Socialism: evil impact

[Stevicus]

I'm fine with government ensuring health care for all.
But we don't need to become socialist to do that.

If this was the 1980s and you said you supported government ensuring health care for all, you would have been booed off the Morton Downey Jr. Show for being a socialist.

 

[Stevicus]

Could you do the same comparison in a real socialist country.....let's say N Korea?

Do you see any difference between communist countries and socialist countries?

 

[Stevicus]

Argumentum ad 1950ism, eh.

So is anti-communism.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

I disagree. Having a "strong welfare state" is not synonymous with socialism. Sweden is still capitalist, and liberal, with open markets. These are not consistent with socialism.

Capitalism and socialism are not mutually exclusive. The isolation of one to the exclusion of the other is unreasonable. If we held capitalism to the same standards, nothing but the most unregulated markets would be 'capitalist.' All are gradients on a mixed economic line. And workers democratically deciding that more capitol goes towards social programs with strong limitations on private enterprise control of worker subsidies is absolutely in line with socialism. (Although, again, not all forms of socialism are market socialism.)

Debunking a False Dichotomy: Capitalism and Socialism are Not Mutually Exclusive

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

Capitalism and socialism are not mutually exclusive. The isolation of one to the exclusion of the other is unreasonable. If we held capitalism to the same standards, nothing but the most unregulated markets would be 'capitalist.' All are gradients on a mixed economic line. And workers democratically deciding that more capitol goes towards social programs with strong limitations on private enterprise control of worker subsidies is absolutely in line with socialism. (Although, again, not all forms of socialism are market socialism.)

Debunking a False Dichotomy: Capitalism and Socialism are Not Mutually Exclusive

I was, of course, referring to "socialism" in the way that most of the terrified American right thinks of it -- which is, let's be honest, essentially communism.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

I was, of course, referring to "socialism" in the way that most of the terrified American right thinks of it -- which is, let's be honest, essentially communism.

Very true.

 

[Nakosis]

Having production controlled by the workers doesn't mean anarchy. Any more than having the production controlled by private enterprises does.

Ok, I disagree, in the true sense of the word. Anarchy has a lot of negative baggage with I'm not really trying to push here. Having no recognized authority over the worker. Private ownership is basically the other end of the spectrum, a dictatorship.

 

[Nakosis]

I was, of course, referring to "socialism" in the way that most of the terrified American right thinks of it -- which is, let's be honest, essentially communism.

Yeah, Communism an authoritative form of socialism.

The fear is socialism devolving into communism because trying to create a stable economy with socialism is like trying to herd a bunch of cats.

Socialism​

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Could you do the same comparison in a real socialist country.....let's say N Korea?

By this standard Lenin wasn't a "real" Communist, and certainly no Marxist with his retaining a system of money and market exchange.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

Yeah, Communism an authoritative form of socialism.

The fear is socialism devolving into communism because trying to create a stable economy with socialism is like trying to herd a bunch of cats.

Socialism​

First, that is my favourite advertisement of all time, bar none. Too good for words. (They did 2 more: running of the squirrels -- like running of the bulls in Pamplona -- and building a plane in flight. Both fun, look them up. But not as good as the cats.)

Second, I appreciate your use of the word "authoritative," because that really does help to differentiate all these political divides we think we have. That is why I like the "Political Compass" so much more than party labels, or simple notions of "left" and "right."

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Yeah, Communism an authoritative form of socialism.

The fear is socialism devolving into communism because trying to create a stable economy with socialism is like trying to herd a bunch of cats.

Socialism​

And all the while some places continually become increasingly socialist.

 

[Yerda]

Right...& neither were the old PRC or USSR.
But exemplary countries with capitalist market economies are.

I'm not saying that.

 

[Nakosis]

And all the while some places continually become increasingly socialist.

Plenty of opportunities for them there cat wanglers.

 

[Audie]

So is anti-communism.

Being anti communist is out of date?

 

[Audie]

Plenty of opportunities for them there cat wanglers.

Mighty long ears on them cats

 

[Revoltingest]

Whilst you're right, at some levels I struggle to think of America as anything other than 'First World-ish' these days.

Was that an accidental compliment?

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Was that an accidental compliment?

Sadly no. It might be mistaken (since I'm squinting from a distance) but it wasn't intended as a compliment.
Never mind that calling anyone 'First World' has all sorts of issues I'd readily acknowledge.

 

[Revoltingest]

If this was the 1980s and you said you supported government ensuring health care for all, you would have been booed off the Morton Downey Jr. Show for being a socialist.

I'm always being booed for something.

 

[Revoltingest]

Do you see any difference between communist countries and socialist countries?

Are/were there any communist (distinct from socialist) countries?

 

[Revoltingest]

So is anti-communism.

I for one did not....
- Rat out any commie pals.
- Deny having hammers & sickles.
- Fight commies in any wars.
- Ever shun my commie friends for being commies.