Jehovah's Witness cartoon suggests to Children that magic-themed toys make Jehovah 'sad'

Deeje said:

In reading the direction that God gave to his people before they entered the Promised Land (a land saturated with demon worshiping practicers of all kinds of spiritism) he said....“When you have entered into the land that Jehovah your God is giving you, you must not learn to imitate the detestable practices of those nations. 10 There should not be found in you anyone who makes his son or his daughter pass through the fire, anyone who employs divination, anyone practicing magic, anyone who looks for omens, a sorcerer, 11 anyone binding others with a spell, anyone who consults a spirit medium or a fortune-teller, or anyone who inquires of the dead. 12 For whoever does these things is detestable to Jehovah, and on account of these detestable practices Jehovah your God is driving them away from before you."

Its quite a check list. NONE of that was to be practiced by those who worship the true God. They were common practices of the pagan nations however.

"Magic" in this sense is sometimes translated "witchcraft". The Hebrew word "`anan" means all kinds of magical arts and carries the meaning of something "hidden"....like the word "occult". The power behind these practices is hidden. The one who pretends to be an "angel of light" is a deceiver and covers up his true intentions with regard to these practices. Making them out to be harmless fun gets a lot of people in.



The child is seeing nothing wrong with the magical wizard toy....his Mom is trying to help him see the connection of magic to it promoter.....satan the devil. This is a video for very young children, don't forget. It has to be a simple message and the child should be helped to understand why magic is not harmless fun. The devil just like to promote it that way.



Surely its not that hard. We are not trying to stifle our children's imagination, but rather to steer them into a more spiritually healthy direction. There are heroes in the Bible too you know. Not all heroes have to be make believe.

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Hmm.

The top part of your post sounds like it talks about real magic not imaginary and not based on the words which does nothing.

Do you think the child knows what real" magic is?

The mother is connecting what she thinks is real but in Fact its totally fake based on words. I mean, it sounds like the mother is making something real by its nature is fake.

The toy wasnt a good example of biblical magic. It falls on the mother not the child.

oldbadger said:

Whilst posted with just some humour, which you seem to have missed, it does point out that nearly every post which criticised the JW film clearly ignored the fact that the kid wanted to play with a MAGIC KILLER!

Look..... if you're happy about very young kids playing at killing stuff then fine, but most Creches, Kindergartens, sensible parents, would do their best to remove this toy and get rid of of it when possible.

Can't you see that?

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There's nothing sensible at all about such an irrational overreaction.

To be cont. My mobile is acting up. Making copies

Father Heathen said:

It would appear that Jehovah's Witnesses do not care about thinking, period.

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What do you really know about JW's that you haven't heard from our opposers FH? Those who know JW's and have spent considerable time with more than one of us, will know what we teach, and will have evaluated our beliefs first hand...not second hand.....they are not as harsh in their judgments as those who are guided by the opinions of others, who have no first hand contact (other than perhaps a brief appearance at their door) but seem to be the most opinionated. I wonder why? Same reason that people rejected the son of God I think.....they believed what others said instead of finding out for themselves....

savagewind said:

Are you sure about that?

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It s extremely clear, based upon what he said, that he was an active participant in killing, not of Stephen, the first Christian murdered for his faith, but he stood and watched and approved. Stonings had many willing participants, each with the desire to kill the victim. Paul no doubt participated in these killings, a reasonable and logical conclusion. Even if he didn´t physically act to kill, ensuring it would happen makes him just as guilty. He makes no bones about his guilt.

The Ragin Pagan said:

Irony, as most Christians KNOW they are ABSOLUTELY right. Because the bible said so.


That's stage magic. Layman's magic. I refuse to spell "magic" with a 'K' to distinguish it; I do magic today when I carve runes to protect my home, or guide my path, or give restful dreams to my wife. I know many who cast spells in their own arts, different from mine but still an act of magic. Magic is still "thought of" as power today, even if Christians don't think of it as such.

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First, we know we are right because God says so. Second, we believe your kind of magic has power. Paul said that we (Christians) struggle against kings, powers and principalities unseen. I don´t consider your magic as laughable or absurd, I consider it manifestations of my ultimate enemy, and yours. You just don´t know it.

Deeje said:

What do you really know about JW's that you haven't heard from our opposers FH? Those who know JW's and have spent considerable time with more than one of us, will know what we teach, and will have evaluated our beliefs first hand...not second hand.....they are not as harsh in their judgments as those who are guided by the opinions of others, who have no first hand contact (other than perhaps a brief appearance at their door) but seem to be the most opinionated. I wonder why? Same reason that people rejected the son of God I think.....they believed what others said instead of finding out for themselves....

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I have to agree. I am not a JW and will never be one, Nevertheless I have spent many, many happy hours with them discussing Christianity, always considerate, never argumentative, never judgemental.

shmogie said:

First, we know we are right because God says so.

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Circular logic. Your book says so, and you believe that your book is the word of your god.

Second, we believe your kind of magic has power ... I consider it manifestations of my ultimate enemy, and yours. You just don´t know it.

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And no Christian has yet to explain just how this "ultimate enemy" would give power that helps and does good, aside from the fear-mongering of "Just you wait until later!" Booga-booga, spare us the ridiculousness.

All based on the above mentioned circular logic, and the threat of an "ultimate evil" figure that you can't even prove.

I've looked at the posts on this and nearly all the Watchtower defenders believe Sparlock is magic, leads to magic, and even one poster who goes so far as to label it "killing stuff".

I think the whole thing is silly.

If Sparlock is magic:



Then Voyager is a "space ship":



Of course, Sparlock may not be magic himself, he just may be a conduit that "leads to magic" much like Voyager may be a conduit that leads to space travel. And if you think this is unlikely, you won't think so when you're kid tells you he's the High Priest of a Satanic cult or comes home late one night claiming he was caught in a vortex after he was abducted by space aliens.

So just as we know Sparlock is or can lead to magic, we also know the following, because there is absolutely no difference between the two:

Playing with toy cars should be strictly supervised, lest it lead to increased vehicular accidents later in life:

whereas play with Woody can lead to gun violence:

and the space traveling Buzz Lightyear can lead to asphyxiation: just like the Hulk can lead to bullying:

and this warlock of materialism can lead to greed: and heaven forbid the horrible consequences of this worldly murder game:

and last but not least, the most treacherous of all...Ken, marketed to our innocent young girls! I leave it to your imagination what a guy like this could actually lead to:

Deeje said:

What do you really know about JW's that you haven't heard from our opposers FH? .

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You, my dear, have a giant chip on your shoulder. Maybe he knows about Jehovah's Witnesses by reading Jehovah's Witness' posts?

shmogie said:

It s extremely clear, based upon what he said, that he was an active participant in killing, not of Stephen, the first Christian murdered for his faith, but he stood and watched and approved. Stonings had many willing participants, each with the desire to kill the victim. Paul no doubt participated in these killings, a reasonable and logical conclusion. Even if he didn´t physically act to kill, ensuring it would happen makes him just as guilty. He makes no bones about his guilt.

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It is not clear and it is not simple. Paul was a Pharisee. Right? I understand that a Pharisee was a keeper of the law. The Pharisees trusted that the Christians were breaking the law of God. So, the deaths of those Christians could not be considered "murder" but justice. Your idea of Paul cannot be reconciled with this scripture. Acts of the Apostles 22:3 I am a Jew, born in Tarsus of Cilicia, but brought up in this city. I studied under Gamaliel and was thoroughly trained in the law of our ancestors. I was just as zealous for God as any of you are today.
In no way can a murderer rightly claim that he is zealous for God.

savagewind said:

It is not clear and it is not simple. Paul was a Pharisee. Right? I understand that a Pharisee was a keeper of the law. The Pharisees trusted that the Christians were breaking the law of God. So, the deaths of those Christians could not be considered "murder" but justice. Your idea of Paul cannot be reconciled with this scripture. Acts of the Apostles 22:3 I am a Jew, born in Tarsus of Cilicia, but brought up in this city. I studied under Gamaliel and was thoroughly trained in the law of our ancestors. I was just as zealous for God as any of you are today.
In no way can a murderer rightly claim that he is zealous for God.

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Yes, Paul, at the time, believed he was exacting justice according to the Torah. When he was enlightened by God, he realized he actually had been committing murder, the unlawful killing of an innocent. He was judging himself according to the law of Christ, a result of the new covenant, not by the Torah, the fulfilled old covenant. Naziś lawfully killed children, does the law they acted under absolve them of the guilt ?

The bible clearly shows Christians surrounded by a litany of pagan temples and artifacts. They believed in the pagan gods like Zeus, Apollo, and Jupiter. They had priests who invoked every conceivable amulet, charm, rite or curse. The were ruled by a government that supported virtually every charge meant to obliterate the New Testament Church and those following "The Way".

Even through all this, the church thrived and prospered just like Christ assured his followers it would.

So I am amazed to learn one Sparlock doll can snatch Jehovah Witnesses out of the hands of the Watchtower, despite endless meetings, a full arsenal of Watchtowers, Awake! and other publications, and supportive friends and parents.The video reminds me of something out of a 16th century witch trial than modern Christian church.

In any event, I humbly submit that if any church is having or is concerned with a doll overpowering Christians and their faith, then the problem may be with the religion rather than a powerless Holy Spirit.

shmogie said:

Yes, Paul, at the time, believed he was exacting justice according to the Torah. When he was enlightened by God, he realized he actually had been committing murder, the unlawful killing of an innocent. He was judging himself according to the law of Christ, a result of the new covenant, not by the Torah, the fulfilled old covenant. Naziś lawfully killed children, does the law they acted under absolve them of the guilt ?

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OK. Can you prove that he considered it murder? You say that he knew it was murder. Please prove it.

shmogie said:

. Naziś lawfully killed children, does the law they acted under absolve them of the guilt ?

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Strawman. LOL
The Nazis are a secular establishment.

The Ragin Pagan said:

Circular logic. Your book says so, and you believe that your book is the word of your god.


And no Christian has yet to explain just how this "ultimate enemy" would give power that helps and does good, aside from the fear-mongering of "Just you wait until later!" Booga-booga, spare us the ridiculousness.

All based on the above mentioned circular logic, and the threat of an "ultimate evil" figure that you can't even prove.

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Well my friend, you cannot prove any of your hocus pocus to be anything other than childish fantasy, by objective scientific principles. S o you are in a very, very poor position to talk about proof. So, you think carving rocks manifests power to heal or make people sleep well ? Why ? Where does your knowledge of spells come from ? You just absorbed it from the ether ? ¨doing good¨ is a relative idea. The Naziś did many good things for the German people, we know how that turned out. They believed in spells, rituals, all the hocus pocus of the occult, some of which you believe in. I have been to a true satanic mass, back in my college atheist days. I saw enough of his manifestation to realize that he exists and has power that is not of this world. You had better be really, really sure that what you believe and do is innocent, because I believe you are simply being played and used. We are all free moral agents, so continue to carve your rocks, chant your spells, use the power you may have tapped. I guarantee you that you will know without a doubt, the answer to Christś question ´what is truth ?¨

It's all about the mind. Magic and spells are related to faith but without God. It is written that faith can move mountains. God is for righteousness. Magic isn't.

savagewind said:

Strawman. LOL
The Nazis are a secular establishment.

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What does being secular, or religious have to do with it ? The koran says non moslems are to be tortured and killed, and they have been carrying out that command since 600 AD. Does that make the argument more consistent ?

savagewind said:

OK. Can you prove that he considered it murder? You say that he knew it was murder. Please prove it.

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Yes, I think I can, Iĺl get back to you on this tomorrow.

Oeste said:

The bible clearly shows Christians surrounded by a litany of pagan temples and artifacts. They believed in the pagan gods like Zeus, Apollo, and Jupiter. They had priests who invoked every conceivable amulet, charm, rite or curse. The were ruled by a government that supported virtually every charge meant to obliterate the New Testament Church and those following "The Way".

Even through all this, the church thrived and prospered just like Christ assured his followers it would.

So I am amazed to learn one Sparlock doll can snatch Jehovah Witnesses out of the hands of the Watchtower, despite endless meetings, a full arsenal of Watchtowers, Awake! and other publications, and supportive friends and parents.The video reminds me of something out of a 16th century witch trial than modern Christian church.

In any event, I humbly submit that if any church is having or is concerned with a doll overpowering Christians and their faith, then the problem may be with the religion rather than a powerless Holy Spirit.

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When you say ¨they believed in...........¨ you don´t mean Christians, do you ?