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Can an Atheist Pray?

yourhopeboundheart

yourhopeboundheart

Mig
Green Kepi said:
Why would God answer the prayers of those not His children...? For the eyes of the Lord are on the righteous, and His ears are open to their prayers…” 1 Peter 3:12
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maybe because if he's the god of the entire universe, created sand and stone, drop and sea, then he's a little bit bigger than the patriotic, in-group obsessed, tribal types of our depraved time and place. maybe his ego can be set aside for five seconds in order to extend a little, what do you call it? grace to somebody who might be using the gigantic brain he handed them to call into question a few of the weird quirks left in 'his' message.


or maybe he just doesn't exist, and that's why he only talks to be people who are willing to imagine him talking to them.
 
M

Misty

Well-Known Member
yourhopeboundheart said:
maybe because if he's the god of the entire universe, created sand and stone, drop and sea, then he's a little bit bigger than the patriotic, in-group obsessed, tribal types of our depraved time and place. maybe his ego can be set aside for five seconds in order to extend a little, what do you call it? grace to somebody who might be using the gigantic brain he handed them to call into question a few of the weird quirks left in 'his' message.


or maybe he just doesn't exist, and that's why he only talks to be people who are willing to imagine him talking to them.
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Good post!
 
9-10ths_Penguin

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
Green Kepi said:
We agree on this then...Jesus said, "If you love me, keep my commandments"...from my perspective, that's doing what He said. I can believe in God all day long and unless I act on it...doesn't do me any good whatsoever. As for murders who make false claims on God's behalf...God will deal with them on the Last Day.

Pickton will receive his reward on that Day...its a shame Canada only could give him the maximum sentence for second-degree murder of 25 years...but...that's Canada, not God....
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Green Kepi said:
That's easy...no one. God is the one Supreme and Infinite Personal Being, the Creator and Ruler of the universe, to whom man owes obedience and worship. You call Biblical accounts "evil"; however, we are not the center of the universe, not the reference point against which goodness can be judged.

I know it sounds silly to you for me to even say that, but we all act and think as though God's goodness depends on how well we like what's going on.

None of us are in a position to judge the goodness or "so-called" evil of God's actions. We see too small a part of the overall picture - a picture that covers all of time and all of mankind.... :peace:
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I see an interesting contrast in these two posts of yours: on the one hand, apparently we're competent enough judges of morality that we can be held accountable for our moral failures. On the other hand, we're such incompetent judges of morality that our moral sense would lead us to conclude that an entirely moral God could act entirely immorally.

If we're as incompetent at judging morality as you imply, then how could it ever be just to then turn around and hold us accountable for decisions we made on the basis of that same shoddy moral sense?
 
Alceste

Alceste

Vagabond
Green Kepi said:
We agree on this then...Jesus said, "If you love me, keep my commandments"...from my perspective, that's doing what He said. I can believe in God all day long and unless I act on it...doesn't do me any good whatsoever. As for murders who make false claims on God's behalf...God will deal with them on the Last Day.

Pickton will receive his reward on that Day...its a shame Canada only could give him the maximum sentence for second-degree murder of 25 years...but...that's Canada, not God....


​
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Actually, the sentence is life X 6. He will be eligible for parole in 25 years, but the likelihood of him ever again seeing the outside of a prison is very small. An application would likely be rejected due to the danger to society, besides which, he's over 60 now.
 
Green Kepi

Green Kepi

Active Member
9-10ths_Penguin said:
I see an interesting contrast in these two posts of yours: on the one hand, apparently we're competent enough judges of morality that we can be held accountable for our moral failures. On the other hand, we're such incompetent judges of morality that our moral sense would lead us to conclude that an entirely moral God could act entirely immorally.

If we're as incompetent at judging morality as you imply, then how could it ever be just to then turn around and hold us accountable for decisions we made on the basis of that same shoddy moral sense?
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Not really a contrast...God is a fair judge and can see into our hearts and know our attitudes and our love for Him or lack thereof...that's why we cannot 'work' our way or be 'good' enough to make it on our own...He sent His Son to us and His Son is the one who "covers" our sorry excuses for doing good in this world...so...thru Jesus we are NOT held accountable for our moral failures....
 
javajo

javajo

Well-Known Member
Yeah, like where it says in 1 John 5-10:

Here is the message we have heard from him and announce to you. God is light. There is no darkness in him at all. Suppose we say that we share life with God but still walk in the darkness. Then we are lying. We are not living by the truth. But suppose we walk in the light, just as he is in the light. Then we share life with one another. And the blood of Jesus, his Son, makes us pure from all sin. Suppose we claim we are without sin. Then we are fooling ourselves. The truth is not in us. But God is faithful and fair. If we admit that we have sinned, he will forgive us our sins. He will forgive every wrong thing we have done. He will make us pure. If we say we have not sinned, we are calling God a liar. His word has no place in our lives.
 
Penumbra

Penumbra

Veteran Member
Premium Member
I prayed a lot when I was a theist, so when I deconverted I still prayed sometimes because it was a transitory phase. I prayed for guidance, for forgiveness, for truth, etc. though it was never helpful. Eventually I moved past that because I don't think it was very healthy of me to continue.
 
Green Kepi

Green Kepi

Active Member
Penumbra said:
I prayed a lot when I was a theist, so when I deconverted I still prayed sometimes because it was a transitory phase. I prayed for guidance, for forgiveness, for truth, etc. though it was never helpful. Eventually I moved past that because I don't think it was very healthy of me to continue.
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Sounds like what you went thru was what each and everyone of us goes thru at times. Like Jeremiah, in one of his chapters, he went thru 'getting mad at God, depressed...then had a 'mini' worship service and then back to wishing he had never been born...all in the same chapter...and this was a man who had no doubts at all about God's existence...Jeremiah actually heard Him speak! Maybe you found Him not to be very helpful because you were a theist and had no 'personal' relationship with Him....
 
Twilight Hue

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Penumbra said:
I prayed a lot when I was a theist, so when I deconverted I still prayed sometimes because it was a transitory phase. I prayed for guidance, for forgiveness, for truth, etc. though it was never helpful. Eventually I moved past that because I don't think it was very healthy of me to continue.
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Seems like you came across truth and guided yourself very well. Keep it up. -NM-
 
Falvlun

Falvlun

Earthbending Lemur
Premium Member
FlyingTeaPot said:
Sure you can. I pray to the sun. Plus its good to meditate now and then.
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Funny you should say that. Whenever I feel the urge to pray (usually because I'm unusally happy or grateful) I tend to want to direct it at the sun. I wonder if there isn't some basic instinct in us to "worship" the sun.
 
Danmac

Danmac

Well-Known Member
I know an atheist that prays to the flying spaghetti monster for free coupons to Papa Johns. His requests have been denied, because the fsm only does spaghetti dinners at Fazolis.
 
I Keep Unicorns

I Keep Unicorns

Member
I've prayed in desperate situations where I feel like I've run out of options. It's no more or less arrogant and fruitless than when theists do it - banking on the laws of nature to suddenly change in my selfish favour; - and I never feel rational when I do it.
 
painted wolf

painted wolf

Grey Muzzle
I think there is something inherent in human nature that makes us seek to "rig the odds" in our favor. It's just some of us have built up complex rituals and taboos to do so.

wa:do
 
Danmac

Danmac

Well-Known Member
Dear atheists
If you wan a subscription to knee mail, you must first become a kneemail member.
 
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Azakel

Azakel

Liebe ist für alle da
Danmac said:
Dear atheists
If you wan a subscription to knee mail, you must first become a member.
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I'm sorry but your religious view does not hold a monopoly on 'Knee Mail'(praying).
No Membership required ^_^
 
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Penumbra

Penumbra

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Green Kepi said:
Sounds like what you went thru was what each and everyone of us goes thru at times. Like Jeremiah, in one of his chapters, he went thru 'getting mad at God, depressed...then had a 'mini' worship service and then back to wishing he had never been born...all in the same chapter...and this was a man who had no doubts at all about God's existence...Jeremiah actually heard Him speak! Maybe you found Him not to be very helpful because you were a theist and had no 'personal' relationship with Him....
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Nah, not really. This phase lasted a few years, it wasn't just a mini thing. I hear the phrase personal relationship thrown around a lot but it's never sounded like something that actually exists.
 
Danmac

Danmac

Well-Known Member
Azakel said:
I'm sorry but your religious view does not hold a monopoly on 'Knee Mail'(praying).
No Membership required ^_^
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I paid big money for my membership. Pastor Deuteronomy Skaggs always says, "Don't make me holler, don't make me shout, just turn them pockets inside out".
 
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