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What is God's Kingdom?

savagewind

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
The word you are debating JJ is used ONLY TWICE. Yes or no? My source says twice. What does your source say?

The other time it is used for a cup. How? Why is it used for a cup? Is it a mistake?
 
JayJayDee

JayJayDee

Avid JW Bible Student
Nothing I have said is true. THAT is not an insult?

Does "master" mean God, Lord, master, Sir?

From kuros (supremacy); supreme in authority, i.e. (as noun) controller; by implication, Master (as a respectful title) -- God, Lord, master, Sir.

Matthew 24:45? Who alone (according to JW doctrine, not mine) fits that description MASTER?
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I addressed the question about the cup...why are you now serving insults, and going off on another tangent....run out of argument have you? When you are shown proof that your view is wrong, you just ignore it and go on defaming the GB. Go back over the threads and see how many times you have done this. None of what you post about the GB is true....only in your own twisted view, to which you are entitled. But I will defend them from the defamation that you throw at them.

We received a wonderful gift over the weekend, thanks to our brothers on the GB. It will be well utilized and appreciated by a lot of people.
 
JayJayDee

JayJayDee

Avid JW Bible Student
savagewind said:
The word you are debating JJ is used ONLY TWICE. Yes or no? My source says twice. What does your source say?

The other time it is used for a cup. How? Why is it used for a cup? Is it a mistake?
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Am I a Greek scholar? Are you?

What does it matter how many times it is used? What does it mean? Strongs tells you.

What do all those translations give as their rendering? The translators are scholars.

Your argument is pointless.
 
savagewind

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
According to Jehovah's Witness belief there is only ONE supreme being. The Supreme Being is Jehovah. Every living thing owes it's name to Jehovah. Jehovah ALONE is to be sbject to. But the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses translate master at Matthew 24:45 as Jesus. Is that not correct?

Disagreeing with someone is not defamation. If it is then you dear lady are defaming me.
 
savagewind

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
The question is; the one called master at Matthew 24:45, who is it?

Who then is the faithful and wise servant, whom the master has put in charge of the servants in his household to give them their food at the proper time?
 
JayJayDee

JayJayDee

Avid JW Bible Student
FranklinMichaelV.3 said:
...Something that is in the midst of you, is usually something that you can point to.
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Since Jesus was the one they could point to but didn't, that was the whole point of the scripture. As the designated King of God's kingdom, he represented the kingdom on earth at that time. Denying that he was Jehovah's representative didn't alter the fact that he was there to teach them about that kingdom, but they failed to acknowledge him and they failed to accept his teachings.

It would have to be a spiritual dwelling for the word midst to have a different meaning.
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Why would it have to be? There is no different meaning. Jesus knew exactly what he was saying...it is Christendom who have completely lost sight of what the kingdom is. They cannot preach good news about something they know nothing about.

Having Christ in you and you being "in Christ" is a unique experience reserved for the "chosen ones" who are anointed with holy spirit.

Paul wrote about those with the "heavenly calling"....

"For all who are led by God’s spirit, these are God’s sons. 15 For YOU did not receive a spirit of slavery causing fear again, but YOU received a spirit of adoption as sons, by which spirit we cry out: “Abba, Father!” 16 The spirit itself bears witness with our spirit that we are God’s children. 17 If, then, we are children, we are also heirs: heirs indeed of God, but joint heirs with Christ, provided we suffer together that we may also be glorified together." (Rom 8:14-17; Heb 3:1)
This is speaking about the ones who will rule with Jesus in heaven. Not all Christians will be "kings and priests". (Rev 20:6)

These glorified members of the heavenly kingdom will rule over subjects on earth. (Rev 21:3, 4)

The subjects rejoice at the prospect of having those hand picked by Jesus ruling over them in the new earth. (2 Pet 3:13)
 
BSM1

BSM1

What? Me worry?
savagewind said:
The translators do not want to believe The Spirit of God dwells in them. It's freaky. And to them it does not mean freedom. When you realize the spirit of truth is dwelling in you, you tend to clean up your act a bit....a lot...they don't want to do that.

AND

If they teach you you can have the spirit in you, they will lose their authority over you. They want their stuff to be in you.
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Well said. Of course every word in every religious book can be parsed. It's amazing how some folks wish to unnecessarily complicate their lives.
 
JayJayDee

JayJayDee

Avid JW Bible Student
BSM1 said:
Well said. Of course every word in every religious book can be parsed. It's amazing how some folks wish to unnecessarily complicate their lives.
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"My son, if you will receive my sayings and treasure up my own commandments with yourself, 2 so as to pay attention to wisdom with your ear, that you may incline your heart to discernment; 3 if, moreover, you call out for understanding itself and you give forth your voice for discernment itself, 4 if you keep seeking for it as for silver, and as for hid treasures you keep searching for it, 5 in that case you will understand the fear of Jehovah, and you will find the very knowledge of God. 6 For Jehovah himself gives wisdom; out of his mouth there are knowledge and discernment" (Prov 2:1-6)

Hid treasure is not lying around on the surface. It requires some digging and effort.
Is the truth complicated? No, it makes perfect sense to those who put in the work to gain the knowledge. There should be no basic question that cannot be answered from scripture. (1 Pet 3:15)
 
JayJayDee

JayJayDee

Avid JW Bible Student
It does not matter who the master of Matthew 24:45 is. Is that right?
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“master” (Gr., ky′ri·os, also rendered “lord”)

The "Lord" (master) Jesus is the one who appointed the slave in Matt 24:45.

The Sovereign "Lord" Jehovah is also a "master". He is actually the "master" of Jesus.

Both are masters and both are saviors. So what? :shrug:
 
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A

Awoon

Well-Known Member
rusra02 said:
Jesus taught us to pray "Let your kingdom come," He instructed his followers to
"Keep on, then, seeking first the kingdom ." (Matthew 6:9,10,33) What do you believe God's Kingdom is?
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A covert operation that humans try to dictate to other humans with threats of hell.
 
savagewind

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
JayJayDee said:
“master” (Gr., ky′ri·os, also rendered “lord”)

The "Lord" (master) Jesus is the one who appointed the slave in Matt 24:45.

The Sovereign "Lord" Jehovah is also a "master". He is actually the "master" of Jesus.

Both are masters and both are saviors. So what? :shrug:
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So what? I shall ignore that it is rhetorical and say you better be sure because you have taken it to heart that every person who does not distinguish Jehovah from Jesus will be killed a terrible death.

Jesus never taught he would be a master over his believers. Actually he said he will make them FREE.

You are confused.
 
savagewind

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
I shall admit defeat about my believe Jesus is obviously not the Lord mentioned at Matthew 24:45.

Philippians 2:11 every tongue acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

John 13:13 You call me Teacher and Lord, and rightly so, for that is what I am.

Romans 10:9 If you declare with your mouth, Jesus is Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Who appointed Jesus lord? Who appoints a place for any authority?

Romans 13:1 Let every soul be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and the authorities that exist are appointed by God.

The authorities that exist are appointed by WHO?

How is Jesus Lord? Well, he is not lord for lording it over. In other words he does not dictate what people will do. On the other hand he is dictated by God. You know that.

Jesus is the way, the truth and the [only way to] life. You know that too. So I think it can truely be said that the way, truth and life is LORD.

You know all this. How is it you are confused?
 
BSM1

BSM1

What? Me worry?
JayJayDee said:
"My son, if you will receive my sayings and treasure up my own commandments with yourself, 2 so as to pay attention to wisdom with your ear, that you may incline your heart to discernment; 3 if, moreover, you call out for understanding itself and you give forth your voice for discernment itself, 4 if you keep seeking for it as for silver, and as for hid treasures you keep searching for it, 5 in that case you will understand the fear of Jehovah, and you will find the very knowledge of God. 6 For Jehovah himself gives wisdom; out of his mouth there are knowledge and discernment" (Prov 2:1-6)

Hid treasure is not lying around on the surface. It requires some digging and effort.
Is the truth complicated? No, it makes perfect sense to those who put in the work to gain the knowledge. There should be no basic question that cannot be answered from scripture. (1 Pet 3:15)
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Sooo....are we agreeing or disagreeing??
 
JayJayDee

JayJayDee

Avid JW Bible Student
BSM1 said:
Sooo....are we agreeing or disagreeing??
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Since your previous posts seem to indicate a reticence to listen to those who might be more acquainted with scripture than your admitted 'childlike' faith might dictate; it seems as if you are reluctant to go beyond a basic knowledge of the scriptures as taught by Christendom, because you don't wish to complicate your faith. So I was merely pointing out that there is more to 'knowing' God and his Christ than what appears on the surface. (John 17:3)
Please correct me if I have misunderstood your responses.

If we are told to dig in God's word like we were digging for buried treasure, then it is clearly not enough to just blindly accept what is just 'surface' knowledge. If we have the capability to take in deeper knowledge of the scriptures and we choose not to, can that be acceptable to God? Can we say that we really "know" the one we purport to worship?

If we know WHAT we believe, but more importantly WHY we believe it, only then can we offer to others solid Bible backed evidence for what we accept as truth.

If we just accept things without understanding where they came from, we can be deceived into accepting the counterfeit Christianity (weeds) that Jesus warned about.

Going deeper can correct misconceptions about God's identity, Jesus' relationship to his Father and the correct understanding about the 'coming' of God's kingdom. These are all basic teachings, but all have been scrambled by Christendom. If these are not true, then all of Christendom's churches who accept these false teachings, are in big trouble.

The kingdom is a basic teaching, but it is not an 'experience' that takes place internally as has been suggested. The rest of scripture attests to that. Knowing what is taught in ALL of scripture should either confirm or invalidate our beliefs....but only if we are open to what it really teaches.

That is my point.
 
BSM1

BSM1

What? Me worry?
JayJayDee said:
Since your previous posts seem to indicate a reticence to listen to those who might be more acquainted with scripture than your admitted 'childlike' faith might dictate; it seems as if you are reluctant to go beyond a basic knowledge of the scriptures as taught by Christendom, because you don't wish to complicate your faith. So I was merely pointing out that there is more to 'knowing' God and his Christ than what appears on the surface. (John 17:3)
Please correct me if I have misunderstood your responses.
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Evidently one of us has.
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JayJayDee

JayJayDee

Avid JW Bible Student
BSM1 said:
Evidently one of us has.
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Thank you, would you like to clarify what you have said in previous posts then?

It is easy to misinterpret what is said in written expressions.

When you analyse a scripture like Luke 17:21 with the rest of what is taught in scripture, you see that it can't mean what Christendom teaches. It is the same case as the thief hung alongside Jesus. Jesus promised him life in paradise, but some insist that Jesus was going to be with the thief 'that day'. The rest of scripture proves that this is not what Jesus was saying at all. You have to dig deeper.
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BSM1

BSM1

What? Me worry?
JayJayDee said:
BSM1 said:
Thank you, would you like to clarify what you have said in previous posts then?

It is easy to misinterpret what is said in written expressions.

When you analyse a scripture like Luke 17:21 with the rest of what is taught in scripture, you see that it can't mean what Christendom teaches. It is the same case as the thief hung alongside Jesus. Jesus promised him life in paradise, but some insist that Jesus was going to be with the thief 'that day'. The rest of scripture proves that this is not what Jesus was saying at all. You have to dig deeper.
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Obviously you can make the Bible say and/or mean anything you wish. That's why I say we all have to find our own truth. And, since I am totally enjoying my truth, I think I'll keep it.
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Ingledsva

Ingledsva

HEATHEN ALASKAN
JayJayDee said:
We must allow the word of God to correct misconceptions. Blind faith is not going to save anyone. The 'liberation' you speak of is not true freedom, but is an excuse for not making a thorough investigation. (1 Pet 3:15)

In Luke 17:21, Jesus was telling those Pharisees that he, as king of God's Kingdom was standing there right in their midst, yet they refused to recognize him.

The kingdom is an "administration" used by God to reconcile the sinful human race back into an acceptable relationship with himself. It is headed by Jesus Christ and 144,000 chosen from the earth to assist him as kings and priests. (Eph 1:9-12; Rev 14:3; 20:6)

Luke 17:21 is not saying what many have been taught. It is a false assumption based on inaccurate knowledge of the scriptures.

Please reconsider. The Bible interprets itself if you let it. Remember that Jesus preached a different message to what those Pharisees were teaching. The people had to decide whether to stick with a long entrenched tradition or listen to the truth Jesus preached and change their beliefs accordingly. It meant being different and looked down upon.

Look at the attitude of the people when Pilate offered to release Jesus....read Matt 27:22-25. Who led the people to adopt that attitude?

Christendom is the modern counterpart of the Judaism of Jesus' day. They too have preferred their traditions over the word of God. Read what Jesus said about those Jewish traditions taught by the Pharisees in Matt 15:6-9.

The court of public opinion has never been favorable to God's true servants and never a reliable source to base such an important decision upon. This is a life and death issue. Don't make your decision by relying on the beliefs held by the "many". (Matt 7:13, 14). :(
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Luke 10:10 But into whatever city you enter, and they do not receive you, going out into its streets, say,
Luke 10:11 And even the dust/debris that clings to us from your city, we shake off! Albeit this know; that the Kingdom of God has approached you. (made overtures to)
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