starfish that the water had carried in and then left behind. The man began walking very carefully so as not to step on any of the beautiful creatures. Since the animals still seemed to be alive, he considered picking some of them up and putting them back in the water, where they could resume their lives.

The man knew the starfish would die if left on the beach's dry sand but he reasoned that he could not possibly help them all, so he chose to do nothing and continued walking.

Soon afterward, the man came upon a small child on the beach who was frantically throwing one starfish after another back into the sea. The old man stopped and asked the child, "What are you doing?"
"I'm saving the starfish," the child replied.
"Why waste your time?... There are so many you can't save them all so what does is matter?" argued the man.

Without hesitation, the child picked up another starfish and tossed the starfish back into the water... "It matters to this one," the child explained.



In other words, while each life may be unimportant on the cosmic scale, it has very real significance to that being. Suffering is very real and terrible for the individual that undergoes it, regardless of whether it has any scale at all compared to the age of the universe. Each person in Japan who was seriously affected by the earthquake is suffering right now, and each of them matter.

Really nice story. I will take note of it.

 

[Autodidact]

After the last big Tsunami, NPR had a minister, an imam and a rabbi on to try to answer this question. I don't remember what the minister said, possibly something about punishment for evil. The imam said he was confident we would find out the answer in the next life. The rabbi said he had no idea. I loved the rabbi.

 

[Koldo]

And the god of love is reflected in the compassion of the atheist.

It's not about one life being unimportant in a cosmic scale, it's about an eternal love trumping worldly misery. If this unimportant life was to be filled with misery and suffering by the turning of the wheel of fortune, it would not cause me to hate on god. Heck, the foundations of "my Gwynnies" as religious insight were forged in the fires of five solid months of a ridiculous toothache...

But I'm biased. I have been to the threshold of eternity; not only have I talked the talk, I've walked the walk. It is a measure of my compassion that others who claim to speak of "a god of love" may have walked a similar path.

And what do I know of starfish? Could be like those turtles, crawl up on the beach to lay their eggs; tossing them back into the sea could actually be breaking the cycle of life.

You have said so many words , and you have said nothing at all, at the same time. Empty words they are.

 

[Autodidact]

Once again, I'll point out that there is one hypothesis that always fits all the data--there is no God.

 

[Koldo]

But God IS doing something !!!
He is telling man - has told man - to keep His Commandments from the beginning to the end.
We are now at the end and reaping the consequences of 'disobedience'.
There is nothing complicated about God - He means what He says.
It's OUR CHOICE not to do - why blame God ? Man must learn to take responsibility for his own actions and decisions.
To please ourselves is to die - to please God is to live ! :yes:

God is clearly not doing enough then.
God never asked me to keep his commandments... not that i remember at least.

 

[Caladan]

After the last big Tsunami, NPR had a minister, an imam and a rabbi on to try to answer this question. I don't remember what the minister said, possibly something about punishment for evil. The imam said he was confident we would find out the answer in the next life. The rabbi said he had no idea. I loved the rabbi.

Oh I love this one too.
none of that the lord moves in mysterious ways nonsense.
the rabbi said it like is it. 'I have no idea, I am not a geophysicist and I have no seismographs'

Once again, I'll point out that there is one hypothesis that always fits all the data--there is no God.

This is the safest bet. by far. at all times.
It means only you, yourself. will be held accountable for your education or lack of education. for your desire to analyze current events, or to pretend they do not exist.

 

[Skeptisch]

Each person in Japan who was seriously affected by the earthquake is suffering right now, and each of them matter.

Are you sure you are an atheist? :sarcastic

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

At some point the forces at play will peak....in tight locations.
That humans happen to be living too close is God's fault?

Hypothetical scenario:

You have a toddler. You know that he can't swim.

You see him get up and walk to the back door. You do nothing.

You see him wander over to the edge of your pool. You do nothing.

You watch him lose his balance and fall in. You do nothing.

You watch him try in vain to stay afloat. You do nothing.

You watch as his head falls below the level of the water. You do nothing.

You continue to watch as his body stops moving. You still do nothing.

Is it your fault that your child died?

I think He knew....from the beginning.... that being mortal....is fatal.

Put life into a churning mix of forces and people will die.

But without the chaotic upheavals the mix of chemistry won't happen.
Life won't take hold.
To keep it going...the storms must continue.
That includes turbulence of air, water, and earth.

And I'm sure you had really good reasons for putting in the pool, too. Does it matter?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

The whole complexion of this discussion might change if death was seen as freeing a bird from its cage.

(ducks to avoid rotten tomatoes).

Just saying.

That doesn't get rid of the problem; it just turns it on its head. If the truly charitable thing is to slaughter everyone, then why does God continue the "agony" of our lives?

 

[Caladan]

Hypothetical scenario:

You have a toddler. You know that he can't swim.

You see him get up and walk to the back door. You do nothing.

You see him wander over to the edge of your pool. You do nothing.

You watch him lose his balance and fall in. You do nothing.

You watch him try in vain to stay afloat. You do nothing.

You watch as his head falls below the level of the water. You do nothing.

You continue to watch as his body stops moving. You still do nothing.

Is it your fault that your child died?

You know, that in various historical Spartan nations this would be a normal day to day reality.
interestingly such cultures are idolized by the modern film industry.
I have witnessed such cultures and people still in existence today.
it might sound strange to the ears of a modern man. but I have only admiration for them.
their children can and do survive everything. I am sure our Americans soldiers have seen such people by routine.

 

[Willamena]

Once again, I'll point out that there is one hypothesis that always fits all the data--there is no God.

Depending on which data you're looking at, it's also the case that the "hypothesis" 'it cannot be said that there neither is nor isn't a God' fits.