People need to stop misrepresenting trump

[Revoltingest]

You're problems with Hillary are what again?
Tom

I am problems with Hillary?
Whuh?

 

[columbus]

I am problems with Hillary?
Whuh?

Here let me rephrase it so a Trump supporting language snob can understand.
Your problems with Hillary are what again?
Tom
Maybe you should stick to easier things like anagrams.

 

[Revoltingest]

Here let me rephrase it so a Trump supporting language snob can understand.

I prefer to be called a "sanctimonious annoying pedant".

Your problems with Hillary are what again?
Tom
Maybe you should stick to easier things like anagrams.

The only way to learn you how to write good was to not answer your request until you properly rephrased it.
And your response was splendid!

I've oft stated my major problems with Hilda.....
- Most important......her penchant for war. She's a hawk.
- Big government
- Tax increases
- Bad economic policies (This one applies to Trump too)
- Weak on civil liberties (Ditto for Trump)

 

[fantome profane]

I am problems with Hillary?
Whuh?

Your a grammar nazi .

 

[Revoltingest]

Your a grammar nazi .

Your darn toot'n!

 

[First Baseman]

Your a grammar nazi .

He aint no nazi. How bout you folk speak da Queen's English?

 

[serp777]

I think that Trump and his supporters should stop whining about the media and his opposition stooping down low to the bar he himself sets.

Well that's a great recommendation for trump supporters. Also aren't you just whining about people "whining" about the media at this point?

 

[serp777]

You're problems with Hillary are what again?
Tom

I'm jumping in.

1. She constantly lies. For example, Just a few years ago she was against gay marriage. Now she's the champion of the LGBT community.

2. She has way too many ties to big money, which basically own her.
3. She has coluded with the DNC against Bernie Sanders.
4. As Obama's ad said, "She'll say anything, and change nothing."
5. She has been involved in way too many scandals.
6. She let Bill Clinton cheat on her with many, many women and then attacked the women by calling them liars and a number of other names.
7. Benghazi.
8. She and Obama did a horrible job during the Arab spring.
9. She's unnecceserily hostile towards Putin, thus dispalying her horrible diplomatic skills.
10. She doesn't understand basic internet security--she put classified emails on an unsecure server, which was then hacked. If she can't even handle some emails then she can't handle the presidency. She lacks an understanding of computers and the internet.
11. Her push as first lady for universal health care was a complete failure.
12. Hillary and Bill Clinton manipulated the DA and the FBI in order to prevent any possible criminal action against her.
13. NAFTA
14. And obviously a lot more.

 

[serp777]

It stands to reason that if you truly want people to stop misrepresenting Trump, you would provide reliable citations for his words. Isn't the entire point that we shouldn't just take some random yokel's claim about what he did and didn't say? It very, very much matters - that whole providing citations from reputed journalistic sources thing.

No, it doesn't. A citation has nothing to do with whether something is misrepresented or not. In fact, some sources are actually mispresenting him. If i wanted to mispresent him then all I have to do is quote the right source. Just because there's a citation doesn't mean its an accurate representation, and just because there's no citation doesn't mean its not a completely correct representation. As long as its correct, a citation isn't necessary for one small quote. Again, its completely pointless and everyone can look it up easily if they so choose. But anyways you shouldn't just accept my claim. Go watch a youtube video of him saying it.

Lastly, no, that's not the entire point. The entire point had nothign to do with accepting some random yokel's claim. The point was that far too many people are mispresenting him with sjw buzzwords like mysognistic, racist, homophobic, transphobic, etc. If you can quote people accurately then no, I think a citation is unecessary overhead.

 

[oldbadger]

All the time I see many people constantly misrepresenting trump. He does say many questionable things and lies quite a bit, just like Hillary Clinton, but a lot of people just straight up lie and mis quote him entirely. One of the first things people bring up is that Trump is a racist because he said that Mexicans are rapists. That is a complete fabrication. First of all Mexican isn't a race, so that isn't racist. He's not saying people with brown skin are rapists. Here's what he actually said.

SO here's he's actually talking about illegal immigrants, not all Mexican immigrants. And then he says, some I assume are good people. This is a dubious claim at best, but its not a reflection of racism in any sense. I'm sure that a small minority of illegal immigrants are rapists, although I couldn't say the percentage. Everyone seems to misquote this all the time.

There's also the thing about the Mexican judge, where people again call Trump a racist because he doubted that the judge with Mexican ancestry was completely unbiased. Trump of course doesn't have the knowledge to claim whether the judge is actually biased or not, but once again Mexican isn't a race, and doubting the neutrality of one person doesn't make him doubt the neutrality of all Mexicans. I see misrepresentations like this all the time and people who misquote politicians are just as bad liars as Trump and Hillary.

Well you didn't....... misrepresent Mr Trump..... did you?!
You straight out called him a liar........ so that's ok then?

One point. To call Mexicans any group of Mexicans rapists, in a sweeping statement, may not be a racist comment, but it sure is a bigoted one!

I don't know if Mr Trump might win the Presidency, or possibly Mrs Clinton, but you're sure going to get the President that you deserve after the treatment that's been dished out to President Obama over the last eight years. You just don't know what you've got 'til it's gone!

 

[HonestJoe]

All the time I see many people constantly misrepresenting trump. He does say many questionable things and lies quite a bit, just like Hillary Clinton, but a lot of people just straight up lie and mis quote him entirely.

Political operators and supporters have always misrepresented the politicians they oppose (and the ones they support for that matter). Most politicians take great care with their public statements and policies because of that. Trump has chosen to take a different approach and has a very different style which has won him a lot of support but also opens him to more challenges and misrepresentation.

I personally suspect he quite deliberately makes some of these borderline and unclear statements very much wanting to trigger the extreme responses because he believes (rightly or not) that this works for him politically, such as in the very manner you’re demonstrating.

First of all Mexican isn't a race, so that isn't racist.

Something of a side point but this is a fuzzy area. There’s no definitive definition of race and “racism” as commonly used doesn’t directly relate to any such definition. Discrimination on grounds of national origin is commonly recognised as “racism”, even in actual laws relating to it. Regardless of what you call it, treating people poorly because of their national origin is no better than treating them badly because of their actual “race” (however you choose to define it) so this in itself strikes me as no defence what so ever.

SO here's he's actually talking about illegal immigrants, not all Mexican immigrants. And then he says, some I assume are good people.

Well, he was referring to people coming from Mexico (actually, he said “being sent”, which is a whole separate issue) and didn’t specify illegal immigrants. The general impression from his statement was that most if not all Mexicans moving to America are bad. The “assume some are good people” sounds either like an afterthought (because he realised how he was sounding) or a deliberate back-handed compliment (“assuming” and “some” sounds good in passing but still leaves “most” or, if his “assumption” is wrong, “all”).

This is a dubious claim at best, but its not a reflection of racism in any sense.

Actually it’s impossible to know whether his (or anyone’s) statements are a reflection of racism or not. To say Trump is definitely racist on the basis of this statement is wrong but to state that he definitely isn’t on the basis of your reassessment of it is equally wrong. We do know, as you acknowledge, he made a dubious claim and we do know that there is a not insignificant proportion of people who do hold discriminatory opinions against Mexicans so regardless of what Trump truly believes himself, he knows saying bad things about Mexicans will appeal to many potential voters. Again, all the other politicians do similar things, he’s just not as polished at it.

There's also the thing about the Mexican judge, where people again call Trump a racist because he doubted that the judge with Mexican ancestry was completely unbiased.

That’s pretty much the same thing thought actually much more blatant. He did make it very clear the judge’s ancestry was the sole reason for questioning his professional independence. Again, that doesn’t need to be actual racism to be wrong. I’ve no idea whether that was a political tactic as above, a legal tactic to support any future appeal against a judgement against him or simply a fundamental discriminatory attitude. Either way, it does raise a question of how a President Trump would be able to work with the vast number of people of Mexican origin throughout government and related structures.

 

[serp777]

Well you didn't....... misrepresent Mr Trump..... did you?!
You straight out called him a liar........ so that's ok then?

One point. To call Mexicans any group of Mexicans rapists, in a sweeping statement, may not be a racist comment, but it sure is a bigoted one!

I don't know if Mr Trump might win the Presidency, or possibly Mrs Clinton, but you're sure going to get the President that you deserve after the treatment that's been dished out to President Obama over the last eight years. You just don't know what you've got 'til it's gone!

Uhh Trump can be a liar and people can mispresent him. They aren't mutually exclusive.

 

[McBell]

Well that's a great recommendation for trump supporters. Also aren't you just whining about people "whining" about the media at this point?

Yes,because one post stating an opinion is considered whining.

In case you missed it, that was sarcasm.

 

[Quintessence]

In fact, some sources are actually mispresenting him. If i wanted to mispresent him then all I have to do is quote the right source. Just because there's a citation doesn't mean its an accurate representation, and just because there's no citation doesn't mean its not a completely correct representation. As long as its correct, a citation isn't necessary for one small quote.

Well, since you can't be bothered to provide citations, we have no idea if it's correct. You haven't provided any resources for us to fact-check you. Which, sorry, but to my mind, makes you guilty of the exact same things that you're complaining about. That, and it is standard practice to provide citations whenever you quote something that is not your own words... precisely so that the reader can fact-check the writer's references (and there's the whole plagiarism thing I suppose).

 

[suncowiam]

Who needs to misrepresent what Trump says, when he misrepresents himself, consistently.

I have no idea what he really means.

"Let's build a wall and get Mexico to pay for it." Uhm... Ok? How is that going to fix the immigration issue? One can't seriously expect that a wall is going to fix this? And is one seriously expecting Mexico to pay for a wall? I mean, is he being literal or figurative? Is he joking or is he serious? I don't support illegal immigration either and would love to understand the details of how this will be fixed. Is he deporting all illegal immigrants? How is he actually preventing more from entering the country. I can't believe that a wall will fix this.

He insinuates that Mrs. Khan is being coerced to be quiet because of her Muslim heritage. He never out right declares it. What does he exactly mean when he's suggesting that Mrs. Khan is not speaking at all? That she's being submissive? That her husband is oppressing his wife? That Muslims oppresses females? That the DNC is supporting sexism? And then, what the heck does this have to do with the original topic that Mr. Khan presented concerning Trump. It had nothing to do with the initial criticism. It's obfuscating and reflecting the subject.

Another example is the 2nd amendment and what can be done with Clinton. God dang it! Why do I and others have to debate this stupid quote. Seriously... We have millions of folks debating a stupid quote to understand the subject. Talk about making ado about nothing. This takes away from the real discussions. I don't want to spend time debating the meaning of a quote. I want to debate actual rhetoric.

Now he's calling Obama the founder of ISIS. Ok, I have to guess why he's suggesting this instead of being presented with further details on the matter. One could make an argument here but there are no further data. Let's assume that Obama was the mastermind of ISIS, then what? What is he going to do about fixing it? He's pointing the finger but not suggesting any resolution.

I said this before in a different thread, he's speaks too indirectly about the subjects. I don't know what to make of him and his policies. If he wants me to understand his proposals to fix this nation then he needs to get more specific than just saying "I'll fix it!"

It's all too ambiguous for me. He's banking on the "change" and "outsider" niches of politics, but what change is actually coming? I honestly have no idea. I'm not absorbing anything from Trump to understand his policies. Actually, I'm only referring that the GOP's constitutions to understand any possibly policies that will be in place if Trump wins the office.

Just because something is different, doesn't necessarily make it better.

 

[columbus]

Noted "old school" conservative George F Will does a good job with this subject:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...6_story.html?tid=a_inl&utm_term=.4f75aec9bebe

Tom

 

[suncowiam]

Here is Trump's own quote to best describe his style.

"obviously being sarcastic — but not that sarcastic, to be honest with you"

I still don't know what the heck he's trying to say and that quote was supposed to clear up what he meant with Obama. Did it?

 

[McBell]

My impression is that Trump never meant for it to go this far.
I cannot help but wonder if he is scared he might actually win.

 

[ShivaFan]

We have never had such a candidate more in tune with the issues, more clear about a response to the issues and detailed on how to improve the economy and jobs, secure our national safety and our borders, and speaks to these issues and responds to these issues in detail, often for hours each day extensively in the public venue, yet the anti-Trump agenda simply refuses to cover what he actually says and instead uses selective out takes to spin an agenda of character defamation and the lie that he doesn’t address the specifics when he is actually unprecedented in such clarity and response and detail.

The Never Trump agenda is really and exclusively about the amnesty, open borders and cheap labor for their benefactors and nothing else. For example, to the Republican establishment (which is the same as the Democrat establishment) it does not matter if Hillary will dramatically increase taxes and regulation on the middle class and businesses that provide for the GDP, nor that she will increase the national debt, destroy the middle class and jobs, attack the police and federalize the police on false narratives of racism, divide the country by race, nothing matters to the actual agenda of the anti-Trump genre but what is the most important to them of all and that is amnesty, open borders and cheap labor that displaces Americans and jobs with foreigners, they do not even care about capitalism which they pretend they favor nor democracy, they only care about cheap labor for their Chamber of Commerce crowd benefactors and nothing else, and because Hillary will bring in more cheap labor, more amnesty, more open borders, they now support Hillary and have attacked Trump from day one when Trump said he would build a wall. That was his unforgivable crime in the eyes of the establishment.

That is what is going on here. The true 1 percenters of Google, Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, et all in IT will displace every American from an IT job with cheap foreign labor, even have the insult to force them to train their replacements or receive no severance, and the other 1 percenters for Hillary will get their cheap labor, flood Texas with hordes of illegal criminal and illiterates who will vote Democrat and turn Texas from Red to Blue and the entire country into a government class totalitarian state.

It will become Venezuela. There is no answer from politicians. Only levels of corruption. Nor is Trump perfect, and if you want someone perfect then you are the perfect candidate for a cult. There is no utopia, and forget “solutions”, there is only a better of the choices and some real bad choices, and there is no question that the reason Trump is attacked with such nonsense that really, don’t believe the polls, is looking quite comical and more comical each day to the average American, is because he is a threat to the establishment.

There is nothing more obvious. They hated Trump and went on the attack against him from day one during the primaries, right off when the entire primary season began, because Trump said he would build a wall, secure the borders, because Trump is for the American worker and American jobs instead of selling out America to global cheap labor.

They ran attack after attack, spin poll after poll during the Republican primary season, Jeb Bush was their guy, but no matter what they tried and lied and polled and cast Trump as, they failed to take him down. Now they will sell out even all of the issues they claimed in the past to support regarding too much taxation and regulation, national security, any chance for economic recovery for the middle class and jobs, they will now vote for and support Hillary Clinton simply because Hillary will bring in more hordes of foreigners and give amnesty and open borders and global cheap labor for the benefactors of such cheap labor that is the one and only issue for these Republican establishment and their toadies.

But, this is like no other election cycle. You will see. Trump’s support is YUGE. It is out there. It is going to make a difference. They will not stop it. This is actually going to be fun. Just watch what is coming next.

 

[bobhikes]

We have never had such a candidate more in tune with the issues, more clear about a response to the issues and detailed on how to improve the economy and jobs, secure our national safety and our borders, and speaks to these issues and responds to these issues in detail, often for hours each day extensively in the public venue, yet the anti-Trump agenda simply refuses to cover what he actually says and instead uses selective out takes to spin an agenda of character defamation and the lie that he doesn’t address the specifics when he is actually unprecedented in such clarity and response and detail.

The Never Trump agenda is really and exclusively about the amnesty, open borders and cheap labor for their benefactors and nothing else. For example, to the Republican establishment (which is the same as the Democrat establishment) it does not matter if Hillary will dramatically increase taxes and regulation on the middle class and businesses that provide for the GDP, nor that she will increase the national debt, destroy the middle class and jobs, attack the police and federalize the police on false narratives of racism, divide the country by race, nothing matters to the actual agenda of the anti-Trump genre but what is the most important to them of all and that is amnesty, open borders and cheap labor that displaces Americans and jobs with foreigners, they do not even care about capitalism which they pretend they favor nor democracy, they only care about cheap labor for their Chamber of Commerce crowd benefactors and nothing else, and because Hillary will bring in more cheap labor, more amnesty, more open borders, they now support Hillary and have attacked Trump from day one when Trump said he would build a wall. That was his unforgivable crime in the eyes of the establishment.

That is what is going on here. The true 1 percenters of Google, Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, et all in IT will displace every American from an IT job with cheap foreign labor, even have the insult to force them to train their replacements or receive no severance, and the other 1 percenters for Hillary will get their cheap labor, flood Texas with hordes of illegal criminal and illiterates who will vote Democrat and turn Texas from Red to Blue and the entire country into a government class totalitarian state.

It will become Venezuela. There is no answer from politicians. Only levels of corruption. Nor is Trump perfect, and if you want someone perfect then you are the perfect candidate for a cult. There is no utopia, and forget “solutions”, there is only a better of the choices and some real bad choices, and there is no question that the reason Trump is attacked with such nonsense that really, don’t believe the polls, is looking quite comical and more comical each day to the average American, is because he is a threat to the establishment.

There is nothing more obvious. They hated Trump and went on the attack against him from day one during the primaries, right off when the entire primary season began, because Trump said he would build a wall, secure the borders, because Trump is for the American worker and American jobs instead of selling out America to global cheap labor.

They ran attack after attack, spin poll after poll during the Republican primary season, Jeb Bush was their guy, but no matter what they tried and lied and polled and cast Trump as, they failed to take him down. Now they will sell out even all of the issues they claimed in the past to support regarding too much taxation and regulation, national security, any chance for economic recovery for the middle class and jobs, they will now vote for and support Hillary Clinton simply because Hillary will bring in more hordes of foreigners and give amnesty and open borders and global cheap labor for the benefactors of such cheap labor that is the one and only issue for these Republican establishment and their toadies.

But, this is like no other election cycle. You will see. Trump’s support is YUGE. It is out there. It is going to make a difference. They will not stop it. This is actually going to be fun. Just watch what is coming next.

Trump needs to speak clearly so that all Americans understand him not just the people who selected him in the primary. You will not win with just your primary voters. Trump is not trying to win over any other voters. If others have to explain what you really mean you did not do your job right. If you believe he is being clear in his message I assure you I don't understand him at all and from the look of this thread a lot of people have problems with Trump. You can believe that Trumps message is getting across but all I'm getting is gibber gabber. I am moderate from a large group of registered voters that don't vote in the primary but always vote in the Election. Trump needs to speak to moderates. The extremists will support him even if he shoots someone in the street the moderates will not. Trump needs to clearly speak to the moderates.