Does the Christian God have free will?

[Agnostic75]

James 1:13 says "Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man." Numbers 23:19 says "God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent: hath he said, and shall he not do it? or hath he spoken, and shall he not make it good?"

It is impossible for God to sin since it is it nature never to sin. He cannot resist his nature since he is perfect, and cannot be tempted by anything. Will is only free when it has the capacity to be changed. A number of Scriptures say that God does not change. So God does not have free will.

 

[Shermana]

It can be argued that the god of gods sets his own rules and thus has total free will but is bound by the game he designed. Thus he has enough Free Will to conform it to His will.

 

[Sleeppy]

No. Who you are determines your capacity to will anything. God, according to Scripture, has not and cannot change who He is.

 

[Agnostic75]

It can be argued that the god of gods sets his own rules and thus has total free will but is bound by the game he designed.

An Internet definition for the word "will" is "the mental faculty by which one deliberately chooses or decides upon a course of action."

The Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary defines the word "choose" as "to select freely and after consideration." God never considers any since he has always known everything, and has always had the same nature.

Thus he has enough Free Will to conform it to His will.

No, God cannot choose to conform to his will since choosing involves considering. God never considers anything since he has always had the same nature.

Choosing implies that there are options. God has no options. He cannot lie. He does not have to make any effort at all not to lie since he is perfect, and thus it is impossible for him to lie.

God did not choose which rules to tell humans to follow since choosing means considering, and considering means that change is possible in the future. God does not change.

An eternal, perfect, unchanging God cannot possibly be able to freely choose to do anything. If God had free will, he would have the potential to lie, but he doesn't.

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

But God did lie, when he told Abraham that he wanted him to kill Isaac.

 

[Skwim]

Does the Christian God have free will?

No more than any creature on earth: zilch, diddly squat, naught, nada, zero.

 

[Shiranui117]

Ability to sin=/=free will.

 

[Agnostic75]

But God did lie, when he told Abraham that he wanted him to kill Isaac.

Genesis 22:2 says "Then God said, “Take your son, your only son, whom you love—Isaac—and go to the region of Moriah. Sacrifice him there as a burnt offering on a mountain I will show you."

That does not say that God wanted Abraham to kill Isaac. If God had wanted Abraham to kill Issac, he would have allowed him to kill Isaac.

From a biblical perspective, God is perfect, and unchanging, and cannot tell lies. Such a being cannot choose to do anything since choice implies options, and the possibility of change.

 

[Agnostic75]

Ability to sin = free will.

That is correct, and it is an excellent, simple, and easy to understand definition of free will. Good job.

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

Genesis 22:2 says "Then God said, “Take your son, your only son, whom you love—Isaac—and go to the region of Moriah. Sacrifice him there as a burnt offering on a mountain I will show you."

That does not say that God wanted Abraham to kill Isaac. If God had wanted Abraham to kill Issac, he would have allowed him to kill Isaac.

From a biblical perspective, God is perfect, and unchanging, and cannot tell lies. Such a being cannot choose to do anything since choice implies options, and the possibility of change.

My point is that he didn't want Abraham to kill Isaac, but told Abraham that's what he wanted him to do. That's a lie. If he wasn't trying to lie to Abraham, he never would have told him to kill Isaac. So either God isn't perfect or the ability to lie is part of perfection.

 

[Shiranui117]

That is correct, and it is an excellent, simple, and easy to understand definition of free will. Good job.

Isn't there a rule against manipulating people's quotes?

 

[Agnostic75]

Isn't there a rule against manipulating people's quotes?

I am sorry. Did I change the meaning of what you said? Are you implying that God has free will? If it is impossible for God to lie, how can he have free will?

 

[Agnostic75]

My point is that he didn't want Abraham to kill Isaac, but told Abraham that's what he wanted him to do. That's a lie. If he wasn't trying to lie to Abraham, he never would have told him to kill Isaac. So either God isn't perfect or the ability to lie is part of perfection.

We could debate this, but there is not any reason to since I am addressing what Christians believe about God, and almost no Christian will say that God tells lies.

 

[Skwim]

I am sorry. Did I change the meaning of what you said? Are you implying that God has free will? If it is impossible for God to lie, how can he have free will?

Shiranui117 said, " Ability to sin ≠ free will." Not "Ability to sin = free will."

 

[Agnostic75]

Shiranui117 said, " Ability to sin ≠ free will." Not "Ability to sin = free will."

Thanks, but I still do not understand what Shiranui117's position is about whether or not God has free will. Does he believe that God has free will or not?

 

[Shiranui117]

Thanks, but I still do not understand what Shiranui117's position is about whether or not God has free will. Does he believe that God has free will or not?

Yes. He changes His mind all the time in the Bible. The ability to change your mind about what you're going to do is a natural consequence of free will.

 

[Agnostic75]

Yes. He changes His mind all the time in the Bible. The ability to change your mind about what you're going to do is a natural consequence of free will.

No, God sometimes changes his actions, but he never changes his character because he is not able to. God cannot lie, and cannot even consider whether or not he wants to lie. On Monday, God can cause it to rain. On Tuesday, he can make clear skies. That is an example of God changing how he acts, not an example of changing his character. When God makes the weather do different things on different days, that is not an example of free will since his nature compels him to do everything that he does.

If God healed a certain person of cancer on June 15, 1995, he did not choose to do that since his nature forced him to do it. He had no choice.

An Internet definition for the word "will" is "the mental faculty by which one deliberately chooses or decides upon a course of action."

The Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary defines the word "choose" as "to select freely and after consideration." God never considers any since he has always known everything, and has always had the same nature.

Obviously, God cannot choose, or consider, whether or not to lie since he is not able to lie.

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

The Lord regretted that he had made human beings on the earth, and his heart was deeply troubled. 7 So the Lord said, “I will wipe from the face of the earth the human race I have created—and with them the animals, the birds and the creatures that move along the ground—for I regret that I have made them.”

First God is gonna kill every one and every thing because he regrets that he made it.

8 But Noah found favor in the eyes of the Lord.

17 I am going to bring floodwaters on the earth to destroy all life under the heavens, every creature that has the breath of life in it. Everything on earth will perish. 18 But I will establish my covenant with you, and you will enter the ark—you and your sons and your wife and your sons’ wives with you. 19 You are to bring into the ark two of all living creatures, male and female, to keep them alive with you. 20 Two of every kind of bird, of every kind of animal and of every kind of creature that moves along the ground will come to you to be kept alive. 21 You are to take every kind of food that is to be eaten and store it away as food for you and for them.”

Sounds like a change of heart to me.

 

[Shermana]

Just for the record, James 1:13 says

Young's Literal Translation
Let no one say, being tempted -- 'From God I am tempted,' for God is not tempted of evil, and Himself doth tempt no one,

It does not say he CANNOT be tempted. That's a little embellishment by various translations.

Likewise with Numbers 23, it does not say he CANNOT, it just says he DOES not.

Thus, your proof texts are kinda not valid. He is perfectly free to do whatever he wants.

Check your translations before you go on using a verse that you think is authoritative.

 

[Agnostic75]

James 1:13 says "Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man." Numbers 23:19 says "God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent: hath he said, and shall he not do it? or hath he spoken, and shall he not make it good?"

Just for the record, James 1:13 says

Young's Literal Translation

Let no one say, being tempted -- 'From God I am tempted,' for God is not tempted of evil, and Himself doth tempt no one,

It does not say he CANNOT be tempted. That's a little embellishment by various translations.

Likewise with Numbers 23, it does not say he CANNOT, it just says he DOES not.

Thus, your proof texts are kinda not valid. He is perfectly free to do whatever he wants.

Check your translations before you go on using a verse that you think is authoritative.

But I never intended to make a case that God cannot be tempted, only that he cannot successfully be tempted since it is impossible for him to sin.

An Internet definition for the word "will" is "the mental faculty by which one deliberately chooses or decides upon a course of action."

The Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary defines the word "choose" as "to select freely and after consideration." God never considers anything since he has always known everything, and has always had the same nature.

God cannot consider whether or not to lie since his nature, and character never change.

The word "consider" implies options. God does not have the option to lie.

If God causes it to rain somewhere on Tuesday, he did not choose, or consider to do so. That is because from God's perspective, there is only one right way to control the weather at a given place, on a given day. No considerations are necessary. Considerations are only necessary for fallible, imperfect beings. If you had a verbal conversation with God, you would not ask him to consider doing something for you and get back to you in the future since it would be obvious that he would immediately know whether or not he wanted to do what you asked him to do.