How can a Jew reject Jesus as the Messiah?

[rosends]

Numbers 27:8 And unto the children of Israel thou shalt speak, saying: If a man die, and have no son, then ye shall cause his inheritance to pass unto his daughter.

Mary had no brothers, so the inheritance passed to Mary.

An inheritance of land in Israel. There was also a law requiring that they marry within the tribe to ensure that when their inheritance went to their husband, the land stayed within the tribe. That's what this is about -- not any other issue of lineage. The daughter of a priest didn't pass that lineage to her children.

 

[Skywalker]

Amd this is why I have a habit of saying Jews have the Tanakh and Christians have the OT. Their beliefs and interpretations are so very different they may as well be reading different books.

Jewish people believe in the devil. I read a book by a Jewish doctor about OCD and he said it's goal is to steal, kill, and destroy. As a doctor he couldn't talk about God and the devil, so he worded his point about the spiritual nature of OCD in subtle terms.

 

[Ehav4Ever]

It doesn't really matter if the word is ka'aru or ka'ari. Let's make the assumption that the correct translation is, 'like a lion at my hands and feet.' What is this lion doing with the victim's hands and feet-licking them? Rashi says it means 'as though they are crushed in a lion's mouth.' Another prominent Jewish commentator, Metsudat David, said, '

So, you are now using Rashi. Do you agree with everything Rashi and Metsudat wrote?

 

[ayin]

Actually, not all ancient Taw's looked like a lower case t or a + sign. Some looked like an X.

Besides, Jehovah Witnesses claim that Jesus was crusified on a T shape wooden structure. So, which Christian version is right? Only the Romans know how they did that and we know that hundreds of thousands of Jews were crusified by the Romans.

It was a cross, please just ignore the Jehovah's Witnesses.

 

[rosends]

The laws of lineage are not black and white there are gray areas.

Sure there are -- dealt with in Jewish law, not in anyone's imagination.

 

[Skywalker]

and you and your cousins establish normative Jewish law how, again?

That situation shows the gray areas with what defines immediate family.

 

[Skywalker]

So, you are now using Rashi. Do you agree with everything Rashi and Metsudat wrote?

No. I question even what my pastor says at times.

 

[Skywalker]

Sure there are -- dealt with in Jewish law, not in anyone's imagination.

Not all halacha is from the Tanakh-some of it is from rabbis, and rabbis are like pastors in that people often question what their leaders teach. They are not infallible.

 

[rosends]

That situation shows the gray areas with what defines immediate family.

No, it shows the areas that you don't understand and try to claim are gray because you want the law to allow what you need. There are very few laws in Judaism that depend on the vague idea of "immediate family." Deciding that inheritance is one of them is your personal decision. That doesn't change laws.

 

[rosends]

Not all halacha is from the Tanakh-some of it is from rabbis, and rabbis are like pastors in that people often question what their leaders teach. They are not infallible.

And the idea that a woman inherits is from the Tanach, but according to the tanach, it only relates to land in Israel. So you are inventing something else which isn't from any Jewish authority. Why should anyone listen to your opinion?

 

[Skywalker]

No, it shows the areas that you don't understand and try to claim are gray because you want the law to allow what you need. There are very few laws in Judaism that depend on the vague idea of "immediate family." Deciding that inheritance is one of them is your personal decision. That doesn't change laws.

Cousins being immediate family is a gray area. In Bible times they married, in modern times and maybe even in the past there are situations where they grow up kind of like brother and sister. First cousins aren't exactly close relatives but they aren't distant relatives either.

 

[ayin]

Yes, a cross. But as I pointed out, accepting the cross from Jesus could be a sign/seal of wickedness.

"the letter tav, that it was inscribed on the foreheads of the righteous? Rav said: Tav is the first letter of the word tiḥye, you shall live, indicating that the righteous shall live. Tav is also the first letter of the word tamut, you shall die, indicating that the wicked shall die. And Shmuel said: The letter tav is the first letter of the word tama, ceased…"

The cross is not a bad thing, it is always used positively in the Hebrew Bible. Ezekiel is an example, but the meaning of Cain is even deeper. When Cain killed his brother, and God punished him for it, he asked God for mercy, fearing to be killed himself. God then made a sign on Cain's forehead so that he would be saved from it. What kind of sign was this? Here it is not the word Tav, but the word Oth, this word consists of the three letters Alef, Vav and Tav. These three letters(words) are names of the alphabet, and accordingly have their own meanings. Alef(ox head) is the first letter and symbolizes the highest rank and stands for strength, it means God. The Hebrew words like Eloah and Elohim begin with the letter Alef. Vav represents a nail. And Tav, as I said, is a cross. If we combine all three it means "God is nailed to the cross". So what God made on the forehead of Cain was the image of a cross on which Jesus hung. A powerful image. Again, the cross is salvation.

 

[ayin]

 

[dybmh]

The cross is not a bad thing, it is always used positively in the Hebrew Bible. Ezekiel is an example, but the meaning of Cain is even deeper. When Cain killed his brother, and God punished him for it, he asked God for mercy, fearing to be killed himself. God then made a sign on Cain's forehead so that he would be saved from it. What kind of sign was this? Here it is not the word Tav, but the word Oth, this word consists of the three letters Alef, Vav and Tav. These three letters(words) are names of the alphabet, and accordingly have their own meanings. Alef(ox head) is the first letter and symbolizes the highest rank and stands for strength, it means God. The Hebrew words like Eloah and Elohim begin with the letter Alef. Vav represents a nail. And Tav, as I said, is a cross. If we combine all three it means "God is nailed to the cross". So what God made on the forehead of Cain was the image of a cross on which Jesus hung. A powerful image. Again, the cross is salvation.

Hmmm.

The weak point of this, imho, is that the vav represents a nail. Do you have a Jewish source to support that part?

 

[Rival]

The only people who believe stuff like this are people who are already convinced.

 

[Ehav4Ever]

It was a cross, please just ignore the Jehovah's Witnesses.

Oh. So do you agree with everything on the Ancient Hebrew site? Also, can you show me a text where it looks like a the symbol in the first slot to the left above? Also, can you explain why the NT was written in Greek rather than of the scripts above?

Further, why should I accept your statement about ignoring the JW's? They could say that same about your information. Can you show me a 1st to 2nd century Roman era cross that supports your claim?

 

[Skywalker]

That's a typo based on wishful thinking on the part of Christians.

What of the Christians labeling an angel of god as evil, rebellious, and elevated to a status of very tremendous power to rival god's?

The stunning picture of the righteous sufferer in Psalm 22, the haunting portrait of the suffering servant in Isaiah 53, the prophecies that had to be fulfilled before the second temple's demise-all of it, down to the predicted details of the priestly king and his ancestry and his birthplace and his crucifixion and his ongoing worldwide influence, was too eerily accurate to be the product of happenstance or manipulation.

 

[Tumah]

That's fascinating, so in Judaism the Messiah doesn't have to be a 'real' king either.

I'm saying that I think there's leeway there. He needs to be a ruler representing the House of David. But does he necessarily need to have a throne with subjects? That could go either way as far as I know.

Is there a way this knowledge would be restored in the future? How would that lineage ever be demonstrated about the future Messiah?

We expect that Elijah will restore this knowledge among other lost things.

So does this mean that a person cannot be righteous, in the Jewish view, unless they have kids?

A Jewish person can't be righteous unless they're trying to have children. If they're not trying, then it's an annulment of a positive commandment. Of course, this is assuming circumstances permit getting married. Someone who dies at 24, but spend the last 6 years running for his life isn't in a position to have children, and that's just out of his hands.

 

[ayin]

Hmmm.

The weak point of this, imho, is that the vav represents a nail. Do you have a Jewish source to support that part?

The definition of the hebrew word Vav is nail. Strong's #2053 - וָו - Old Testament Hebrew Lexicon

 

[rosends]

Cousins being immediate family is a gray area. In Bible times they married, in modern times and maybe even in the past there are situations where they grow up kind of like brother and sister. First cousins aren't exactly close relatives but they aren't distant relatives either.

None of this changes Jewish law.