Homosexuality & Religion

[painted wolf]

As an atheist homosexuality is a failure in that it is self extinguishing. You cannot breed by definition if you are truely homosexual, therefore it will have no net benefit or deficit to the human condition. it is basically irrelevant, confined to the temporary position of local minority gratification.

Cheers

Actually GBLT people can have tremendous evolutionary benefit... they often adopt abandoned offspring where strait members of the species would not, as they are too busy with their own offspring.
They are often innovators in technology and culture...

If the trait were not somehow adaptive, it would not show up as a significant portion of the population.

Evolution isn't just makin' babies... and most members of a species never contribute offspring to the future of the species.

wa:do

 

[Tiapan]

Among native peoples, LGBT individuals are variously tolerated or celebrated, there are few where they are looked down upon.

In some nations Transgendered people were viewed as holy.

The Navajo (I believe, I may have the wrong nation) have seven pronouns to account for the natural range of human identity, Hetero M/F, Gay M/F, Trans M/F and Neutral.

wa:do

I think this is well portrayed in Dustin Hoffmans "Little Big Man" with the guy that painted his face black and rode everywhere backwards. That is one hell of a good movie.

Cheers

 

[painted wolf]

I think this is well portrayed in Dustin Hoffmans "Little Big Man" with the guy that painted his face black and rode everywhere backwards. That is one hell of a good movie.

Cheers

That is a very different concept. Heyoka are not the same as transgendered people... they are "backwards-forwards" and do things in direct opposition to the normal as part of their spiritual medicine.

So, while it was a good portrayal of a Heyoka, it was not a portrayal of a traditional transgendered or LGBT individual.

wa:do

 

[jmvizanko]

Why do you think God or Allah or whoever you believe in would denounce homosexuality?

Because they mix poo with sex?

 

[Tiapan]

Actually GBLT people can have tremendous evolutionary benefit... they often adopt abandoned offspring where strait members of the species would not, as they are too busy with their own offspring.
They are often innovators in technology and culture...

If the trait were not somehow adaptive, it would not show up as a significant portion of the population.

Evolution isn't just makin' babies... and most members of a species never contribute offspring to the future of the species.

wa:do

Broad statement what can you produce as evidence?

Evolution isn't just makin' babies... and most members of a species never contribute offspring to the future of the species.

Are you serious, since the only ones that count are the parents of the following generation.

Cheers

 

[linwood]

How should I know? Supposly he has a whole plan with calling his loyal believers up in the air. Then the world goes to ****(Worse then it is).

I can`t imagine the world being worse off if all his believers suddenly disappeared.

Actually sounds like serious improvement to me.

 

[gzusfrk]

I know that many believers think the mind of God is unknowable or at least highly difficult to discern to us mere mortals, but I wanted to see if any religious folks had an opinion on this question.

I also know that many people who believe a religion that says homosexuality is a sin do not treat homosexual people poorly (as some Christians say, "we are all sinners"). That doesn't matter for this question; this question deals with why the holy texts of various religions denounce homosexuality -- even if you are a person who is okay with being friends with and respecting homosexuals yourself.

1) Why do you think God or Allah or whoever you believe in would denounce homosexuality? What harm does it do to God?

2) Does God think homosexual acts in non-human species is also an abomination?

It is an indulgent of the flesh, It goes against the natural order of things, such as God making a rock weigh nothing on a planet like earth, its not "Right". Dont know about non human, but imo if they were taught it is wrong( they were not) then it is wrong for them.

 

[jmvizanko]

It is an indulgent of the flesh, It goes against the natural order of things, such as God making a rock weigh nothing on a planet like earth, its not "Right". Dont know about non human, but imo if they were taught it is wrong( they were not) then it is wrong for them.

So it occurs in nature quite commonly and it is against the natural order of things? Makes perfect sense.

What on earth does your weightless rock even mean or have to do with anything?

 

[gzusfrk]

So it occurs in nature quite commonly and it is against the natural order of things? Makes perfect sense.

What on earth does your weightless rock even mean or have to do with anything?

Never said that, you have taken my words out of context, I said not sure of the non-human thing. If you didnt get the rock thing, forget it. Natural order of things, might not have been the best choice of words.

 

[Dan4reason]

It is an indulgent of the flesh, It goes against the natural order of things, such as God making a rock weigh nothing on a planet like earth, its not "Right". Dont know about non human, but imo if they were taught it is wrong( they were not) then it is wrong for them.

Homosexuality is like heterosexuality, watching movies, eating good food, and sleeping in that is an "indulgence of the flesh." I have no problem with most pleasure because it usually advances happiness, and makes life worth living. Could you imagine a life without an "indulgence of the flesh?" I sure don't want to.

Homosexuality has a genetic component to it so it seems that many homosexuals are meant to be that way so it can be argued that homosexuality is "natural". The natural order of things is that the strongest survive and the weak must die. You must create as many successful offspring as possible and prevent others from creating theirs. Just because something is "natural" does not make it right and just because it is "not natural" does not make it wrong, assuming you have a solid definition of what "natural" is.

The reason you are against homosexuality is because you instinctively attracted to the opposite sex and have a repulsion toward intercourse with the same sex. This makes you a heterosexual. Homosexuals have a different set of instincts and find sex with the same sex attractive. It is your subjective emotions that are telling you that homosexuality is unnatural. Just because your emotions say something is "good" does not everyone on earth must follow it. Just because I find spinach dellicious does not mean disliking spinach is objectively "unnatural" and believe that everyone should like it. This would be childish.

 

[painted wolf]

Broad statement what can you produce as evidence?

Alan Turing - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Tracy Chapman - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
CBC News - World - Gay penguin couple adopts abandoned egg in German zoo
Not to mention all the human gay couples that want to adopt...:sarcastic

Are you serious, since the only ones that count are the parents of the following generation.

Cheers

You need to study evolution. I honestly don't know what bothers me more... creationists or atheists who are ignorant of evolution... at least the creationists have an excuse. :help:

I suggest you start with social insects and inclusive fitness.
here is a basic starting point for understanding fitness..
Fitness (biology) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

wa:do

 

[Meow Mix]

As an atheist homosexuality is a failure in that it is self extinguishing. You cannot breed by definition if you are truely homosexual, therefore it will have no net benefit or deficit to the human condition. it is basically irrelevant, confined to the temporary position of local minority gratification.

Cheers

But not everyone is homosexual, and homosexuals do help out the human condition. I'm a physics student for instance and my girlfriend is almost a nurse. My girlfriend and I want to adopt and give a child a good home and good education. Chances are (by sheer statistics) that child will be straight and maybe contribute to the propogation of the species using the resources we gave him or her.

 

[Meow Mix]

Among native peoples, LGBT individuals are variously tolerated or celebrated, there are few where they are looked down upon.

In some nations Transgendered people were viewed as holy.

The Navajo (I believe, I may have the wrong nation) have seven pronouns to account for the natural range of human identity, Hetero M/F, Gay M/F, Trans M/F and Neutral.

wa:do

That's really interesting actually, I don't know terribly much about the Navajo or many Native American cultures. It reminds me of reading that in some other countries there is a concept of a "third sex."

 

[Meow Mix]

It is an indulgent of the flesh, It goes against the natural order of things, such as God making a rock weigh nothing on a planet like earth, its not "Right". Dont know about non human, but imo if they were taught it is wrong( they were not) then it is wrong for them.

But they weren't taught to do it either, they naturally do it. So clearly God naturally creates homosexuality if god created the animals that naturally engage in homosexuality. So, do you still think homosexuality is not natural?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Are you serious, since the only ones that count are the parents of the following generation.

Not true.

Kin selection - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"I would gladly lay down my life for two siblings or eight cousins." - J.B.S. Haldane

 

[gzusfrk]

Homosexuality is like heterosexuality, watching movies, eating good food, and sleeping in that is an "indulgence of the flesh." I have no problem with most pleasure because it usually advances happiness, and makes life worth living. Could you imagine a life without an "indulgence of the flesh?" I sure don't want to.

Homosexuality has a genetic component to it so it seems that many homosexuals are meant to be that way so it can be argued that homosexuality is "natural". The natural order of things is that the strongest survive and the weak must die. You must create as many successful offspring as possible and prevent others from creating theirs. Just because something is "natural" does not make it right and just because it is "not natural" does not make it wrong, assuming you have a solid definition of what "natural" is.

The reason you are against homosexuality is because you instinctively attracted to the opposite sex and have a repulsion toward intercourse with the same sex. This makes you a heterosexual. Homosexuals have a different set of instincts and find sex with the same sex attractive. It is your subjective emotions that are telling you that homosexuality is unnatural. Just because your emotions say something is "good" does not everyone on earth must follow it. Just because I find spinach dellicious does not mean disliking spinach is objectively "unnatural" and believe that everyone should like it. This would be childish.

Yet the nt speaks often of the flesh, it says those that belong to Christ have crucified the the flesh of its passions and desires. And while your description of me being against homosexual activity, is some what accurate, the Word of God plays a much bigger role in my life style. I dont like your spinach analogy, would it have been any different if you would have used dog crap instead.

 

[Rainbow Mage]

1) Why do you think God or Allah or whoever you believe in would denounce homosexuality? What harm does it do to God?

God (Netjer) does not denounce homosexuality. God doesn't make junk.

2) Does God think homosexual acts in non-human species is also an abomination

No, nor does God think it's an abomination in humans.

 

[Meow Mix]

CBC News - World - Gay penguin couple adopts abandoned egg in German zoo

Awww! That made me want to cry!!! Beautiful

Edit: and this ****** me off:

A children's book written about the New York penguins called And Tango Makes Three has been the book with the most requests for removal from libraries in the United States over the past three years, according the American Library Association.


Read more: http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2009/06/05/gay-penguins-adopt005.html#ixzz12dHAGfUu

Yes, let's just censor everything in reality we disagree with! BURN the books!

 

[Rainbow Mage]

Just to add, the ancient Egyptians, far as we know, were completely tolerant of homosexuality. The oldest tomb of a gay couple is in Egypt, Egyptian writings speak of a third gender, and the Pharoahs sometimes had male consorts. There did arise the question once if a man giving up dominance in intercourse to another man was shameful, and some seemed to think it was, but never to the point that homosexuality was illegal or punished. It wasn't about homosexuality, it was about the cultural view of roles in sex.

 

[gzusfrk]

But they weren't taught to do it either, they naturally do it. So clearly God naturally creates homosexuality if god created the animals that naturally engage in homosexuality. So, do you still think homosexuality is not natural?

First you would have to know why the dog humps my leg sometimes, is it because it believes my leg will have puppys, I think not. I dont think they really know, It would seem its because of hormones, but I dont really know. Natural is a big word,I think homesexuality is against Gods Word.I think it is a spiritual illness. I think it is a desire of the flesh, an over indulgent.