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The ends justify the means?
- Thread starter 74x12
- Start date
Oh no one agrees with that it's nonsense. He didn't mean it literally its a metaphor for "anyone who disagrees with you is a corrupt tree everyone who agrees with you is a good tree"... Basic evangelical teaching. Simple!!!!!
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
What the heck is that supposed to mean?
Help me to understand how you're interpreting this. While I had a couple of fruit trees in the yard as a kid, I'm not familiar with running an orchard.
stvdv
Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
Must be true if said so in the Bible:
So I must conclude from this verse, that the parents are to blame if children go haywire
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Thief
Rogue Theologian
so the great flood was for nothing?
Thief
Rogue Theologian
not so fast......
decades ago.....a neighbor's son would come around to play with my kids
that boy was a problem
he grew up
and then he robbed a store
and killed the attendant behind the counter
he will spend the rest of his life behind bars
as if he was 'put together' that way
Oh you are shifting off accepted dogma trying to engage In a nuanced discussion that's actually a forum violation.. . Lol...
Joking aside Interesting problem isn't it!! Can criminality be like homo sexuality a neurological issue. What isn't clear are there identical neurology types that don't act out? I would say yes just based on a variety of known neurology types who can act out in positive or negative ways. An autistic kid can act out positive or negative as one example.
So the "bad apple" literally might not be correct or at least from what we currently understand anyway. Certain types do tend to have incredibly low empathy tendencies and that can lead to criminality tendencies. But in some cases leadership is enhanced because of that trait. I think they call it psychopathic or sociopathic. They may actually be identical neurologically with different outcomes. Interesting question.
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
No. I actually agree with that verse. Good doesnt foster bad; bad doesnt foster good. How does The Dharma put it: The beautiful kings and chariots wear out. This body, too, undergoes decay. But the Dharma of the good does not decay. So the good proclaim with the good.
Shushersbedamned
Well-Known Member
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber
In the end, it's all a matter of perspective.
Actually I insulted majority of evangelicalism!!!! OK so why is reading comprehension so low in church folks exactly? You know the text really isn't conducive to low reading comprehension!!!! I have a theology degree from an evangelical university ok free methodist, and I know factually that my theology professors had an incredibly low reading comprehension of the text. I don't get it actually too many revivals or just theology in general?
74x12
Well-Known Member
It will be evil if they used evil methods to advance their cause. That's because you reap what you sow. So whoever sows evil seed is going to harvest the evil they planted. You can't advance a "good" cause with evil methods. It will always be evil and corrupt. Even if you still want it to be good. You have to use only good methods if you want something to be good.
Shushersbedamned
Well-Known Member
Do the ends justfy the means?
Of course not... Or more precisely is doing evil justifiable? Isn't evil itself always justified in its own mind? I mean darth vader justifies his turn to evil and becoming darth vader based on some concept of he was doing a good. Isn't that the nature of evil? self deception?
Now we could get into bonhoeffer but that would be way beyond an Internet forum. Heard of him? He wrote a book called the cost of discipleship. Seems to not be well known today or totally ignored.
Cooky
Veteran Member
I don't know... I just finished reading the play Elektra, by Sophocles, and I have to admit that attaining justice sometimes requires an evil act.
In the play, Elektra (a princess) mourns her fathers death, where her mother actually had her father (the king) killed by her mothers lover. The mother then enslaves her older daughter, celebrates her sons death, and tries to imprison Elektra all while having new children with her new lover -essentially attempting to destroy an entire generation.
But Elektras brother actually faked his death, and with Elektras help, they ultimately kill their mother and then in the end, their mothers lover... That's justice. It was illegal as heck, but it was so right.
You can read the whole play here, originally written in 409 BC, translated from Greek to English. It was good!
Sophocles (c.496–c.406 BC) - Electra: Translated by George Theodoridis
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Shushersbedamned
Well-Known Member
Yet you insult the bible
stvdv
Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
Sometimes the ends justify the means [if the intention is good]:
It's obviously not always black and white. What is good for one is bad for another. One person's death is other person's bread. Thorn needed to remove thorn
Killer uses a knife to cut and cause pain as a bad act. Surgeon uses a knife to cut and cause pain BUT as a good act. Nice surgeon uses anesthesia.
It's okay to kill a killer if you can prevent him to kill you IMO.
It's okay to **** a rapist if you can prevent him to **** you IMO.
It's okay to let killer kill you if you believe in God that He will save you
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