Can someone convert to an ethnicity?

[painted wolf]

not at all ... there are very few pure bloods still around in any group.

I myself am an English Irish, German Jewish and Scottish mix, if you met me you would be in no doubt I was ethnically English. genetically, English would be a minority in me. I doubt any one is genetically English, because there never has been a pure English race.

Ah, I think I understand your position better now.

"English" is more of a nationality that has been adopted as the identity of the people of "England" over the ethnicity of the people who lived there... ie. the Anglo-Saxons to start with then adding Normans, Vikings, French and so on.
While some groups in Great Britten seem intent on keeping their ethnicity (for better or worse) such as the Welsh and the Scotts.

I wonder if the English system of royalty had something to do with it? When your ruler could suddenly be French or Spanish or German as a political tactic... how does that impact the "commoners" view of their identity.

Scotland and Wales were added at a later time through conquest... and certainly early on did not associate the ruling class with themselves.

wa:do

 

[Flankerl]

It might be worth noting that there have been a couple of books (most notably The Jew In The Lotus, by Rodger Kamenetz) that describe the meetings that have taken place between the Dalai Lama and his closest advisors with representatives of Jews from different movements and places. The topic of the meetings were the interest of the Dalai Lama and the Tibetan government in exile in learning from the success of the Jewish People in preserving their culture and tradition while in exile from their homeland.

So that would seem to indicate that some people don't believe that ethnicity (in its cultural sense, not its genetic sense) is absolutely tied to a particular place....

What people dont seem to understand is that Judaism is and has always been a tribal religion. The religion of one and or various tribes.

But this term has been kind of forgotton in modern times. Yet Judaism still is a tribal religion of a tribe. And it has never been something odd to join a tribe and its system of belief/religion.


It reminds me of those people who claim that jews arent a nation/people because the term "nation" is being used in another way than the jews use it. Yet the jews have used this term far longer before there ever was a single nation state in the world. But obviously the jews have to change their interpretation of the term "nation" because the other people use this term in a different way.

 

[Aabraham ben Azar]

What people dont seem to understand is that Judaism is and has always been a tribal religion. The religion of one and or various tribes.

But this term has been kind of forgotton in modern times. Yet Judaism still is a tribal religion of a tribe. And it has never been something odd to join a tribe and its system of belief/religion.


It reminds me of those people who claim that jews arent a nation/people because the term "nation" is being used in another way than the jews use it. Yet the jews have used this term far longer before there ever was a single nation state in the world. But obviously the jews have to change their interpretation of the term "nation" because the other people use this term in a different way.

Judaism used to be a tribal religion during time of Ya3quv and his children but at present not as many other nations converted to Judaism from four corners of the world like Berbers,Flashas,Khazars,Indians, Northwestern Europeans,Georgians and Arabs so no more Bnei Yesrael.

 

[Caladan]

Judaism used to be a tribal religion during time of Ya3quv and his children but at present not as many other nations converted to Judaism from four corners of the world like Berbers,Flashas,Khazars,Indians, Northwestern Europeans,Georgians and Arabs so no more Bnei Yesrael.

Let me get this straight. Because some people joined the global Jewish community, there is no more Jewish community?

Why don't you change the tune already. It got old about one hundred posts ago.

 

[Aabraham ben Azar]

Let me get this straight. Because some people joined the global Jewish community, there is no more Jewish community?

Why don't you change the tune already. It got old about one hundred posts ago.

Why are you angry ??
I didn't say no more Jewish community but what I said no more Bnei Yesrael ( tribe ), I hope it's clear now, thank you and Lila tov.( cool down little bit )

 

[McBell]

Would someone please be so kind as to point out where ethnicity has to do with DNA?
I understand it has to do with heritage, but it seems to me that far to many people in this thread are confusing heritage with ancestry...

 

[Levite]

Judaism used to be a tribal religion during time of Ya3quv and his children but at present not as many other nations converted to Judaism from four corners of the world like Berbers,Flashas,Khazars,Indians, Northwestern Europeans,Georgians and Arabs so no more Bnei Yesrael.

Could you at least vary your anti-Semitism a little? How about a nice conspiracy theory for a change? The same one note of hatred is getting a little boring.

 

[Flankerl]

Judaism used to be a tribal religion during time of Ya3quv and his children but at present not as many other nations converted to Judaism from four corners of the world like Berbers,Flashas,Khazars,Indians, Northwestern Europeans,Georgians and Arabs so no more Bnei Yesrael.

Thats all fine and dandy but there is exactly one problem.

Your opinion is unimportant.

 

[Levite]

Thats all fine and dandy but there is exactly one problem.

Your opinion is unimportant.

And also ignorant, but who's counting?

 

[Protester]

Why are you angry ??
I didn't say no more Jewish community but what I said no more Bnei Yesrael ( tribe ), I hope it's clear now, thank you and Lila tov.( cool down little bit )

No more tribes? Amusing. Levite - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia If the modern Jews get really interested in tribal designations, I'm sure they'll work out a DNA test for that also.

 

[Protester]

This topic from another thread

Can someone convert to an ethnicity? For instance if someone converts to Judaism from another religion do they become ethnic Jews?

I think there are enough examples of non-Jews being fully accepted into the Jewish community such as Rehab and Ruth, two of the better known people. There were ceremonies to accept a gentile into Judaism, such as ritual bath and circumcision, but I'll leave it to the Jewish commentators to go into detail about that.

 

[Aabraham ben Azar]

No more tribes? Amusing. Levite - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia If the modern Jews get really interested in tribal designations, I'm sure they'll work out a DNA test for that also.

DNA test subject has been already covered in the thread "Holy Land and the Jews" link as follow :

http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/religious-debates/132377-holy-land-jews.html

 

[Aabraham ben Azar]

Could you at least vary your anti-Semitism a little? How about a nice conspiracy theory for a change? The same one note of hatred is getting a little boring.

My cousin Levite , I am trying my best to protect the rights of Avraham Avinu and his descendants in the Holy Land as they are the only true and legitimate heirs of our soil like you , myself , caladan and Flankerl.

 

[Aabraham ben Azar]

I think there are enough examples of non-Jews being fully accepted into the Jewish community such as Rehab and Ruth, two of the better known people. There were ceremonies to accept a gentile into Judaism, such as ritual bath and circumcision, but I'll leave it to the Jewish commentators to go into detail about that.

I woud like to add two types more :
1)- Forcibly converted to Judaism : Edomites
2)- Freely converted to Judaism like : Khazars

 

[Caladan]

Why are you angry ??

You seem to be the only one who is over excited here. So take not of that.

I didn't say no more Jewish community but what I said no more Bnei Yesrael ( tribe ), I hope it's clear now, thank you and Lila tov.( cool down little bit )

Let me educate you on the matter, even though I'm sure it has been pointed out to you dozens of times already. Bnei Israel were a confederation of tribes, not simply a single tribe, Judah from which the Jews arrive were a tribe of that confederation, a tribe which also took members of the other tribes in later historical stages.
So what you are saying is not only not clear, its the anti-thesis of historical and Biblical understanding.

 

[Caladan]

I woud like to add two types more :
1)- Forcibly converted to Judaism : Edomites
2)- Freely converted to Judaism like : Khazars

What about Edomite conversion or Khazar nobility conversion? how does it reinvent historical Jewish culture?
There is absolutely nothing ground shaking about this. The Jews existed before an Edomite conversion, before a Khazar conversion, and long after them.
Furthermore contrary to what anti-Semitic websites say, the Khazar converts consisted only a very small percentage of overall Ashkenazi Jewry. The Khazars did not convert en messe, their royalty and nobility did.

 

[Flankerl]

My cousin Levite , I am trying my best to protect the rights of Avraham Avinu and his descendants in the Holy Land as they are the only true and legitimate heirs of our soil like you , myself , caladan and Flankerl.

You might want to hold your breath on me. Iam the first person of my family since my great great great grandmother Rachela in good old Moravia to have blonde hair.

So in your pureblooded world I may be a muggle Lord Voldemort.

 

[Aabraham ben Azar]

You seem to be the only one who is over excited here. So take not of that.

Let me educate you on the matter, even though I'm sure it has been pointed out to you dozens of times already. Bnei Israel were a confederation of tribes, not simply a single tribe, Judah from which the Jews arrive were a tribe of that confederation, a tribe which also took members of the other tribes in later historical stages.
So what you are saying is not only not clear, its the anti-thesis of historical and Biblical understanding.

First of all I thank you for educating me !
I am not overexcited but you are over angry as you mixed English with Hebrew when you wrote " Bnei Israel " instead of" Bnei Yesrael "or " Children of Israel " ( clear evidence of hot tempre !!, as I advised you to cool down little bit to avoid mini mistakes ).
Now it's clear that the term "Children of Israel " dosen't mean direct descendants of Jacob / Ya3quv ( from his own offspring or ZR3 ) , Am I right ?

We are here to learn from each other and no one of us own the absolute fact or truth except God Himself .

 

[Caladan]

First of all I thank you for educating me !
I am not overexcited but you are over angry as you mixed English with Hebrew when you wrote " Bnei Israel " instead of" Bnei Yesrael "or " Children of Israel " ( clear evidence of hot tempre !!, as I advised you to cool down little bit to avoid mini mistakes ).
Now it's clear that the term "Children of Israel " dosen't mean direct descendants of Jacob / Ya3quv ( from his own offspring or ZR3 ) , Am I right ?

WOW.

We are here to learn from each other and no one of us own the absolute fact or truth except God Himself .

Some of us are evidently better educated and equipped, and more importantly have more noble intentions.

 

[Aabraham ben Azar]

You might want to hold your breath on me. Iam the first person of my family since my great great great grandmother Rachela in good old Moravia to have blonde hair.

So in your pureblooded world I may be a muggle Lord Voldemort.

Really I am confused with you when I say you are pureblooded you don't accept and when I say you are not pureblooded you don't like either , what is the solution ??