Is Islam a universal religion.

[LuisDantas]

Finding God is a journey which takes time, Luis

And that must be optional.

My comment is not at all meant to be disrespectful

And that makes it that much more important that you realize that it is in fact gravely disrespectful.

I can tell that you are a well meaning person. That makes it so much more tragic if you stomp over other people's rights without ever wanting to.

Understanding the Qur'an takes time. It is easier when you read it in its original language, but when this is not possible one has to read a translation of the meanings of the Qur'an.

And it depends which translation you read. Some are better than others, so the first step would be to read a good translation.

There are many other issues involved to reach a good understanding for someone who is interested in finding the truth, so do give it time ...

Please understand: there is no chance whatsoever of me ever believing in God, and therefore neither in the Quran.

I can fully assure you that. I will even assure you that if God exists, he must aprove and agree with this statement of mine. He can't be a real God if he does not.

If you can accept that, than you are respecting me. If you can not, I fear I have to tell you that you are being very disrespectful indeed. Intention not withstanding, regrettably.

 

[Sha'irullah]

Is Arabic a universal language?

 

[LuisDantas]

It has a better shot at being universal than Islam, I gather.

If anything, there are very few people that one would expect to never be able to learn Arabic. Quite a lot more people will never (and should never attempt to) believe in the Quran's God.

 

[Rainbow Mage]

If the ability to accommodate both atheists and theists is what truly makes a religion universal than Buddhism, Jainism, and Taoism are pretty much the only ones

 

[Sha'irullah]

It has a better shot at being universal than Islam, I gather.

If anything, there are very few people that one would expect to never be able to learn Arabic. Quite a lot more people will never (and should never attempt to) believe in the Quran's God.

Sorry but those quotations right there made my day .

In all honesty, learning Arabic is more practical than learning Islam although learning Sufism is more practical than learning Arabic

 

[Sha'irullah]

If the ability to accommodate both atheists and theists is what truly makes a religion universal than Buddhism, Jainism, and Taoism are pretty much the only ones

Although I find no religion universal since they all contain dogmas I agree here.
Dharmic religions are by far as universal as any religion can get and ha very loose dogma. I would not even call it dogma but more like principles.

Islam is extremely legalistic and the most ununiversal religion next to the Druze faith and Judaism. What makes a religion universal is it's ability to hold something(theism) or nothing(atheism).

 

[LuisDantas]

If the ability to accommodate both atheists and theists is what truly makes a religion universal than Buddhism, Jainism, and Taoism are pretty much the only ones

I don't really think so. Confucionism, UU, Quakers, even liberal Christianity... there are in fact many other possibilities.

 

[LuisDantas]

Sorry but those quotations right there made my day .

In all honesty, learning Arabic is more practical than learning Islam although learning Sufism is more practical than learning Arabic

I'm not claiming a working knowledge in either, but I certainly agree from what I know of all three.

 

[LuisDantas]

What makes a religion universal is it's ability to hold something(theism) or nothing(atheism).

Or perhaps to transcend such a minor element and go straight to the relevant matters?

 

[Sha'irullah]

Or perhaps to transcend such a minor element and go straight to the relevant matters?

Now you know why I take the ignostic stance :yes:. Too much garbage on either side for me to be concerned with any of these matters

 

[Rainbow Mage]

I don't really think so. Confucionism, UU, Quakers, even liberal Christianity... there are in fact many other possibilities.

You're right. Especially Confucianism- how could I forget?

 

[Cordoba]

Please understand: there is no chance whatsoever of me ever believing in God, and therefore neither in the Quran.

I can fully assure you that. I will even assure you that if God exists, he must aprove and agree with this statement of mine. He can't be a real God if he does not.

If you can accept that, than you are respecting me. If you can not, I fear I have to tell you that you are being very disrespectful indeed. Intention not withstanding, regrettably.

Of course I respect your choice, Luis.

You are a free person, and you have the right to believe in what you believe

No problem there at all ...

 

[LuisDantas]

Gosh. It is SO frustrating.

Why must such a good person be so unreasonable?

 

[Cordoba]

Who is that good person?

 

[LuisDantas]

Who is that good person?

You, of course. I sympathise a lot with your intent. But I can't support your choice.

 

[Cordoba]

You don't need to support my choice, Luis

God says in the Qur'an:

"For you is your religion and for me is my religion" (109:6)

Peace and all the best

 

[LuisDantas]

Peace and all the best, Cordoba.

Shall we some day, hopefully soon, reach a better understanding of each other's perspective.

 

[WonderWho]

Well you are correct. Not everyone drinks water. Those who don't, die.

..very true, however Kabir goes to the root of everything, which is truly universal

“Are you looking for me?
I am in the next seat.
My shoulder is against yours.
you will not find me in the stupas,
not in Indian shrine rooms,
nor in synagogues,
nor in cathedrals:
not in masses,
nor kirtans,
not in legs winding around your own neck,
nor in eating nothing but vegetables.
When you really look for me,
you will see me instantly —
you will find me in the tiniest house of time.
Kabir says: Student, tell me, what is God?
He is the breath inside the breath.”
― Kabir

 

[LuisDantas]

There are those who think of scripture in exalted terms in the Dharmic Faiths.

The Lotus Sutra, particularly, commands sometimes passionate sentiments. I have a hard time understanding that, and I don't think I approve it either. Not the least because some of the most troublesome schools, including some that I don't acknowledge as Buddhism, claim to be inspired by it.

On the other hand, Boddhidharma is said to have made a point of letting go of scriptures in order to attain a more reliable understanding of Dharma. And it is said that the community of disciples of the Buddha broke up pretty much immediately after his death.

I figure some people see that as problems, but to me those are instead good signs. Scripture shall always take a back seat to personal understanding of religious faith. We should take full responsibility for our practice instead of relying on a text that simply does not know nor understands us as people or the circunstances we may have to face.


The bottom line is that it is simply not at all possible for a religion that centers on scripture to be acceptable or compatible with many people. Those are, by definition, unsuitable to the label of universal religion.

 

[melk]

I don´t think relying on scriptures is a problem, except for the grade. You can rely on a scripture, without losing the fredom you need to interact with different believers, or even incorporate some beliefs to your faith. For me, as a christian, it means to capture the essence of the Bible message and accept the rest as a complement that makes no sense without the essence. Much of the time, it results in a non literal understanding.
Anyway, I can't imagine a universal religion .Religions can interact and, even, accept one another. But they always will be diferent, in terms of that their basic concepts (not necesserally scriptures). That's not saying there can't be an identity between religons , in terms of the values (moral aspect) they defend.