How are you okay with that?

tarasan said:

sorry but ive always wanted to test this arguement out on this forum and uve given me the opertunity .

so here it goes

(4) Other things being equal, the seriousness of a crime increases as the status (the degree of importance or value) of its victim increases.
(5) God has an infinitely high status.
(6) Therefore, crimes against God are infinitely serious (from (4) and (5)).
(7) All sin is a crime against God.
(8) Therefore, all sin is infinitely serious (from (6) and (7)).
(9) The more serious a crime is, the more serious its punishment should be.
(10) Therefore, all sin should receive an infinitely serious punishment (from (8) and (9)).


this logical arguement assumes that the more value a victum has the more serious a crime is done against it, aka we dont view it as bad if you kill an ant than a person.


and because christians believe GOd has an infinite amount of worth when you sin, you do an infinite crime to GOd because of his worth.


therefore your punishment to be just, must be eternal


this kind of arguement doesnt show how God can legitametly do something rather it shows how he must do it to be just.


your thoughts?

​

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Riverwolf said:

The only victim when I sin is myself. God cannot be harmed, and therefore God cannot be a victim.

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Riverwolf said:

The only victim when I sin is myself. God cannot be harmed, and therefore God cannot be a victim.

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nonbeliever_92 said:

I thought we all were one, and all is god. if you harm yourself, then you're harming god. If god cannot be harmed, then everything's fricken impervious to damage.

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Riverwolf said:

Hold on. God can be a victim?

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Senedjem said:

This hell idea is horrible and ludicrious, and those who believe in it come up with even more ludicrious explinations to justify it.

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Riverwolf said:

Brahman (God) is the aggregate of all that is. That aggregate is what I believe cannot be harmed.

After all, if a single one of your cells is harmed, you as a whole are not harmed, correct?

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javajo said:

Here is what I believe. Yes, God is just, yet merciful. For although he does not send anybody to Hell, they send themselves there, he did everything possible to keep us from going there, including offering salvation as a totally free gift which we simply accept, no work involved and we have to do nothing in return, nothing to get it, nothing to keep it. When we've trusted in God that he sent his Son who he loved to pay the penalty of our sins, we have gained eternal life.

24Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life. (John 5:24)

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spencer751 said:

under that argument stealing my sister's favorite pin can be equivalent to murder.

Another question- Is stealing a dollar from the pope worse than stealing a dollar from a prostitute whose only property is that dollar?

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tarasan said:

show me a definition that explicity state that a victum of a crime must be harmed.

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javajo said:

Here is what I believe. Yes, God is just, yet merciful. For although he does not send anybody to Hell, they send themselves there, he did everything possible to keep us from going there, including offering salvation as a totally free gift which we simply accept, no work involved and we have to do nothing in return, nothing to get it, nothing to keep it. When we've trusted in God that he sent his Son who he loved to pay the penalty of our sins, we have gained eternal life.

24Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life. (John 5:24)

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waitasec said:

wait a second.
the crime against god is what? not believing in it?
so if your child were to second guess your wisdom, you'd disown them?

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javajo said:

Here is what I believe. Yes, God is just, yet merciful. For although he does not send anybody to Hell, they send themselves there, he did everything possible to keep us from going there, including offering salvation as a totally free gift which we simply accept, no work involved and we have to do nothing in return, nothing to get it, nothing to keep it. When we've trusted in God that he sent his Son who he loved to pay the penalty of our sins, we have gained eternal life.

24Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life. (John 5:24)

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nonbeliever_92 said:

Yes, cause the cell is part of me.

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tarasan said:

sorry but ive always wanted to test this arguement out on this forum and uve given me the opertunity .

so here it goes

(4) Other things being equal, the seriousness of a crime increases as the status (the degree of importance or value) of its victim increases.
(5) God has an infinitely high status.
(6) Therefore, crimes against God are infinitely serious (from (4) and (5)).
(7) All sin is a crime against God.
(8) Therefore, all sin is infinitely serious (from (6) and (7)).
(9) The more serious a crime is, the more serious its punishment should be.
(10) Therefore, all sin should receive an infinitely serious punishment (from (8) and (9)).


this logical arguement assumes that the more value a victum has the more serious a crime is done against it, aka we dont view it as bad if you kill an ant than a person.


and because christians believe GOd has an infinite amount of worth when you sin, you do an infinite crime to GOd because of his worth.


therefore your punishment to be just, must be eternal


this kind of arguement doesnt show how God can legitametly do something rather it shows how he must do it to be just.


your thoughts?

​

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Riverwolf said:

Right there from your own source:

a person who suffers from a destructive or injurious action or agency: a victim of an automobile accident.

If the use of "suffer" instead of harm isn't enough, then here's the definitions of suffer:

–verb (used without object) 1. to undergo or feel pain or distress: The patient is still suffering.

2. to sustain injury, disadvantage, or loss: One's health suffers from overwork. The business suffers from lack of capital.

3. to undergo a penalty, as of death: The traitor was made to suffer on the gallows.

4. to endure pain, disability, death, etc., patiently or willingly.


–verb (used with object) 5. to undergo, be subjected to, or endure (pain, distress, injury, loss, or anything unpleasant): to suffer the pangs of conscience.

6. to undergo or experience (any action, process, or condition): to suffer change.

7. to tolerate or allow: I do not suffer fools gladly.




If these do not constitute being harmed, then I don't know what does.

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tarasan said:

well i dont have infinite worth, unlike God so irregardless of what you do against him, it will always be an infinite faul. sinning in any way also attributes an inifinite crime.

even so this statement doesnt challenge the logic of the arguement.

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nonbeliever_92 said:

So if you kill in self defense, you're going to hell forever? If you kill accidnetally, through ignorance, let's say, you're going to hell forever?

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