Premarital Sex vs. Homosexuality

[Misty]

How did women worked out that they should not do it standing up?
In respect to the unnatural use of women this may make it clearer.
Rom 1:27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.
Do you think that God is ok with indecency?
Has God at any time condoned this behaviour?
I say no, rather He calls it “indecent acts” “perversion”
perversion
perversion [pər vúrsh’n]
(plural perversions)
n (disapproving)
1. unusual sexual practice: a sexual practice regarded as abnormal
2. turning of good into bad: the changing of something good, true, or correct into something bad or wrong or a situation in which the change has occurred
perversion of justice

Encarta ® World English Dictionary © & (P) 1998-2004 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.
It is clear if anybody want to be Christian they must resign to this perversion.

If people want sex Karma Sutra style, why not? No one is forcing you to do so, you stick to the so called missionary position if it does it for you.

 

[emiliano]

Yes, why not? Whatever turns you on providing you are in an adult consenting relationship, and not cheating on your partner gay or straight.

I don’t know nor I care what secular institution tolerate or the their age limit for their behaviour, that is a secular problem, it is their problem. Fortunately for us our religious authorities do not apply these doctrine, the conflict that we have is with those that want to change our doctrines for theirs. It is clear that Christianity is not for you I accept this and I can see reasons for it you want to do “Whatever turns you on” for that you have to stay as you are, don’t call yourself Christian though..

 

[emiliano]

If people want sex Karma Sutra style, why not? No one is forcing you to do so, you stick to the so called missionary position if it does it for you.

What karma Sutra got to do with homosexuality and pre-marriage?
Do homosexual and fornicator practice it?

 

[Misty]

Why so judgemental emiliano? There are homosexual Christians too you know. Why are you so concerned about what people get up to in bed whether they are Christians or atheists? It is none of your business, you enjoy your sex life and let others enjoy theirs.

 

[Skwim]

Homosexuals are not regarded as Christians,

I just love it when Christians decide who does and does not deserve to be wear the label. With 33,830 denominations* it must be a chore, but somebody has to do it.

* source

 

[kejos]

I just love it when Christians decide who does and does not deserve to be wear the label.

Yeah. It should be pagans who do that.

 

[Skwim]

Yeah. It should be pagans who do that.

But they don't because they don't care. Seems it's only Christians who care about a properly filled out admittance form; each with their own set of requirements. Looking in from outside it's kind of amusing.

 

[kejos]

But they don't because they don't care.

Whoah! Everywhere, pagans get distinctly ruffled if their untouchable mantra that any who call themselves Christians are Christians gets touched. Pagans decide, and woe betide any who dare to suggest otherwise.

 

[McBell]

Rom 1:27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.

This verse come much closer to saying that homosexuality is not natural.
However, it could be argued that a heterosexual man engaging in homosexual sex would be as un-natural as a homosexual man engaging in heterosexual sex.

Indecent does not automatically equate to unnatural.
Perversity is in the eyes of the perceiver, not in what is being perceived.

Do you think that God is ok with indecency?

Guess it depends upon whether or not it is God being indecent or ordering the indecency.

Has God at any time condoned this behaviour?

AH, so slavery is ok, but homosexuality is out.
Gotcha.

By the way, when has god condoned the use of technology?
Or is this yet another area where you pick and choose?

It is clear if anybody want to be Christian they must resign to this perversion.

Ah, so you are free of sin then?
Or is it just this particular sin that one HAS to be completely free from?

You at least seem to be consistent.
You seem to apply your pick and choose logic to all the Bible....

 

[justbehappy]

You miss the point here, there are several kinds of love and expressing love in this way is specifically forbidden to Christian congregations. It is a prohibition to Christian, you are free to choose any religion you want, but if you want to become a Christian you must obey what the Christian doctrines command, it is the duty of all Christians to let you know of the all restrictions that Christianity has on its members, that is in the case that you want to become a member of the Christian Church. Do you? Thus this is right you can’t be a homosexual and a Christian at the same time, you must resign to this behaviour, repent and change or else you cannot be a Christian and I can tell you that been a Christian is not easy and that is not a promise that the Bible makes.
Mat 13:38 The field is the world, the good seeds are the sons of the kingdom, but the tares are the sons of the wicked [one].
There are two desires that are presented to us, one is God’s desires and our desires choose right! BTW the way I thought that you are bi-sexual.

I posted this in response to what kejos said:

Homosexuals are sinners, correct?
Adulterers, rapists, murderers, burgulars, they're all sinners, correct? Are they not regarded as Christians either, just because they are sinners?
And really, wouldn't it be that NO ONE is Christian because NO ONE is without sin?
I seriously do not understand your logic here.

 

[McBell]

don’t call yourself Christian though..

By what authority do you demand that another person not call them self a Christian?

 

[McBell]

Whoah! Everywhere, pagans get distinctly ruffled if their untouchable mantra that any who call themselves Christians are Christians gets touched. Pagans decide, and woe betide any who dare to suggest otherwise.

What a most excellent piece of over dramatic bull ****!
I am most impressed!

You have outdone yourself!
Congrats!

 

[justbehappy]

You still don’t get it, you are not excommunicated because you sin, we are all sinner, you are excommunicate if you refuse to repent and change.
Gal 6:1 Brethren, if a man is overtaken in any trespass, you who are spiritual restore such a one in a spirit of gentleness, considering yourself lest you also be tempted.
How do you think that your brother in the contrabassoon can restore you?
By changing God’s law?
By accepting you’re your doctrines?

Let me challenge you with this.
When people sin, they know they are sinning and do it anyways, correct?
Why is it then that most homosexuals do not feel they are sinning? I am speaking of Christian homosexuals here btw. Why will God not make their conscious aware that what they are doing is wrong?

 

[justbehappy]

It is only a matter of looking at the way we are a made. A male and a female humans part clearly indicate it natural use, thinking/seen it in another way is abnormal. Also the way we name them indicate their natural use “reproductive organs” does this suggest to you that it natural/normal use is to have sex with one of the same gender?

I am not normal. I have never been normal. Other than the fact that I have tattoos, piercings, and dye my hair, would God condemn me for not acting like a normal person does?
I sleep on the hard floor when I have a perfectly good bed, Lady Gaga's style is my inspiration, I want to wear a pink wedding dress, I play video games all the time even though I'm an adult, I've never had a real job because I'm an entrepeneur, I like to wear wigs and pretend I'm someone else, I still love Pokemon, I want a bazillion kids, and I want to live in Antarctica for a year. I'm weird and that's who I am. But I don't think God would want me to not be myself. My personality does not follow the norm and I'm not going to change so that I 'fit in with nature.'

 

[kejos]

Let me challenge you with this.
When people sin, they know they are sinning and do it anyways, correct?
Why is it then that most homosexuals do not feel they are sinning?

Perhaps they do. Several of my acquaintance have admitted that they feel self-revulsion after the act, but come to terms with it after a while.

I am speaking of Christian homosexuals here btw.

And those people include some who call themselves Christians.

Why will God not make their conscious aware that what they are doing is wrong?

If the Bible is God's message, he does. If it isn't, why do some homosexuals so badly want to be called Christians?

 

[justbehappy]

But they are told 'You don't know what you're missing.'

Lucky they don't believe it, eh.

Are you serious?? You think we're trying to turn people gay or something? Newsflash: You're straight and you don't want to be gay. We're gay and we don't want to be straight. There's no changing how people feel and we are quite aware of that.

 

[Skwim]

Whoah! Everywhere, pagans get distinctly ruffled if their untouchable mantra that any who call themselves Christians are Christians gets touched.

Show me one pagan who gets ruffled if a person does or does not call himself a Christian. It's Christians who have some proprietary need to regulate the membership who get ruffled, just as you are now.

Pagans decide, and woe betide any who dare to suggest otherwise.

Unfortunately, saying it's so doesn't make it so. But hey, if you have examples of pagans deciding who is and is not a Christian I'm all ears.

 

[justbehappy]

Perhaps they do. Several of my acquaintance have admitted that they feel self-revulsion after the act, but come to terms with it after a while.

I was not always Agnostic but I've always been bisexual. Even when I was Christian, I knew that homosexuality was not a sin. I think it is harder for people who are straight to understand it. You assume that you know what we feel and you assume it is not every other sinful desire, but it truly is not. Sins are not part of who you are - and your sexual orientation is.
My best friend is also bisexual, and her sister is the most Christian person I've probably ever met in her life. At first, she was very saddened to find out that her sister was gay, but after listening to her and hearing her out about her feelings, she came to the decision (with God always with her) that homosexuality was not a sin.

And those people include some who call themselves Christians.
If the Bible is God's message, he does. If it isn't, why do some homosexuals so badly want to be called Christians?

Again who are YOU to say who can be called a Christian? Because I've heard that the definition is simply someone who believes in Jesus Christ, and that he is our savior and he died on the cross for us.

 

[kejos]

I was not always Agnostic but I've always been bisexual. Even when I was Christian, I knew that homosexuality was not a sin. I think it is harder for people who are straight to understand it. You assume that you know what we feel and you assume it is not every other sinful desire, but it truly is not. Sins are not part of who you are - and your sexual orientation is.

The fact is that the Bible, pre-Moses, in Mosaic Law, and post-Moses, puts homosexuality into the category of sinful behavior. Nobody can change that. So homosexuals have to make a decision. Either the Bible deity is at fault; or their understanding of their practice is at fault. I fully realise how serious that decision is, but nobody can avoid its necessity. I suggest, though, that homosexuals, like almost everyone in the Western world, have a very shallow concept of what sin really is, and how serious its consequences, and the supposed churches of the West do not help, so solicitous are they of worldly approval. It is not as though God is telling people to give up eating, or anything else that gives life and health. Abstinence from sexual activity does no harm, and surely, it is a small price to pay for eternal life. As they say, you're dead a long time- and this life may seem to us like ten minutes in comparison.

Again who are YOU to say who can be called a Christian? Because I've heard that the definition is simply someone who believes in Jesus Christ, and that he is our savior and he died on the cross for us.

It depends on what is meant by 'believes in'. If it is an intellectual belief that Jesus died for one's sins, it's not enough. The Greek and Hebrew words for 'believe' also mean 'trust'- so one cannot divorce belief from trust when it comes to Christianity, though a major difference grew up in the centuries following Christ, when nominalism led to intellectual faith without personal trust. It also involves love- 'we love because he first loved us,' John wrote, and if the threat of eternal hell is not enough, the love of Jesus through the cross is sufficient. Personal trust and love is what Paul referred to when he wrote that some of the saints had been homosexuals, but were no longer so. There are reformed drunks, druggies, thieves, fornicators, and yes, homosexuals, and some of them are able to give up their practices immediately on conversion. Others need help, but complete change is possible in time, and persons with homosexual desires before conversion can have satisfying heterosexual marriages after conversion. The important thing, and a rather rare thing in the West, is genuine conversion, which involves taking sides with God against oneself- hating one's sins, and loving God in Christ enough to put them into the past.

 

[sojourner]

Why do you see either as a problem?

This is a switch for you...