“The Son is equal to his Father”

[Sargonski]

Irrelevant with the thread, but isn't he the same John who supposedly said he needs to be baptized by Jesus, he is not worthy even to untie the straps of his sandals, who bore witness to the spirit descending like a dove and heard God's voice proclaiming Jesus as his beloved son?
Even if he was expecting a warrior son of God, he had experienced enough evidence.

I missed that the first time .. right .. How come John is not aware of Jesus being selected by God ? .. did he not see the spirit descending upon Jesus .. hear the voice booming from the clouds ? -- and it was John who states that Jesus is the chosen one previously predicted.

Sketchy for sure.

There is similar sketchness around Paul's vision .. 3 different accounts .. One account they hear the voice .. another account they hear nothing. .. and so on.

Just like Paul is not made equal to Jesus by the visitation .. Jesus is not made equal to the father by such visitation .. one which John can't seem to remember .. ?!

 

[Kenny]

This is just all wrong .. but kudo's for the attempt .. "Jesus a second Adam" if true would interesting but not in the context you are thinking - and way above pay grade at this point .. lacking knowledge of the the standard creation myth motif's of the day for proper perspective on what one is actually saying ... when equating Jesus to the Primordial Adam.. but when said and done we need not worry because ...

When people use words such as “lacking knowledge” and “above pay grade” - it is an automatic loss of authority on your side.

In the original story - Jesus is not co-eternal - nor in the revised edition with inclusion of "other stories" - nor in the revised edition with the inclusion of "more stories" .. thus making up what are known as The Synoptic Gospels.

supportive documentation

In the original story - Jesus is a Man of 30 - fully human - no one knows of any God-Spark in this middle aged adult .. .. except perhaps John the Baptist having some premonition of things to come. This is what the early first century Christian has to go on.

Disagree. Mary knew and John the Baptist knew as well as Elizabeth.

Then - as is totally commonplace in religious mind of everyone .. gentile and Jew - God Adopts a human .. gives him the God-spark but, What God ? Who is and what is the name of this God.. of this Son who is a Priest forever in the Order of Melchi-Zedek.

So .. who is the God of this Order that has adopted a human .. in the same motif as Sargon - Moses - David - Abraham - and lest we forget Emperor Cyrus .. the last annointed one of God prior to Jesus. That is what every 1st century Jew is thinking .. and every first century Gentile with a little knowledge of the Jewish religion .. as they did .. in great detail .. cause that is what folks focused on .. the stories in their collective consciousness were different than your stories friend .. but it is no there story we must focus .. and not yours.

At the baptism of Jesus the sky opens up and --
he saw heaven being torn open and the Spirit descending on him like a dove. 11 And a voice came from heaven: “You are my Son, whom I love; with you I am well pleased.”

12 At once the Spirit sent him out into the wilderness, 13 and he was in the wilderness forty days, being tempted[g] by Satan

OK -- clear as day .. a spirit of an un-named God comes down -- a voice from heaven tells Jesus is now the adopted Son of God. .. this is where the "Adoptionists" get there fodder .. and it is hard to say otherwise .. as is totally the Perspective of a First Century person .. just as written.

So this spirit .. then has Jesus first go through the traditional Ritual .. prior to having the God Spark be actualized. The "King making Ritual " of the Pharaoh was dangerous but after which the Pharaoh was part God.

During this ritual .. Jesus is confronted by the Adversary - A son of God who's job Title is to test humans .. this entity having some heavy duty God Powers - and is Chief God over the Earth ..

Who does the early Christian think this God is ? The Father of this son of God who has the job Title The Adversary .. and who's Job it is to test humans.. reporting to The Supreme one who has been naughty and who has been nice ?

Jesus passes the Trial with flying colors - goes out into the world as a Healer .. keeping his God-spark a secret except to a select few at first..

Nowhere this far into the story .. nor anywhere else .. is it suggested that Jesus was pre-existent with the father. .. nor that he was part God due to some kind ofd immaculate conception or coupling of God with Woman as in the early days of Genesis. Jesus is not the Son of God in a genetic perespective like these other Gods .. either the offspring of God with God .. .. or God with Human . Jesus is a man .. fully human .. who has been adopted by God .. thus the title "Son of Man" but one who has been ordained by God .. the Messiah .. this is the language used during the baptismal scene .. Jesus a messiah .. ordained by God in the way of Cyrus

It is in the Second Edition where we have the Divinity of Jesus moving from born of man the normal way .. to Immaculate conception .. God messing around in there somewhere .. but this addition to the original story does not come until ~ 80 Ad. .. and who knows how long this takes to get into general circulation .. an accepted addition to the story .. as this is quite the theological change of perspective.

but no one has this perspective prior to ~80 - having only the original story to go on .. the writings of Paul of very little help on the matter .. saying almost nothing about the life of Jesus .. and no Judeo Christian is listening to anything Paul says at this point anyway.

"Co-Equal" - Elevating the divinity of Jesus yet a step further - to pre-existence with God .. does not come along until John .. 100-120 AD - this a completely different Gospel .. with inclusion of a very different perspective .. heavily influenced by Platonic / Helenistic Philosophical ideas .. being used to describe the nature of Christ's divinity .. his "God-Spark" that was growing .. as the years go by. Sorry friends .. this Gospel was not written by John the Disciple who as tradition holds .. was martyred with the others long ago but, it does Greek religious ideas and terminology with the average person will be familiar .. increasing the appeal of this new religioun to the average person .. speaking in language and terms with which they were familiar.

but this is as much as a century after these events happened .. and 60 years of revisons later to the original story .. that the divinity of Jesus is elevated to pre-existant status .. but not yet elevated to "Co-Equal" status no no no.. This takes another 200 years for the divinity of Jesus to be elevated that high .. higher than Lord Satan .. higher than Lord YHWH.

Impressive what time and the dogma of man can do with the Divinity of a God.

In the beginning was The Word, the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

John 1:1 Timothy 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

Apparently your position is wrong.

 

[Sargonski]

When people use words such as “lacking knowledge” and “above pay grade” - it is an automatic loss of authority on your side.


supportive documentation


Disagree. Mary knew and John the Baptist knew as well as Elizabeth.


In the beginning was The Word, the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

John 1:1 Timothy 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

Apparently your position is wrong.

Good grief this is blistering nonsense followed by claiming "your position is wrong" without stating a single thing that was wrong .. I agree that John preaches pre-existence .. why are you claiming my position is the reverse ?

then you ask for supportive documentation of the synoptics .. please google synoptic Gospels .. and then tell us which part you want supported ?

John should have known .. which is why he should not be asking if Jesus is the Messiah - the annointed one of God. Little paradox a diddle for ya there friend ..

Jesus is not Pre-Existent in the Synoptic Gospels .. John is not part of the Synoptic Gospels .. in the original story Jesus is not divine at birth .. nor immaculately conceived .. but made divine as a man of 30 .. when a God .. whose hame you have yet to figure out adopts him.. When Jesus becomes the "annointed one of God"

Jesus is just a regular man in the original story .. as in not yet divine .. it is at his BAptism that Jesus Is adopted by a God .. recieves the divine spark .. but not fully initiated until the completion of testing .. which was conducted by a different Son of God .. one much more powerful than Jesus .. Chief God over the Earth .. and impressive Godly Skills .. hurling fire from the sky .. that kind of thing.

Jesus passes the test with flying colors .. but he is a lover not a fighter .. uses his skills for healing and helping .. until later when he becomes a fighter .. but then is made a human sacrifice .. a martyr and scapegoat for the sins of the world. If the soul of Jesus was around up in heaven prior to coming down to earth .. . and he was among the divinities .. he drew the short straw now didn't he.

 

[Kenny]

Good grief this is blistering nonsense followed by claiming

Again, you further slide down in authority when your approach is above.

"your position is wrong" without stating a single thing that was wrong .. I agree that John preaches pre-existence .. why are you claiming my position is the reverse ?

then you ask for supportive documentation of the synoptics .. please google synoptic Gospels .. and then tell us which part you want supported ?

John should have known .. which is why he should not be asking if Jesus is the Messiah - the annointed one of God. Little paradox a diddle for ya there friend ..

Jesus is not Pre-Existent in the Synoptic Gospels .. John is not part of the Synoptic Gospels friend .. in the original story Jesus is not divine at birth .. nor immaculately conceived .. but made divine as a man of 30 .. when a God .. whose hame you have yet to figure out adopts him.. When Jesus becomes the "annointed one of God"

The question is, why do you need the pre-existence of The Word in the Synoptic Gospels?

Jesus is just a regular man in the original story .. as in not yet divine ..

True… he came as a regular man.. no disputing that truth

\ it is at his BAptism that Jesus Is adopted by a God .. recieves the divine spark .. but not fully initiated until the completion of testing .. which was conducted by a different Son of God .. one much more powerful than Jesus .. Chief God over the Earth .. and impressive Godly Skills .. hurling fire from the sky .. that kind of thing.

Again, true in that as a man, He needed the Holy Spirit.

Jesus passes the test with flying colors .. but he is a lover not a fighter .. uses his skills for healing and helping .. until later when he becomes a fighter .. but then is made a human sacrifice .. a martyr and scapegoat for the sins of the world.

True again..

If the soul of Jesus was around up in heaven prior to coming down to earth .. . and he was among the divinities .. he drew the short straw now didn't he.

Makes no sense at all.

 

[Sargonski]

Again, you further slide down in authority when your approach is above.


The question is, why do you need the pre-existence of The Word in the Synoptic Gospels?


True… he came as a regular man.. no disputing that truth


Again, true in that as a man, He needed the Holy Spirit.


True again..


Makes no sense at all.

Thats not the question at all ? Just a statement of fact that it isn't there- folks prior to John 100-120 AD - did not and had no scriptural reason to believe in pre-existence - let that mean what you will ...

You wish to claim pre-existence ... how then does a soul existing in heaven with God.. prior to comming to earth .. make no sense at all in the context of .. pre -existence .. would that somehow not be an example of pre-existence ? What is it that makes no sense ?

 

[Kenny]

Thats not the question at all ? Just a statement of fact that it isn't there- folks prior to John 100-120 AD - did not and had no scriptural reason to believe in pre-existence - let that mean what you will ...

Not really… Paul mentioned it way before John did in Colossians and Philippians.

You wish to claim pre-existence ... how then does a soul existing in heaven with God.. prior to comming to earth .. make no sense at all in the context of .. pre -existence .. would that somehow not be an example of pre-existence ? What is it that makes no sense ?

I don’t claim it… the Bible speaks of it.

You speak as if The Word is a soul and not God Himself which isn’t the position I hold.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

.............................................In the beginning was The Word, the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

John 1:1 Timothy 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
Apparently your position is wrong.

Yes, the King James has No letter 'a' before the word God.
However, the King James does insert the letter 'a' at Acts 28:6 B
the same Greek grammar rule applies in both verses.
Yes, and the mystery of 1st Timothy 3:16 is answered at John 1:14 ...only begotten Son....
Son means from a Father. The Father had 'No beginning' as per Psalm 90:2
The Son had a beginning because pre-human Jesus was "IN" the beginning, Not before any beginning as God was.
The 'he' at Phillippians 2:7 is Jesus who emptied himself....... God did Not empty Himself.
Dead Jesus, Not dead God, was made alive in the 'spirit ' 1st Peter 3:18.
Jesus did Not resurrect himself - Acts 3:15
God resurrected dead Jesus back to his original pre-human heavenly spirit body which was received up in glory.
Only a spirit-body person could appear before spirit angels - 1st Peter 3:19-20 - the angels that disobeyed in Noah's Day.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

.......................................................................................................................................................................................
You wish to claim pre-existence ... how then does a soul existing in heaven with God.. prior to comming to earth .. make no sense at all in the context of .. pre -existence .. would that somehow not be an example of pre-existence ? What is it that makes no sense ?

God sent pre-human heavenly Jesus to Earth for us. Jesus did Not send himself, his God sent him.
Even the resurrected ascended-to-heaven Jesus still thinks he has a God over him - Revelation 3:12
God is a Spirit Person. Angels are spirit persons. Adam, like us, was Not a spirit person but physical.
Jesus existed in Heaven as a spirit person and God resurrected dead Jesus back to his pre-human spirit person.
That is why Jesus used different materialized bodies in order to appear to his followers after his resurrection.- Luke 24:15-16

 

[Kenny]

.............................................In the beginning was The Word, the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Yes, the King James has No letter 'a' before the word God.
However, the King James does insert the letter 'a' at Acts 28:6 B

Sentence construction and the word is different “Logos” vs “Theon"

the same Greek grammar rule applies in both verses.

no.

Yes, and the mystery of 1st Timothy 3:16 is answered at John 1:14 ...only begotten Son....

there are many mysteries: Rom 16:25; 1 Cor 6:7; Eph 1:9; Eph 3:4; Eph 5:32 and many more

Son means from a Father. The Father had 'No beginning' as per Psalm 90:2

The Word had no beginning. Heb 7:3

The Son had a beginning because pre-human Jesus was "IN" the beginning, Not before any beginning as God was.

You are confusing when The Word was the Word and when The Word became flesh

The 'he' at Phillippians 2:7 is Jesus who emptied himself....... God did Not empty Himself.

He emptied Himself of His attributes as God

Dead Jesus, Not dead God, was made alive in the 'spirit ' 1st Peter 3:18.

You are confusing when The Word was the Word and when The Word became flesh

Jesus did Not resurrect himself - Acts 3:15

And Rom 8:11 (Holy Spirit)

God resurrected dead Jesus back to his original pre-human heavenly spirit body which was received up in glory.

Yes… with the glory that He had as The Word and that He shared with the Father and the Holy Spirit.

Only a spirit-body person could appear before spirit angels - 1st Peter 3:19-20 - the angels that disobeyed in Noah's Day.

Relevance?

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Sentence construction and the word is different “Logos” vs “Theon"
no.
there are many mysteries: Rom 16:25; 1 Cor 6:7; Eph 1:9; Eph 3:4; Eph 5:32 and many more
The Word had no beginning. Heb 7:3
You are confusing when The Word was the Word and when The Word became flesh
He emptied Himself of His attributes as God
You are confusing when The Word was the Word and when The Word became flesh
And Rom 8:11 (Holy Spirit)
Yes… with the glory that He had as The Word and that He shared with the Father and the Holy Spirit.
Relevance?

Thank you for your reply.
I find at Hebrews 7:3 being in connection to Hebrews 7:1 Melchizedek.
Melchizedek was both King and High Priest.
There is No mention of Melchizedek's parents but we know he had parents.
There is mention of Jesus' parents both heavenly and earthly.
Thus, Jesus as Son of God (John 10:36) also remains a priest forever - Hebrews 7:3 B; Psalm 110:4 B.
At Psalm 110 we find two (2) LORD/Lord's mentioned (KJV)
The LORD in ALL Upper-Case letters is where the Tetragrammaton (YHWH) appears.
The Lord in some lower-case letters stands for Lord Jesus. No Tetragrammaton applied.
So, we are speaking about two (2) different LORD/Lords.
Yes, many mysteries/secrets but Not meant as to never be known - Romans 16:25 but now manifest/revealed - verse 26.
Yes, Romans 8:11 that God resurrected Jesus - Acts 2:24 - and we can be spiritually alive/aware- Eph. 2:1,5
* 1st Cor. 6:7 I find is about law suits (?) so perhaps a type error, or ______
* Ephesians 1:9-10 is about 'making known' the mystery/secret of God's will for Christ - back to Romans 16:25-26.
God's will that Jesus have a superior position in Jesus' name - Philippians 2:9-10
But Jesus is still at God's right hand - Acts 2:32-33 - his God - Revelation 3:12
* Ephesians 3:4-5 In past generations the secret mystery was Not known - Romans 11:25 and Romans 16:25-26
* Ephesians 5:31-32 Yes, the secret mystery is Great - Ephesians 3:3-6 - now people of the nations be included.

 

[YoursTrue]

When people use words such as “lacking knowledge” and “above pay grade” - it is an automatic loss of authority on your side.


supportive documentation


Disagree. Mary knew and John the Baptist knew as well as Elizabeth.


In the beginning was The Word, the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

John 1:1 Timothy 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

Apparently your position is wrong.

Really appreciate your response, Kenny.

 

[YoursTrue]

Thank you for your reply.
I find at Hebrews 7:3 being in connection to Hebrews 7:1 Melchizedek.
Melchizedek was both King and High Priest.
There is No mention of Melchizedek's parents but we know he had parents.
There is mention of Jesus' parents both heavenly and earthly.
Thus, Jesus as Son of God (John 10:36) also remains a priest forever - Hebrews 7:3 B; Psalm 110:4 B.
At Psalm 110 we find two (2) LORD/Lord's mentioned (KJV)
The LORD in ALL Upper-Case letters is where the Tetragrammaton (YHWH) appears.
The Lord in some lower-case letters stands for Lord Jesus. No Tetragrammaton applied.
So, we are speaking about two (2) different LORD/Lords.
Yes, many mysteries/secrets but Not meant as to never be known - Romans 16:25 but now manifest/revealed - verse 26.
Yes, Romans 8:11 that God resurrected Jesus - Acts 2:24 - and we can be spiritually alive/aware- Eph. 2:1,5
* 1st Cor. 6:7 I find is about law suits (?) so perhaps a type error, or ______
* Ephesians 1:9-10 is about 'making known' the mystery/secret of God's will for Christ - back to Romans 16:25-26.
God's will that Jesus have a superior position in Jesus' name - Philippians 2:9-10
But Jesus is still at God's right hand - Acts 2:32-33 - his God - Revelation 3:12
* Ephesians 3:4-5 In past generations the secret mystery was Not known - Romans 11:25 and Romans 16:25-26
* Ephesians 5:31-32 Yes, the secret mystery is Great - Ephesians 3:3-6 - now people of the nations be included.

It's an interesting subject about Melchizedek. Reading more about this, Genesis 14 further says:
"17After Abram returned from his victory over Kedorlaomer and all his allies, the king of Sodom went out to meet him in the valley of Shaveh (that is, the King’s Valley)."
(More about Abram...and much discussion of the kings at the time before this)
18And Melchizedek, the king of Salem and a priest of God Most High, brought Abram some bread and wine. 19Melchizedek blessed Abram with this blessing:
(So it seems clear to me that the Almighty God approved of Melchizedek, who said...)
“Blessed be Abram by God Most High, Creator of heaven and earth.
20And blessed be God Most High, who has defeated your enemies for you.”
Then Abram gave Melchizedek a tenth of all the goods he had recovered.
21The king of Sodom said to Abram, “Give back my people who were captured. But you may keep for yourself all the goods you have recovered.”

(My reaction -- wow. Thanks all for bringing this up, sometimes I (we) may have a tendency to skip over things... )

 

[Soapy]

Yes. The tetragrammon (the four Hebrew letters for the personal name of God) is recorded in the Bible thousands of times.

Does the very fact that there are people who don’t yet even know the difference between a NAME (personal identifier) and a TITLE (a indicator of STATUS and/or Position of authority) contribute hugely to misinformation in scriptures?

((It is, of course, the truth that many are frustrated when seeing the truth, but they still prefer to remain in ignorance in order to attempt to further their fallacious beliefs. I’m not going to mention Kenny nor Brian2 et al.))

Name (examples):

• Jesus, YHWH, Peter, Abraham, David, Helen, Mary, Elizabeth …
  • Note that ’LORD’ (where it is a substitute for ‘YHWH’) MUST ALWAYS BE in capitals and single quoted

Title (examples):

• God, Son, Father, Judge, Sir, Lord, Master, Lord (no quotes, capital ‘L’ only), Mother, Daughter, Monarch, Teacher, Preacher, Priest…

(P.s. I’m not informing you. I’m doing it for anyone else who may not yet be aware!!!!???)

 

[YoursTrue]

Does the very fact that there are people who don’t yet even know the difference between a NAME (personal identifier) and a TITLE (a indicator of STATUS and/or Position of authority).

((It is, of course, the truth that many are frustrated when seeing the truth, but they still prefer to remain in ignorance in order to attempt to further their fallacious beliefs. I’m not going to mention Kenny nor Brian2 et al.))

Name (examples):

• Jesus, YHWH, Peter, Abraham, David, Helen, Mary, Elizabeth …
  • Note that ’LORD’ (where it is a substitute for ‘YHWH’) MUST ALWAYS BE in capitals and single quoted

Title (examples):

• God, Son, Father, Judge, Sir, Lord, Master, Lord (no quotes, capital ‘L’ only), Mother, Daughter, Monarch, Teacher, Preacher, Priest…

(P.s. I’m not informing you. I’m doing it for anyone else who may not yet be aware!!!!???)

Allow me to say that one poster mentioned the difference in translation between LORD and Lord. Which can be very meaningful. Many readers would not know what it meant until someone explained it. Also, some newer versions of the Bible have both words written as Lord, not showing any difference.

 

[Soapy]

Allow me to say that one poster mentioned the difference in translation between LORD and Lord. Which can be very meaningful. Many readers would not know what it meant until someone explained it. Also, some newer versions of the Bible have both words written as Lord, not showing any difference.

All part of Satan’s malicious scheme. By giving the Christian leaders the idea that the name of the one true God must not be WRITTEN, let alone SPOKEN, the substitute name is given as a capitalised TITLE (‘LORD’) that would easily be depreciated to a false title of “Lord”. Over time, ignorance does the rest of the work for him, as you pointed out.

So Trinitarians try to claim that because God is called ‘LORD’, and Jesus is called ‘Lord’, the two MUST BE THE ONE GOD as we only have gave ‘Lord’…!!!! Brilliant trickery - Deceit wins over to the dark side all those who drink the drink of Spiritual death.

 

[Sargonski]

God sent pre-human heavenly Jesus to Earth for us. Jesus did Not send himself, his God sent him.
Even the resurrected ascended-to-heaven Jesus still thinks he has a God over him - Revelation 3:12
God is a Spirit Person. Angels are spirit persons. Adam, like us, was Not a spirit person but physical.
Jesus existed in Heaven as a spirit person and God resurrected dead Jesus back to his pre-human spirit person.
That is why Jesus used different materialized bodies in order to appear to his followers after his resurrection.- Luke 24:15-16

Sure .. a plausible explanation based on pre-existence .. and indeed Jesus always refers to God as someone other than himself but, what is the name of this God that we are to pray to "Hallowed be thy NAME"

and such language matters .. while may mean nothint to modern day Christian .. it meant something to first century Christians and it is their opinion that matters .. not that of a modern Christian. How did the Author expect this to be interpreted by the people of the Day.

in the original story - there is no appearances after death of Jesus in the Flesh.. the story ends with an empty Tomb .. the reader left to wonder what happened to the Body of Jesus .. the famous "Long Ending of Mark" -- the most universally accepted of Pious Fraud - but.. that is another story ..

Jesus is not equal to God .. pre-eminent or otherwise - that much is crystal clear right up to the end and famous last words of our Lord Jesus .. who now sittith at the right had of "The Father" .. as Judge, Jury and executioner .. "My God .. MY God .. Why have you forsaken me"

Please do not attempt to pull some kind of Trinity Iron out of that fire .. the attempt in of itself will disturb me - watching the twisted mental dynamics in play .. not that you were thinking of attempting .. but for any who may be reading and tempted .. especially with the inclusion of the night before .. Jesus begging his God (who's name we have yet to figure out) .. to "Take this Cup from My hand" .. but let not my will be done, but yours. = 2 Separate Wills = Two Separate beings .. who's will's are sometimes in conflict with each other .. but both made of the Same God Substance == both having at least a part of the All-spark .. each individually capable of actions ... conflicting at times .. but sometimes on the same page ... in which their will is one .. one purpose .. one goal.

The Name --- and what is in a Name ?

Thank you for your reply.
I find at Hebrews 7:3 being in connection to Hebrews 7:1 Melchizedek.
Melchizedek was both King and High Priest.
There is No mention of Melchizedek's parents but we know he had parents.
There is mention of Jesus' parents both heavenly and earthly.
Thus, Jesus as Son of God (John 10:36) also remains a priest forever - Hebrews 7:3 B; Psalm 110:4 B.
At Psalm 110 we find two (2) LORD/Lord's mentioned (KJV)
The LORD in ALL Upper-Case letters is where the Tetragrammaton (YHWH) appears.
The Lord in some lower-case letters stands for Lord Jesus. No Tetragrammaton applied.
So, we are speaking about two (2) different LORD/Lords.
Yes, many mysteries/secrets but Not meant as to never be known - Romans 16:25 but now manifest/revealed - verse 26.
Yes, Romans 8:11 that God resurrected Jesus - Acts 2:24 - and we can be spiritually alive/aware- Eph. 2:1,5
* 1st Cor. 6:7 I find is about law suits (?) so perhaps a type error, or ______
* Ephesians 1:9-10 is about 'making known' the mystery/secret of God's will for Christ - back to Romans 16:25-26.
God's will that Jesus have a superior position in Jesus' name - Philippians 2:9-10
But Jesus is still at God's right hand - Acts 2:32-33 - his God - Revelation 3:12
* Ephesians 3:4-5 In past generations the secret mystery was Not known - Romans 11:25 and Romans 16:25-26
* Ephesians 5:31-32 Yes, the secret mystery is Great - Ephesians 3:3-6 - now people of the nations be included.

Melchi-Zedek

It's an interesting subject about Melchizedek. Reading more about this, Genesis 14 further says:
"17After Abram returned from his victory over Kedorlaomer and all his allies, the king of Sodom went out to meet him in the valley of Shaveh (that is, the King’s Valley)."
(More about Abram...and much discussion of the kings at the time before this)
18And Melchizedek, the king of Salem and a priest of God Most High, brought Abram some bread and wine. 19Melchizedek blessed Abram with this blessing:
(So it seems clear to me that the Almighty God approved of Melchizedek, who said...)
“Blessed be Abram by God Most High, Creator of heaven and earth.
20And blessed be God Most High, who has defeated your enemies for you.”
Then Abram gave Melchizedek a tenth of all the goods he had recovered.
21The king of Sodom said to Abram, “Give back my people who were captured. But you may keep for yourself all the goods you have recovered.”

(My reaction -- wow. Thanks all for bringing this up, sometimes I (we) may have a tendency to skip over things... )

KK Melchi-Zedek -- whats in a Name ? and why are all the Kings of various walled cities .. named after either the Patron God of the City or some other High God. Asurbanipal -- forgive the spelling .. but Assur being the High God of the Assyrians .. Babylonian Kings would often take Enlil --- Sumerian High God .. Later Nebochadnezzar .. Nebo being the God in Question .

The Canaanite high God was "EL" -- same fellow as over in Babylon (Enlil, Ellil, EL) .. the fellow who would have been high God in Ur .. when Tarah Abrams Father lived there .. and by all current accounts is the God El Shaddai that Abe met up with. Abe's big innovation being not the beief in only one God .. as Abe believed in many.. as did the Israelites .. but the worship of only one.. and as such .. he Chose the Most High EL Elyon of the Sumerian Pantheon. and if you go read about Abram in the Encyclopedia Brittanica .. they will tell you that the God of the Patriarchs was "EL"

but .. Whats in a Name ? Zedek ? The Patron Twin God's of Jerusalem .. Justice and Righteousness be the twin Aeons .. and fitting as part of the Divine Council described in Psalm 82 .. where El is head .. having Justice and Righteousness on his right and left side at Council meetings.. such as the one described in Psalm 82 where all the "Sons of the Supreme one" are present and accounted for.

Melchi-Zedek is both king and high priest .. a Priest King .. as was common at that time .. a Priest of the Most High God .. which is worshiped in a ritual involving bread and wine .. the most high God Praised .. That God of course being EL .. the God with whom Jacob Struggled ... then changed his name to Isra-EL "one who struggles with the Supreme one EL"

and no .. one does not add the generic "God" to their name .. Isma-EL = the supreme God EL .. Jacob builds an alter after his encounter at Bethel - Bet-EL House of EL

KK .. YHWH himself tells us that he was not known by the name YHWH .. so the patriarchs did know any God by that name.. but .. a name was hugely important .. and the name they did know .. the "God of the Patriarchs" being one of his many epithets "Creator - Father - Supreme one - Most High" lived in a tent high the mountain .. That guy .. and that Guys name .. was EL .. the most high God not only in the Canaanite Pantheon .. but the Phonecian Pantheon .. the Amalekite Pantheon .. the Midianite Pantheon .. the babylonian-Assyrian Pantheon .. and everyone elses Pantheon .. as that is what everyone believe .. at the time

So the God of the Priesthood of Melchi-Zedek .. the name of this God .. is EL -- the most high Zedek being the Patron God of the Holy city and religious center .. Jerusalem .. City of Peace.

KK .. with me so far .. you have the City of Peace -- with the Twin Gods of Righteousness and Justice as Patron Gods.

800 years later .. when King David takes the city .. the name of the king is Adoni-Zedek --- the Order of Melchi-Zedek now at least 800 years old .. but, unfortunately .. it is not a levitical Priesthood .. not from the line of Aaron .. brother of Moses who led the people to the worship of the Golden Calf.

So obviousy -- as was done with most of the cities taken by the Israelites .. Sack the city and kill the Pagan Priests. but, that is not what happens to the Jebusites and the Jebusite High Priest at the time.

David .. on the unification of all Israel .. there is a power struggle of sorts between the High Priest of the Israelites at the time .. and the High Priest of Jerusalem .. who's name was of course Zadok .. "Whats in a name" right !?

and it is Zadok who annoints King Solomon. and in Psalm 110 .. we learn that David is also a priest in the Order of Melchi-Zedek

and wonder who wonder Ho .. in Hebrews we learn that Jesus - is also a Priest forever in the Order of Melchi-Zedek .. but how is this any big surprise .. Prince of Peace .. arbiter of justice and Righteousness .. "What's in a Name" right !!

and now you know a little more about the nature of Christs Divinity .. and the nature of "Our Father .. who art in Heaven .. Hallowed be thy Name"

remembering that in the days of YHWH --- one of El's 70 Sons as per proper reading of Deut 32:8 the battle between these son's of The Supreme one EL-Oliun .. is to usurp El's position as chief God over the earth .. El then resides as Chief God in the Heavens .. the story that "Everyone" believes in one form or another at the time .. same with the creation story .. they all had the same general idea of where they came from.. Cannanite Religion and Israelite Religion were one in the same .. just you substitute a different Son of El into Psalm 82 . is the same song everyone had .. cept in one version it is YHWH who vanquishes Tiamat (primordial Serpent -- "Laviathan") in another it is Marduk, in another it is Chemosh, another it is .BAAL, in another it is . add in all the names of the various Patron Gods of each "People" of the day ..

Each city will put their God up to fight for the Prize .. Marduk -- ends up defeating YHWH -- destroying "The Place where his Name Resides"

Whats in a name aye

 

[YoursTrue]

Does the very fact that there are people who don’t yet even know the difference between a NAME (personal identifier) and a TITLE (a indicator of STATUS and/or Position of authority) contribute hugely to misinformation in scriptures?

It requires some study. Many people have Bibles anyway that do not translate properly, as far as I am concerned. Meaning that wherever there is the name YHWH (Jehovah or Yahweh as said sometimes in English) in early texts, the translators prefer to write LORD or Lord. So some people are, as they say, left in the dark, really by their religious leaders.

 

[Sargonski]

Not really… Paul mentioned it way before John did in Colossians and Philippians.


I don’t claim it… the Bible speaks of it.

You speak as if The Word is a soul and not God Himself which isn’t the position I hold.

Then quote from either Collossians or Phillippeans. -- not that this is relevant as is certainly not what Judeo Christians Believed .. but am curious.

We realize the Bible speaks of pre-existence -- the point being that the early Judeo Christians -- having the story of Mark to go by .. did not believe Jesus was pre-existent with God .. as a God .. but let us hear where Paul speaks of this.

I did not speak of the Word as a soul .. I spoke of Jesus being a soul .. pre- existing prior to coming down as a human. Talking about the Jesus of Mark .. not "The Logos" of John.

 

[Soapy]

It requires some study. Many people have Bibles anyway that do not translate properly, as far as I am concerned. Meaning that wherever there is the name YHWH (Jehovah or Yahweh as said sometimes in English) in early texts, the translators prefer to write LORD or Lord. So some people are, as they say, left in the dark, really by their religious leaders.

But there is always a footnote that explains that ‘LORD’ (all caps) is a substitute for the Tetragrammaton (‘YHWH’) which is the HEBREW NAME that the one true God gave for himself to Moses.

Yes, it’s true that it is TRINITARIAN CHURCH LEADERS in particular who do not desire their congregation to understand who the one true God is because by inducing and spreading ignorance they can further the trinity fallacy.

Know this also: The majority of church leaders seek the prestige, money, power, etc., of being in their position in the church. They, personally, might believe they are doing it in Jesus’ name - and do the delusion is strong with them! Since the WORLD WIDE view of Christianity is TRINITY-BASED it would do them and their church no good to be telling the truth - the basics that are more often preached (plus a smattering of incredulous nonsense which is forced on the congregation) suffices to keep the truth from them and keep them contributing monetarily and by bums-on-seats. If they were suddenly to accept the realisation that God is not three persons (Is GOD a Person? Three Persons are One Person!!!!??) they would find themself churchless and castigated from religious communities that are all around them (Trinity based!!) so FEAR keeps them preaching the fallacy.

 

[Soapy]

Not really… Paul mentioned it way before John did in Colossians and Philippians.


I don’t claim it… the Bible speaks of it.

You speak as if The Word is a soul and not God Himself which isn’t the position I hold.

Kenny, why do you say that Jesus is ‘The Word’…?

What does ‘The Word’ mean and how does it make Jesus to be ‘God’?

Kenny, what does it mean to be ‘God’?