Ellen Brown
Well-Known Member
One can be Zen without being Buddhist. Perhaps a little more Zen?
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Mormon Scholarship
- Thread starter Ellen Brown
- Start date
There is nothing inscrutable about the Catholics. Like the Mormons, they have a power structure based on teacher, and leaders apart from those dictated by Yeshua in Matthew 23:8-11, with Peter being head of the house of David(Isaiah 22:15-25). They also have a confirmation process. And no, I don't understand the reasoning behind the special underwear worn by Mormons, the baptism of the dead, but I have read the Book of Mormon, and visited their Utah edifice, with the graven image on top, along with their Independence presence. And who do you practice obedience too?
If all the dead are judged for their deeds (Revelation 20:13), how is the baptism for the dead going to help them with their existing portfolio of deeds?
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How do the dead repent, which means to change their ways. They are dead, and have no ways. If one sins, they are separated from God, and God does not hear their prayer.(John 9:31)
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
@2ndpillar, you have made your contempt for our religion clear. I'm sorry you feel the way you do, and I can't help but wonder why. Would you mind explaining the reason behind these strong negative feelings? Also, may I ask which church you are affiliated with, if any?
I have no ill will towards the Mormons. I was raised a Roman Catholic, and I have no ill will towards them either. The fact that they carry the mark of the beast is a problem they will have to deal with (Revelation 14:10). The problem is that some of the "children" are stumbling because of the stumbling blocks put in front of them by these daughters of Babylon.(Matthew 18:6) We are now at the "end of the age", and the stumbling blocks and those who commit lawlessness must be gathered up and cast into the furnace of fire (Matthew 13:40-42). Per Zechariah 2:7, Zion is urged to escape the daughter of Babylon, much as stated in Revelation 18:4. The "enemy", the sower of tare seed is no longer protected per Matthew 13:28-30. The harvest of the tares is about to start. The tares are gathered "first" and then the wheat. (Matthew 13:30). My only concern is for the "children" of Matthew 18:6.
Ellen Brown
Well-Known Member
I don't know why it is in the Bible, but it is. I have respect for the Mormons but I will not be Mormon again.
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
Well, to be perfectly honest, it really sounds like you do. So are you currently not affiliated with any Christian denomination?
I think you have missed my point, which is probably not your fault because I generally don't post on this forum (comparative religions), but the "Christians" follow Paul, and his false gospel of grace/cross, which is the image of the beast and the dragon. When Constantine went out to conquer the world, he followed his standard in the shape of a cross. The Catholic padres led the conquistadors of the Holy Roman Spanish conquerors when they terrified the Americas, and they led with a cross. The "Christians" are the bad guys who "wear down the saints" (Daniel 7:25) under the leadership of "another" "king"(Daniel 7:24) , Constantine.
As a Mormon, you apparently believe that some of the surviving saints fled to the Americas and buried their writings for your leader to find.
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
I believe that Jesus Christ told Peter, James and John that He was going to establish His Church. Furthermore, I believe that He meant it and that He actually did so. He was the founder of the Church that bears His name, not Paul or anyone else. You may believe otherwise; it doesn't matter to me. You still haven't answered my question as to which church you affiliate with, even though I've already asked you twice and am now asking a third time. I've noticed that if the Mormons here don't respond to your questions in a satisfactory manner, you're quite quick to point that out. I've only asked you one question and yet you seem pretty determined not to answer it. Dialogues are intended to be two-way discussions, not just interrogations by one party with the other party continually being put on the defensive. I'm not looking for an argument, especially not on the comparative religion forum where the rules state that there is to be no debate, and if you're intent on denigrating my beliefs, I'm simply not interested in further discussion.
WHAT IN HEAVEN'S NAME ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT? Good grief, you are even more uninformed about Mormonism than I thought. That is one of the most absurd things I've ever been told about what I "apparently believe."
Have you even read the book of Mormon?. Supposedly written by Mormon and his son Moroni, giving a historical overview of early Americans and their roots. I mean it has been over 45 years since I have read it, but it seemed from recollection, that the refuges from Jerusalem, went by way of Egypt to the Americas, and Moroni helped write a set of gold plates with the history of the events, which were found and interpreted by Joseph Smith. Golden plates - Wikipedia
As for the "church" founded by Yeshua, it was founded on the Spirit of Revelation, which revealed to Simon bar Jonas, that Yeshua was the anointed one, the son of the living God (Matthew 16:17:18). That would be the "tested stone" "firmly placed" (Isaiah 28:16), which is not "petros"/small stone/Peter, but petras, a foundation stone. Peter was given the keys to the house of David to fulfill Scripture with respect to Shebna, who was made steward of the House of David, who would make a place for himself in the rock, shame his master's house, and be deposed from his office, and cast into a "vast country"/Rome, and who along with his heir/Eliakim/pope, held the key of the house of David, and when he opens no one will shut, but "in that day", he will "fall", and all "hanging" on to him, will be cut off (Isaiah 22:15-25). And no, I do not belong to any of the daughters of Babylon. I either am telling the truth, and if so, those of the light will hear my voice, if they are of the darkness, they will not. I do not require a Joseph Smith, nor a pope to stand on my own two feet. There is only one anointing, and it is from God himself, and not men from the daughters of Babylon (1 John 2:27). The name of the assembly of God is not "Christian" which stems from the term "Christ" which means anointed one. There is no anointed one member church. The congregation of God's people, would be referred to as Zion, as used in Zechariah 2:7, and would be the "few" of Matthew 7:13. Bible Search: zion
As for your signature line, you might consider coming out of the crowd/church and finding yourself.
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
Uh, yes. I've read The Book of Mormon. Why in the world would you think I hadn't? And from what you've said, my knowledge of what it says clearly exceeds yours by many, many times.
Okay, well we're simply going to have to disagree to disagree on who established Jesus Christ's Church here on earth. And I'm still left wondering if you are affiliated with any denomination of Christianity today. I'm gathering, though, that you're probably the one and only members of the Church of the 2ndpillar.
You're really clueless, aren't you? Clueless and entirely lacking in civility. At any rate, it's clearly a waste of my time to try to have a conversation with you. So I'm done here.
@2ndpillar, whether or not you intend it to be so, your ton here is EXTREMELY disrespectful and full of smear (to pretty much everyone). I (like every other person) don't appreciate being in a conversation where I am continually insulted, and am requesting a change in tone. If that tone does not change, I'm not going to stay around to just be insulted or lectured at. I'm here to have respectful interfaith dialogue.
**Answering questions here***
**Answering questions here***
God. And yes, that's the same God of the Bible.
A spirit still has the ability to make choices.
Change of heart-- that's the core of repentance.
?? Are you meaning to say "Jews" here?
Dude... tone. You sound like a bratty teenager here. Let's talk like adults instead.
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
Seriously, viole? We've had this conversation before, and I've explained before that we do not believe our underwear to be magic. The fact that you are once again asserting that we do makes me wonder if (1) you're just a slow learner, (2) you think I'm lying about our beliefs, or (3) you think I'm just uninformed about them. Which is it?
Among the LDS Church’s fifteen highest ranking leaders (the “First Presidency” and the “Quorum of the Twelve Apostles") are eight men with doctorate degrees from Harvard, Yale, Purdue, and Duke. Three are lawyers, one of them a former Supreme Court Justice and law clerk to U.S. Supreme Court Chief Justice, Earl Warren, another the associate general counsel of what is now Bank of America in Charlotte, N.C., one a heart surgeon and the former president of the Society for Vascular Surgery and chairman of the Council on Cardiovascular Surgery for the American Heart Association, several who were professors at Stanford, Texas Tech and the University of Chicago, one of them being a university president. One was the former senior vice president of Lufthansa Airlines. One was on the staff of Adm. Hyman Rickover, developing military and private nuclear power reactors. One was the CEO of a major California health care system. If you think for one minute that any of these individuals believes his underwear to be magical, think again.
Throughout history, people of various religions have worn sacred clothing that is both special and meaningful to them alone. Often times, this clothing may be visible to others, because it is worn on top of other clothing. Examples of such sacred clothing are beads, shawls, and special head-coverings. In other situations, this special clothing may be worn under one's outer clothing, next to the skin. The Jewish tallit katan, for example, is a white garment worn under the clothing in remembrance of the Lord's commandments (see Exodus 19:6, Numbers 15:38 and Deuteronomy 22:12). It is similar in purpose to the LDS temple garment.
I honestly do think you have it in you to be more respectful. Would you mind at least trying?
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Ellen Brown
Well-Known Member
JoshuaTree
Flowers are red?
Do mormons beleive in the rapture as do charismatics? I've heard the underwear is rapture proof, is that true?
Ellen Brown
Well-Known Member
If you are sincere with your questions, I advise you to go to a Mormon Visitor's Center or contact them on line and ask them. It is best not to rely on conjecture. Or just go to Mormon.org.
I am not proselytizing but think that is you have questions, you should talk to someone who actually knows.
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No.
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
No, we do not believe in "the rapture" so apparently there is no need for "rapture proof underwear."
Your references were with respect to tassels, not "white garment worn under the clothing". These were worn to remind Israel to "remember the commandments of the LORD, and not to follow after your own heart. Why do you always quote verses which testify against your own actions of following your own commandments. And why do your "wise and intelligent" men (Matthew 11:25) wear white magic underwear? I can understand if they are just following what their mom's told them, to always wear clean underwear. If it is another secret of the Mormons, just let us know. Except for the timing, if I were to guess, I would think that white reflects radiation, and your leading men are planning for if they get exposed in a radiation event.
Matthew 11:24-26 24But I tell you that it will be more bearable for Sodom on the day of judgment than for you.” 25At that time Jesus declared, “I praise You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because You have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children. 26Yes, Father, for this was well-pleasing in Your sight.…