Homosexuality and religious.

[KWED]

You "forgetting" to see the rest of the teaching that has a beautiful teaching of how to become a better human being.

In every debate, you pick only what you can find that you see as the worsed ofcthe worsed within religion.

You are not here to debate, you are here to find fault in everything you can.

Once again, the Jimmy Savile defence, so beloved of religionists.

If a person raises millions for charity, volunteers in hospitals, wins awards for public service, brings joy into many people's lives for decades - but he also rapes children occasionally... what should we judge him on?
Should we do as Bahalluah said and look only at his good deeds, not his bad. Do you do as you are suggesting and say yeah he was bad, but he was good as well, so it kinda cancels itself out? Or do we condemn him as a monster and prosecute and punish (given the chance)?

Come on, a straight answer please.

 

[KWED]

My wife is homosexual and she hasn't had sex outside of marriage. That doesn't mean that I condemn those who are homosexual and have had sex. I like to watch The Rachel Maddow show on MSNBC and she is openly homosexual, has a friend named Susan, and I really like her. Recently there has been a big shift in the US about homosexuals, and definitely they deserve not to be discriminated against.

So you think god is wrong to call homosexuality evil, immoral, a shameful sexual aberration that needs purging from the world, etc?

 

[KWED]

Well, is adultery 'natural' ???

Sex is natural.
Marriage isn't.

Is hate, envy, spite, greed etc 'natural' ???

Interesting question. I would say it depends.

Yes I am intolerance and prejudicial towards homosexuality,

why?

pederasty, beastiality

Way to go!

and sexualizing the few kids we have left in our aging and sick society.

Are you ok?

 

[KWED]

Racism is not a right way to act for an Baha'i.
I am extremely poor, and I care for those who has less than me.
Nice way to kick my face....both my parents died of cancer, and I did everything in my power to help them.

Hitchens wept.
Do I have to explain what an analogy is to you every time I use one?
What is it with Bahais on here? It's like none of them can access their basic critical faculties.

I'm wondering if it's a deliberate tactic to get me to just give up in despair (it is working BTW, although I know you don't have the capacity to formulate such a cunning plan )

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

So you think god is wrong to call homosexuality evil, immoral, a shameful sexual aberration that needs purging from the world, etc?

Here is something about reality and humans in it. Some religious believers read the text so it matches what makes sense to them.
And in the end, they believe differently than how you try to catch them.

As for me. I don't care if they are religious or not. I care if in practice we share the same values. The same with other atheists or no religion. I care about the real everyday values.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

Sex is natural.
Marriage isn't.
...

Depends on your understanding of natural. If we humans as animals are natural, then how can marriage be not natural? How do we do something, which is not natural. In effect you are doing a variant of ontological dualism as a weird dichotomy.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

The world is not yet ready to discuss these topics.

O SON OF SPIRIT! Noble have I created thee, yet thou hast abased thyself. Rise then unto that for which thou wast created.

"Hidden Words Bahá’u’lláh"

Regards Tony

 

[Trailblazer]

It is same to me if other people are gay or not. How can I judge them for what they are feeling is right for them.

Baha'is do not judge people for being homosexual just because there is a Baha'i Law that prohibits homosexual acts for Baha'is.
There is no logical connection whatsoever.

 

[Trailblazer]

but if you refuse to condemn or even criticise the homophobia in your religious teaching

There is no homophobia in the Baha'i teachings. There is only a Baha'i Law that prohibits homosexual acts for those who are Baha'is. THAT is not homophobia, not by any stretch of the imagination.

homophobia: dislike of or prejudice against gay people.
what is homophobia - Google Search

 

[Trailblazer]

There is no "neutral position" on things like homophobia, sexual discrimination and barbaric punishments.

There is no homophobia or sexual discrimination in the Baha'i Faith.
There are no barbaric punishments.

All we have in the Baha'i Faith are certain Laws that apply only to Baha'is.
What you think is sexual discrimination or a barbaric punishment is only a matter of your personal opinion, yet you state it as a fact.

 

[Trailblazer]

With all due respect, if someone condones homophobia the problem is with them, not the person calling them out on it.

I suggest you consult a dictionary as well as book on logic.
There is no logical connection between a Baha'i Law that prohibits Baha'is from engaging in homosexual acts and homophobia.

homophobia: dislike of or prejudice against gay people.
what is homophobia - Google Search

I am a Baha'i and I have no dislike or prejudice against gay people.

 

[Trailblazer]

But your perfect god and his perfect messenger judge them, and they condemn them - so how can you then disagree with them?

Nope, God does not judge or condemn homosexuals simply because there is a Baha'i Law prohibiting Baha'is from engaging in homosexual acts.

 

[Trailblazer]

So the world is divided into those who are positively in favor of homosexual acts as a morally good thing to participate in and those who are homophobic?

No.

 

[Trailblazer]

If your religion calls homosexuality "immoral", "evil", "shameful aberration" that needs "purging from the world"

But the Baha'i Faith never called homosexuality such. You took what is written on homosexuality and twisted the meaning to suit your purposes. What else is new?

 

[RAYYAN]

There is no homophobia or sexual discrimination in the Baha'i Faith.
There are no barbaric punishments.

All we have in the Baha'i Faith are certain Laws that apply only to Baha'is.
What you think is sexual discrimination or a barbaric punishment is only a matter of your personal opinion, yet you state it as a fact.

Let me ask this
- What happens to a Baha'i if he or she is homosexual?
- If there is no punishment, does it mean it is ok to be gay in Baha'i?
- If there is punishment or discouragement of being gay in Baha'i, does it mean it is not ok?

 

[Trailblazer]

the world is divided into those who see no problem with homosexuality, and those who are homophobic?

There, fixed that for ya.

I can hardly believe that anyone could be THAT illogical.
I suggest that you look up the definition of homophobic.

The Black-or-White Fallacy is the provision of only two alternatives in an argument when there are actually more options available. ... It's also sometimes called the Gray Fallacy, between black and white options, or the middle-ground fallacy, after a middle ground between two warring camps.
black and white fallacy examples in politics - nazwa.pl

 

[Trailblazer]

So you admit that god's law is homophobic,

@Seeker of White Light admitted no such thing. That's your gig, speaking for other people and what they think.

 

[Trailblazer]

You are clearly troubled by it.

You don't know what anyone else except yourself is 'troubled by.'

 

[Trailblazer]

This isn't about what you would do if you were gay. It's about whether god's rules are morally acceptable.

And who is the judge of what is morally acceptable?

 

[Trailblazer]

No, it is absolutely about cherry-picked scripture.
There are specific passages that are blatantly homophobic.

No, there are no such scriptures in the Baha'i Faith.
There is only your distorted interpretation of Baha'i scriptures.