IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
There is no conflict between saying God created everything and saying life evolved. Evolution is God's Modus Operendi.
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IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
It's an illustration to show you that two events can happen in the same century and be entirely unrelated. I could hae said the great depression and watergate, if you want them to be in the same country.
The destruction of the temple happened because the Jews could not fight off the Romans like they did the Greeks. One of the big reasons why not was that they were so busy killing each other and messing with each other. A house divided will fall. The Jewish symbol of this senseless hatred of each other, the reasons for the destruction of the temple, is the story of Kamza and bar Kamza. You can read that, for greater understanding if you like.
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
NOne of this answered my three questions about Jesus fulfilling those prophecies. The answers are :
He didn't.
He didn't
He didn't.
Therefore he is not the messiah.
Do you believe that your scripture was inspired of God? How long after the fact did Moses write about creation and the events in the garden of Eden? What about the events surrounding Abraham's encounter with the angels at Mamre? Or the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah?
Who put words into Moses' mouth?
I see that you also believe in evolution and that you think God caused it as his MO......how do you know this?
How long after the events did the scientists write about that possibility? Did someone put words in their mouths too?
You really want to play that game?
Nice try.....It is not a blindness that God caused, but simply one that he allowed to persist because of the countless occasions that Israel broke their covenant with him. He did not expect them to change their ways because they never did. It's why Jesus condemned the Pharisees to "gehenna".....the leadership was corrupt and he went in search of the "lost sheep" and brought them out of that spiritual wasteland.
What was Moses told before he died?
Deuteronomy 31:16-21....(Tanakh)
"And the Lord said to Moses: Behold, you are [about to] lie with your forefathers, and this nation will rise up and stray after the deities of the nations of the land, into which they are coming. And they will forsake Me and violate My covenant which I made with them. טזוַיֹּ֤אמֶר יְהֹוָה֙ אֶל־משֶׁ֔ה הִנְּךָ֥ שֹׁכֵ֖ב עִם־אֲבֹתֶ֑יךָ וְקָם֩ הָעָ֨ם הַזֶּ֜ה וְזָנָ֣ה | אַֽחֲרֵ֣י | אֱלֹהֵ֣י נֵֽכַר־הָאָ֗רֶץ אֲשֶׁ֨ר ה֤וּא בָא־שָׁ֨מָּה֙ בְּקִרְבּ֔וֹ וַֽעֲזָבַ֕נִי וְהֵפֵר֙ אֶת־בְּרִיתִ֔י אֲשֶׁ֥ר כָּרַ֖תִּי אִתּֽוֹ:
17And My fury will rage against them on that day, and I will abandon them and hide My face from them, and they will be consumed, and many evils and troubles will befall them, and they will say on that day, 'Is it not because our God is no longer in my midst, that these evils have befallen me?' יזוְחָרָ֣ה אַפִּ֣י ב֣וֹ בַיּֽוֹם־הַ֠ה֠וּא וַֽעֲזַבְתִּ֞ים וְהִסְתַּרְתִּ֨י פָנַ֤י מֵהֶם֙ וְהָיָ֣ה לֶֽאֱכֹ֔ל וּמְצָאֻ֛הוּ רָע֥וֹת רַבּ֖וֹת וְצָר֑וֹת וְאָמַר֙ בַּיּ֣וֹם הַה֔וּא הֲלֹ֗א עַ֣ל כִּי־אֵ֤ין אֱלֹהַי֙ בְּקִרְבִּ֔י מְצָא֖וּנִי הָֽרָע֥וֹת הָאֵֽלֶּה:
18And I will hide My face on that day, because of all the evil they have committed, when they turned to other deities. יחוְאָֽנֹכִ֗י הַסְתֵּ֨ר אַסְתִּ֤יר פָּנַי֙ בַּיּ֣וֹם הַה֔וּא עַ֥ל כָּל־הָֽרָעָ֖ה אֲשֶׁ֣ר עָשָׂ֑ה כִּ֣י פָנָ֔ה אֶל־אֱלֹהִ֖ים אֲחֵרִֽים:
19And now, write for yourselves this song, and teach it to the Children of Israel. Place it into their mouths, in order that this song will be for Me as a witness for the children of Israel. יטוְעַתָּ֗ה כִּתְב֤וּ לָכֶם֙ אֶת־הַשִּׁירָ֣ה הַזֹּ֔את וְלַמְּדָ֥הּ אֶת־בְּנֵֽי־יִשְׂרָאֵ֖ל שִׂימָ֣הּ בְּפִיהֶ֑ם לְמַ֨עַן תִּֽהְיֶה־לִּ֜י הַשִּׁירָ֥ה הַזֹּ֛את לְעֵ֖ד בִּבְנֵ֥י יִשְׂרָאֵֽל:
20When I bring them to the land which I have sworn to their forefathers [to give them], a land flowing with milk and honey, they will eat and be satisfied, and live on the fat [of the land]. Then, they will turn to other deities and serve them, provoking Me and violating My covenant. כ כִּֽי־אֲבִיאֶ֜נּוּ אֶל־הָֽאֲדָמָ֣ה | אֲשֶׁר־נִשְׁבַּ֣עְתִּי לַֽאֲבֹתָ֗יו זָבַ֤ת חָלָב֙ וּדְבַ֔שׁ וְאָכַ֥ל וְשָׂבַ֖ע וְדָשֵׁ֑ן וּפָנָ֞ה אֶל־אֱלֹהִ֤ים אֲחֵרִים֙ וַֽעֲבָד֔וּם וְנִ֣אֲצ֔וּנִי וְהֵפֵ֖ר אֶת־בְּרִיתִֽי:
21And it will be, when they will encounter many evils and troubles, this song will bear witness against them, for it will not be forgotten from the mouth of their offspring. For I know their inclination what they [are planning] to do today, [even] before I bring them in to the land which I have sworn [to give them]." כאוְהָיָ֠ה כִּֽי־תִמְצֶ֨אןָ אֹת֜וֹ רָע֣וֹת רַבּוֹת֘ וְצָרוֹת֒ וְ֠עָֽנְתָ֠ה הַשִּׁירָ֨ה הַזֹּ֤את לְפָנָיו֙ לְעֵ֔ד כִּ֛י לֹ֥א תִשָּׁכַ֖ח מִפִּ֣י זַרְע֑וֹ כִּ֧י יָדַ֣עְתִּי אֶת־יִצְר֗וֹ אֲשֶׁ֨ר ה֤וּא עֹשֶׂה֙ הַיּ֔וֹם בְּטֶ֣רֶם אֲבִיאֶ֔נּוּ אֶל־הָאָ֖רֶץ אֲשֶׁ֥ר נִשְׁבָּֽעְתִּי:"
Why do you persist in defending the indefensible? Moses was told that God was not expecting Israel to hold to their faith even after their initial blessings in the Promised Land. It was foretold in your own scripture....because of their consistent disobedience, only a remnant of natural Israel would be saved.....that is the remnant that followed Christ, according to our scripture.
We don't need Paul to condemn natural Israel.....God already did.
But individual Jews are by no means condemned.....they have as much opportunity to accept Jesus as the Christ as anyone else.....but I still see that same stubbornness that was manifest in your forefathers.
The door is still open, but we believe it will soon be closed.
Bree
Active Member
JW's stay politically neutral. We dont join the armed forces and we dont vote in political ballots because the only way to stay completely neutral is not to be involved.
This is in keeping with Jesus position: "They are no part of the world,+ just as I am no part of the world " John 17:17
But the kingdom or government that we are actively members of and do act as ambassadors for is the Kingdom of God.
YoursTrue
Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
Oh well. That's your viewpoint.
Not looking to the past, but looking at the present world scene the answer I find is: Jesus as Messiah will come !
Come by surprise when the powers that be will be saying, " Peace and Security....." as per 1 Thessalonians 5:2-3.
That saying of " Peace and Safety..." is really the precursor to the coming great tribulation of Revelation 7:14,9.
Before Jesus, as Prince of Peace (Psalms 72:7-8, 11-14), will be the one who will usher in global Peace on Earth among persons of goodwill.
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
Yes, the Tanakh is God's word and the sacred texts of my people. They tell us what it means to be Jews.
Moses did not write the Torah, although it records his revelation from God. YOu might want to google the documentary hypothesis. The Torah is spliced together writings from many people.
I know because of the archeaological and genetic evidence. IOW science has revealed how God created.
Really? You think this is a game? I don't.
That's not what Paul wrote. Again, you can't have it both ways.
The whole of the Tanakh shows that God is faithful to Israel even when Israel is not faithful to our God.
The remnant of Israel is the faithful and obedient.
If God wants to call us stubborn through the prophets, thats fine. But for you, a Christian, given that Chrisitans are just as stubborn and sinful, its sheer hypocrisy.
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
It's not "my viewpoint." It's common sense.
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
How can you say that? The only way that we will recognize the Messiah is if he fulfills all the prophecies.
YoursTrue
Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
You and I are not reading the same prophecies then.
YoursTrue
Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
You and I are reading the same book I suppose, the one prior to the testimony about Jesus, but evidently not seeing the same thing.
YoursTrue
Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
All at one time, you think? By the way, are you looking? (For what?) Any ideas who it might be now? The lobovitcher rabbi Schneerson died. Yet it was thought maybe he could be the Messiah.
YoursTrue
Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
No, just like some people think it's common sense to take a smallpox vaccination and others do not.
YoursTrue
Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
Speaking of the prophets, weren't a lot of them put to death by their own people/rulers?
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
1. When did Jesus usher in an era of worldwide peace? He didn't.
2. When did Jesus bring ALL the Jews back to the Land? He didn't.
3. When did Jesus rule from Jerusalem? He didn't.
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
I'm not sure what you mean by "the book before the one about Jesus." There is nothing in the Tanakh about the Temple being destroyed because of rejection of the Messiah. Nothing.
What is happening is this: You are trying to fit a square peg into a round hole. Early Christians found it important to have fulfilled prophecies, and went so far as to make up prophecies where none existed (such as "He shall be called aa Nazarene"). It would have been a feather in their cap if Jesus had prophesied the destruction of the Temple. However, nowhere in their writings does it say WHY the Temple was destroyed. That is later Christians such as yourself inserting your own imagined two cents worth. You have what is called confirmation bias -- you have decided in advance that the Temple was destroyed because of Jewish involvement in the execution of Jesus, and you then filter out any evidence or reasoning to the contrary.
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
ooops
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
Again, common sense means to take a smallpox vaccines, since the experts say that it is safe, effective, and necessary. It's paranoid people with no common sense that refuse vaccination--a deficit in reasoning skills.
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
No, not a lot. Very, very few. Jezebel had a bunch of prophets put to death, and I think I remember one other. That's it. Fin.