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7-year-old transgender child closes down Girl Scout troops
- Thread starter Skwim
- Start date
opcorn:
Skwim
Veteran Member
Thank you.
In this case, it seems that he (or she) is mentally & socially a girl.
So I figger that it's best for all that if he's going to join the scouts, it ought'a be the girl scouts.
Makes sense to me....although I'll admit it's a bit odd.
Kilgore Trout
Misanthropic Humanist
Yeah, I still don't get the strong feelings about it though.
Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
Not a good analogy, but I think you know that. Now - if Girl Scouts were limited to people espousing a certain religion, that would be a legitimate concern.
Too much bickering.
Skwim
Veteran Member
Because they can empathize with his predicament. It's like empathizing with the paraplegic kid who wants to join a Little League Softball team but is rejected because he can't run bases, and the league won't allow pinch runners off home plate.
And in this case it's more than simply dressing like a girl. He identifies as a girl.
It's a very good analogy. Just as that sort of comment would be exclusionary toward Buddhists, your comments are exclusionary to the transgendered.
Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
If you're not going to explain why you don't agree, I guess it is.
Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
You know what - I am so sick of this topic and this thread that if you want to think you won this particular point, that is absolutely fine by me.
CONGRATS!!! :tribal:
I don't even see much real disagreement twixt yooz.
I understand the concerns you raised.
Right or wrong, they exist & should be recognized.
This poor thread has been beaten to a bloody pulp.
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Kilgore Trout
Misanthropic Humanist
Well, I can identify as a black person all I want, but I'm not going to be getting any minority-based scholarships. Nor should I.
It seems like you're coming to this discussion with certain preconceptions about gender and transgenderism that aren't universally shared. I don't share them, anyhow.
Kilgore Trout
Misanthropic Humanist
I don't see what this has to do with people not accepting my identity as a black person.
dawny0826
Mother Heathen
"Colorado-based Girl Scouts troop's decision to admit a 7-year-old transgender child this fall has prompted three leaders to resign and dissolve their troops.One of those cut of your nose to spite your face things. Oh, wait. there is a good reason. It's an "'almost dangerous situation' for children."
As The Christian Post is reporting, all three of the troop leaders were affiliated with the Northlake Christian School in Covington, Louisiana.
Susan Bryant-Snure, one of the leaders who resigned, told The Baptist Press that the Girl Scouts' action is "extremely confusing" and an "almost dangerous situation" for children. "This goes against what we [Northlake Christian School] believe," said Bryant-Snure, who has three daughters among the 25 girls who had been active scouts there.
The controversy began when Felisha Archuleta protested against a Denver troop's decision to not initially allow her transgender daughter, Bobby Montoya, to join the group. "I believe he was born in the wrong body," Archuleta, who also confessed to having difficulty switching from male to female pronouns when discussing her child, told ABC. "But the Girl Scout leader told us he can't join because he has 'boy parts.'... But no one would know he's a boy unless they pulled his pants down."
The Girl Scouts of Colorado subsequently released a statement through the Gay and Lesbian Alliance Against Defamation (GLAAD) in support of Archuleta and her excluded daughter, noting, "If a child identifies as a girl and the child's family presents her as a girl, Girl Scouts of Colorado welcomes her as a Girl Scout."
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This may not be as big of a deal as it looks. According to the statement released by the Girl Scouts, they seem to be open to transgender children. I think perhaps there needs to be an educational effort on their part to ensure that their troop leaders understand their stance.
Change takes time. I see two positives here. For one, you have a child that looks quite happy and healthy, with a supportive parent. The child is able to express and explore, without being opressed by the parental unit(s). Two, athough on a local level, the Girl Scouts didn't allow for the child to participate, the Girl Scouts are certainly not taking a negate stance against transgender children.
There seems to be openness. This doesn't seem too negative to me.
Skwim
Veteran Member
When it comes down to the personal level---Is there a way for the transgendered child to participate in the organization, and the answer is, no.---then there's a problem. Just as in this case, if the local chapter of an organization doesn't want to comply with the organization's rules and disbands because of it, then it does become a negative, and not only for the transgendered child, but all the others who want to participate.
I think the position the Colorado Council took is commendable and hope it is taken up by all the other councils, but that isn't enough. The local troops also have to be on board to make it meaningful.
dawny0826
Mother Heathen
How do you know that this is the end of it? If the organization takes a stance, then the organization should assume responsibility for following through to ensure that its Chapters follow through and parents who feel strongly enough for their children to take part in such an organization should push, if they want their children to be part of such an organization.
It's really not that awful of a deal. You can't expect change to happen overnight. Those born with penises haven't, historically, participated in girl scouts. You can't expect EVERYONE to embrace change overnight. Right or wrong.
Inclusivity is good. I'm all for it. But, realism is also important.
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber
Historically the girl scouts maybe, but historically there have been legions of those born as men who have participated in female activities, and vice versa. There were even at least two people who had vaginas but they fought as men during the Civil War for the Confederate army. Actually one of them was not only fighting on the front lines, but was also a land owner and was legally married to a woman.
Not everyone will accept change overnight, but change must happen for it to eventually be accepted.
But what I find interesting about this story is the Boy Scouts get in the news for openly excluding others, and the Girl Scouts make the news for openly including others, with people on each side saying either group is right or wrong for being inclusive or exclusive. Our society is still very divided but some progress is better than none.
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Skwim
Veteran Member
Well, three of the troops, whose leaders disagreed with the Colorado Council, disbanded.dawny0826 said:
Tell that to Bobby Montoya and the others whose troop was disbanded. I'm betting you'd find many of them think it's an awful deal.
Perhaps it won't. Perhaps their are other scoot leaders who would rather disband their troop rather than admit a transgendered child. But we can hope these will be few and the others will understand and embrace the inclusion.