Anti-Theism: Why I Do Not Wish For a God

[Tathagata]

Unlike some Atheists, I do not wish for there to be a God nor do I disbelieve merely because there's not enough evidence to support it. Rather, I don't think God gives life more meaning and I don't think God is desirable. Many think that God solves a lot of problems and answers a lot of questions, but a Universe with God is not philosophically superior nor does it solve any existential problems. (To be clear, these are my reasons why I don't wish for a God, not the reasons why I disbelieve God.)

Belief in God can be detrimental to a person instead of beneficial and the actual existence of God would make life impossible to live.

Christopher Hitchens: "[Belief in God] is a totalitarian belief. It is the wish to be a slave. It is the desire that there be an unalterable, unchallengeable, tyrannical authority who can convict you of thought crime while you are asleep, who can subject you - who must, indeed, subject you - to total surveillance around the clock every waking and sleeping minute of your life - I say, of your life - before you're born and, even worse and where the real fun begins, after you're dead."

The Buddha: "Is it true that you hold that whatever a person experiences is all caused by a Supreme Being's act of creation? Then in that case, a person is a killer of living beings because of a Supreme Being's act of creation. A person is a thief, unchaste, a liar, a divisive speaker, a harsh speaker, an idle chatterer, greedy, malicious, a holder of wrong views because of a Supreme Being's act of creation. When one falls back on creation by a Supreme Being as being essential, there is no desire [motivation], no effort [at the thought], 'This should be done. This shouldn't be done.' When one can't pin down as a truth or reality what should & shouldn't be done, one dwells bewildered & unprotected. One cannot righteously refer to oneself as a contemplative. This was my second righteous refutation of those priests & contemplatives who hold to such teachings, such views." [Tittha Sutta]

"Is it possible to live life without God? It is ONLY possible to live life without God." - Osho (Indian Philosopher)

"Either God can exist or freedom. Both cannot exist together." - Osho

"If God existed, it would be necessary to abolish him." - Mikhail Bakunin



*P.S. Please don't feel threatened or offended! This is a place to debate and share ideas!

*Edit: By the way, this post is not an argument. This is to start discussion at which point, THEN I will present refutations and arguments to the responders.


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[sandandfoam]

Do you think there are many ways or just your way?

 

[Tathagata]

Do you think there are many ways or just your way?

I believe that there are a great diversity of respectable philosophies in the world and we all believe our philosophies to be true.


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[sandandfoam]

I believe that there are a great diversity of respectable philosophies in the world and we all believe our philosophies to be true.


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So why the expression of anti-theism?

 

[Tathagata]

So why the expression of anti-theism?

Anti-Theism is part of my philosophy. I know that others won't agree and I don't expect anyone to. But this site is to share and debate your own religion/philosophy.

I think what people don't understand is that it's possible to respect and accept people, despite intellectual disagreement. I actually cherish the fact that there are a great diversity of philosophies/religions and intellectual conflict. It would be boring if the whole world agreed on one philosophy and never challenged eachother's ideas.


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[Madhuri]

I actually disagree. Especially as a follower of Sanatan Dharma, I do not think of God as a being that interferes with our lives or demands anything of us. God is there if we want him, but we're allowed to ignore him if that's what we want.

I also find Osho an interesting character. He says things like that, against the existence of God and then in other areas completely contradicts it.

 

[sandandfoam]

Anti-Theism is part of my philosophy.

I'm a theist. It's unlikely in the extreme that you know my God concept - so how does it benefit you to be anti something important to me that you don't understand?

 

[Tathagata]

I'm a theist. It's unlikely in the extreme that you know my God concept - so how does it benefit you to be anti something important to me that you don't understand?

Present to me your concept of God and I'll likely reject it. In my life, I have believed in the Christian God, the Deist God, and the Pantheist God which at this point, I reject them all.


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[.lava]

"Either God can exist or freedom. Both cannot exist together." - Osho

hi Tathagata i am curious to know, do you believe this statement? if yes, would you please define freedom? if we assume there is no God for atheist people, would it be fair to say they are more free than theists?

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[sandandfoam]

Present to me your concept of God and I'll likely reject it. In my life, I have believed in the Christian God, the Deist God, and the Pantheist God which at this point, I reject them all.


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But whether you reject my concept or not isn't the point.
I'm not asking you to accept it, my question is why are you anti something important to me?

 

[Tathagata]

hi Tathagata i am curious to know, do you believe this statement? if yes, would you please define freedom?

Freedom is being self-determined. Not determined by someone else or an external agent. I'm not going to get into Free-will vs. Determinism because even if free will was an illusion, I still think that God takes away, even the illusion of free will.

if we assume there is no God for atheist people, would it be fair to say they are more free than theists?

Well, I can say that as an Atheist now, I feel more free than when I was a Theist. I no longer let the fear of a judgmental God and his commandments dictate my life.


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[Copernicus]

Unlike some Atheists, I do not wish for there to be a God nor do I disbelieve merely because there's not enough evidence to support it. Rather, I don't think God gives life more meaning and I don't think God is desirable. Many think that God solves a lot of problems and answers a lot of questions, but a Universe with God is not philosophically superior nor does it solve any existential problems.

That does not really sound much better than saying that you lack sufficient evidence to license belief in God. While I agree that God does not solve any existential questions, most theists seem to think that he does. So it would be helpful if you would do more than just make bald statements of this sort. You have to look at the arguments that people offer in support of belief and explain why those arguments do not work. Also, I would not rely to heavily on quoting people whose opinions you respect but others do not. That kind of argument is, at best, an appeal to authority. As an atheist, I have found the late Christopher Hitchens to be a very credible person, but his opinions tend to be dismissed quite easily by theists.

 

[Tathagata]

But whether you reject my concept or not isn't the point.
I'm not asking you to accept it, my question is why are you anti something important to me?

I am against it because I disagree with it. I'm sure you disagree with Atheism and Buddhism and therefore against it, even though these things are important to me. And don't feel the least bit hurt that people are against either.

Just because something is important to someone, doesn't mean it's wrong to oppose it.


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[Madhuri]

Well, I can say that as an Atheist now, I feel more free than when I was a Theist. I no longer let the fear of a judgmental God and his commandments dictate my life.


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But see, you seem to be referring to specific God concepts. Not all God concepts incorporate a judgemental God with commandments. Not all God concepts accept that God created the individual. As a panentheistic Hindu, I do not believe in any of the above. And yet I still believe in a God.

 

[Tathagata]

That does not really sound much better than saying that you lack sufficient evidence to license belief in God. While I agree that God does not solve any existential questions, most theists seem to think that he does. So it would be helpful if you would do more than just make bald statements of this sort. You have to look at the arguments that people offer in support of belief and explain why those arguments do not work.

Actually, those are just reasons why I don't WISH for a God, not why I don't BELIEVE in God. I have formally debated Theists on God's existence and I even have potent arguments against God's existence.

Also, I would not rely to heavily on quoting people whose opinions you respect but others do not. That kind of argument is, at best, an appeal to authority. As an atheist, I have found the late Christopher Hitchens to be a very credible person, but his opinions tend to be dismissed quite easily by theists.

An appeal to authority only applies if I presented an argument to prove something. I am just getting a point across and challenging people's commonly held ideas. My first post wasn't an argument, but rather something to start an argument where I can then present real refutations.



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[sandandfoam]

I am against it because I disagree with it. I'm sure you disagree with Atheism and Buddhism and therefore against it

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Matter of fact I'm not against either. I've learnt a lot from the bit of Buddhism that I've read and I agree with many criticisms put forward by atheists.

 

[sandandfoam]

Just because something is important to someone, doesn't mean it's wrong to oppose it.

Indeed, but I don't see the purpose of being against a shadow

 

[jonman122]

they seem to be discussing the Abrahamic god and his commandments, if you want to get on to discussing other gods thats an entirely different matter and it would take me weeks to sum up every other god we could possibly disucss, and their tenants. Thats why i'm an Atheist, why should X be true if Y is not? If the abrahamic god was the first god (according to christians) then why are there so many gods who have been recorded before his book was made? why does he fear other gods, and say he is jealous of them?

May the flying spaghetti monster touch you with his noodly appendage, so that you may have wenches and beer in the afterlife, for eternity.

 

[Tathagata]

Matter of fact I'm not against either. I've learnt a lot from the bit of Buddhism that I've read and I agree with many criticisms put forward by atheists.

Likewise. There are aspects of Christianity that I agree with, as well as arguments put forth by the great Christian apologetics.

Indeed, but I don't see the purpose of being against a shadow

Well, the God-concept is a powerful idea that dominates and pervades the world. Ideas and beliefs make a major impact. Also, in philosophy, it's quite commonplace to oppose things that don't exist. Much of the criticisms against concepts is because they can be reasonably deducted to be false and non-existent.


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[.lava]

Freedom is being self-determined. Not determined by someone else or an external agent. I'm not going to get into Free-will vs. Determinism because even if free will was an illusion, I still think that God takes away, even the illusion of free will.

theist people also have to be self-determined. maybe you're underestimating devotion here. besides i don't understand how being self-determined is equal freedom. i don't wish to get into free will issue either. but i don't understand what you understand from freedom. you can be self-determined but your stand would not provide you whatever you want or need whenever you ask for it. you'd still be dependent on conditions, other people, time ...etc. so what kind of freedom would that be exactly?

Well, I can say that as an Atheist now, I feel more free than when I was a Theist.

you feel more free? are we really talking about feelings? is freedom a feeling? rather than something to feel, i consider freedom something "to be".

I no longer let the fear of a judgmental God and his commandments dictate my life.

nobody needs fear. human, by his nature and in his pure form, is a fearless creature. in general we fear when we think in loops and thinking in loops is not religion; it is most likely a disease of mind; a very bad habit.
i wonder .. don't you think laws of government dictate your life? do you think they are acceptable? if yes, why being dictated by other humans is acceptable? they are people like you and obviously you are not the one who wrote all the laws

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