"Without God, Life Has No Purpose . . . . . . ."

[Skwim]

I know what my definition of 'god' is. What do you think it is, that you can decide that I'm not abiding by it?

Didn't say you weren't abiding by it, did I. My point was simply that in claiming "We BECOME God. . . ." would require a definition of "god" that I've never heard of before. Now if, in fact, we, you or I, can actually become god, exactly what do you regard god to be? I know that in Mormonism "god" generally refers to God the Father, sometimes called Elohim. Is this who you're saying we become?

.

 

[Skwim]

No reason! Good job Skwim.

tack så mycket

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[InChrist]

Why did you accept the bible? If I may ask

Although, I was raised Catholic we never read the Bible, nor did I give it much thought. Nevertheless, for some reason I always felt there was something special about the Bible. One time, when I was facing a serious situation I picked up the Bible, opened it to a page, my eyes went directly to certain words which so appropriately applied to the situation. I followed the direction given and saw the situation resolved even better than I could have hoped for. But still went on for years ignoring the Bible. Finally, through various religious experiences I attempted to really read it without much success at all in making sense of it. It wasn't until I personally trusted Jesus (alone) as my Savior that the Bible made sense. It's not as if I understood everything, but it felt like it became an open book from Genesis to Revelation with the theme and message throughout so obvious, but to which I was blind to before. I have done years of research since that time and all of the reasons you have shared for rejecting the Bible, I see the opposite, and are some of the very points which verify to me the reliability and authenticity of the scriptures as God's Word.

Here is a linked article you may or may not be interested in:
The Reliability of Scripture: "That Which We Have Seen With Our Eyes"

 

[InChrist]

Well for one, the historicity of the bible.

This one is pretty interesting, too...

"We’ve heard a lot about “fake news” this year, and last week we were treated to a flurry of fake news aimed at the reliability of the Bible. A study published in the American Journal of Human Genetics reported that DNA from 3,700-year-old Canaanite remains closely matches that of the modern Lebanese. In other words, a major biblical people are alive and well, still living in the region!

It was an exciting confirmation of the Bible’s history. But for a dozen or so major media outlets, it was precisely the opposite.

“Study disproves the Bible’s suggestion that the ancient Canaanites were wiped out,” trumpeted the UK Telegraph.

The Independent declared, “The Bible says Canaanites were wiped out by Israelites but scientists just found their descendants living in Lebanon.”

And ABC Online reported: “Canaanites survived Biblical ‘slaughter,’ ancient DNA shows.”

Even the journal, Science, joined the debacle with the headline, “Ancient DNA counters biblical account of the mysterious Canaanites.” Science soon issued a casual correction, saying, “The story and its headline have been updated to reflect that in the Bible, God ordered the destruction of the Canaanites, but that some cities and people may have survived.”

“May have?” Uh, these reporters might want to re-read their Bibles. Or maybe read them for the first time. Because far from claiming the Canaanites were wiped out, Scripture records in numerous places that large Canaanite populations survived and thrived in the region.

As David Klinghoffer at Evolution News points out, “The first chapter in Judges lists all the places in Israel where the Canaanites persisted…‘for they [the Israelites] did not drive them out.’”

And in the next chapter, God rebukes Israel for not driving the Canaanites out, saying “They shall become thorns in your sides, and their gods shall be a snare to you.” Much of the remainder of the Old Testament is the sad fulfillment of this prophecy.

Some Canaanites, like Rahab, who hid the spies at Jericho, converted to the Hebrew religion and were incorporated into Israel. And in Joshua 9, we learn that the entire Canaanite city of Gibeon tricked Israel into a peace treaty, and its people were allowed to stay.

Even in the New Testament, in Matthew 15, we read of a Canaanite woman who begged Jesus to heal her demon-possessed daughter. He famously rebuffs her twice before seeing her “great faith” and granting the request.

And according to the genealogies of Matthew and Luke, Jesus Himself had Canaanite DNA, as he was descended from David through Jesse, Obed, and Boaz whose mother was…Rahab.

All of this goes to show how biased much of the news media are against Judeo-Christianity. But it also shows that we’re living in a time of startling biblical illiteracy.

The fate of the Canaanites sets the stage for much of the biblical drama. In other words, knowing it isn’t a matter of being religious, but of having a basic acquaintance with the most influential book in Western civilization."
Missing the Canaanites in Plain Site: The Media Need to Read the Bible

 

[QuestioningMind]

I don't think fear is always the opposite of love. I love the ocean, but also fear or respect the inherent dangers it poses. I love having a fire, in the fireplace, but understand that there are dangers associated with fire. I love horses, but realize they are powerful animals and one must be careful around them.

All you've done is demonstrate that people can have have opposing feelings about the same thing.

 

[siti]

I happened upon the quote below while searching for information on replacing a toilet---don't ask. In any case, it appears to be just the
kind of religious chatter that would appeal to RF Christians. So, look it over and tell us what you think.

Just as a note of information: Richard Duane "Rick" Warren (born January 28, 1954) is an American evangelical Christian pastor and author.
He is the founder and senior pastor of Saddleback Church, an evangelical megachurch in Lake Forest, California, the eighth-largest church in the United States

​

Is it pretty much right on or is it just so much Sunday morning blather?

I suggest asking yourself:

Why would life necessarily have no purpose without god ? (Not quite sure what is meant by "without god.")

Why would life necessarily have no meaning if it has no purpose?

Why would would life necessarily lack significance or hope if it had no meaning?

.​

What did you find out about replacing toilets?

 

[osgart]

This one is pretty interesting, too...

"We’ve heard a lot about “fake news” this year, and last week we were treated to a flurry of fake news aimed at the reliability of the Bible. A study published in the American Journal of Human Genetics reported that DNA from 3,700-year-old Canaanite remains closely matches that of the modern Lebanese. In other words, a major biblical people are alive and well, still living in the region!

It was an exciting confirmation of the Bible’s history. But for a dozen or so major media outlets, it was precisely the opposite.

“Study disproves the Bible’s suggestion that the ancient Canaanites were wiped out,” trumpeted the UK Telegraph.

The Independent declared, “The Bible says Canaanites were wiped out by Israelites but scientists just found their descendants living in Lebanon.”

And ABC Online reported: “Canaanites survived Biblical ‘slaughter,’ ancient DNA shows.”

Even the journal, Science, joined the debacle with the headline, “Ancient DNA counters biblical account of the mysterious Canaanites.” Science soon issued a casual correction, saying, “The story and its headline have been updated to reflect that in the Bible, God ordered the destruction of the Canaanites, but that some cities and people may have survived.”

“May have?” Uh, these reporters might want to re-read their Bibles. Or maybe read them for the first time. Because far from claiming the Canaanites were wiped out, Scripture records in numerous places that large Canaanite populations survived and thrived in the region.

As David Klinghoffer at Evolution News points out, “The first chapter in Judges lists all the places in Israel where the Canaanites persisted…‘for they [the Israelites] did not drive them out.’”

And in the next chapter, God rebukes Israel for not driving the Canaanites out, saying “They shall become thorns in your sides, and their gods shall be a snare to you.” Much of the remainder of the Old Testament is the sad fulfillment of this prophecy.

Some Canaanites, like Rahab, who hid the spies at Jericho, converted to the Hebrew religion and were incorporated into Israel. And in Joshua 9, we learn that the entire Canaanite city of Gibeon tricked Israel into a peace treaty, and its people were allowed to stay.

Even in the New Testament, in Matthew 15, we read of a Canaanite woman who begged Jesus to heal her demon-possessed daughter. He famously rebuffs her twice before seeing her “great faith” and granting the request.

And according to the genealogies of Matthew and Luke, Jesus Himself had Canaanite DNA, as he was descended from David through Jesse, Obed, and Boaz whose mother was…Rahab.

All of this goes to show how biased much of the news media are against Judeo-Christianity. But it also shows that we’re living in a time of startling biblical illiteracy.

The fate of the Canaanites sets the stage for much of the biblical drama. In other words, knowing it isn’t a matter of being religious, but of having a basic acquaintance with the most influential book in Western civilization."
Missing the Canaanites in Plain Site: The Media Need to Read the Bible

And how would you verify Jonah, Noah, and the Tower of Babel?

I simply don't believe in a supernatural causation. It's an extraordinary claim.

My father had a book by josephus, I'll have to look at it.

We used to get The Berean Call too.

 

[InChrist]

And how would you verify Jonah, Noah, and the Tower of Babel?

I simply don't believe in a supernatural causation. It's an extraordinary claim.

My father had a book by josephus, I'll have to look at it.

We used to get The Berean Call too.

I just don't think what appear to be supernatural, miraculous events to us as humans are a problem for the extraordinary God who created the heavens and the earth. Besides Jesus validated these events, at least related to Jonah and Noah, by His words and that gives enough credibility for me.

 

[dfnj]

I happened upon the quote below while searching for information on replacing a toilet-

I'm not sure life has purpose with God either.

Sometimes art just exists to exist.

 

[dfnj]

Looks like some smug douche who went and quoted his own self thinking that he was sagely and clever.

Crap, you've just described every post I've ever made here!

 

[Trailblazer]

I suggest asking yourself:

Why would life necessarily have no purpose without god ? (Not quite sure what is meant by "without god.")

Why would life necessarily have no meaning if it has no purpose?

Why would would life necessarily lack significance or hope if it had no meaning?​

I would think that “without god” means if god does not exist.

If God does not exist, then life has purpose without God. Humans can then define their own purpose, if they want to. Even if they do not “assign” a purpose, they still have a purpose. Nothing can exist without a purpose for it to exist.

If God exists, then God determines what our purpose is since God created us.

According to my religion we were created to know and love God. Before we can love God we need to know God.After we know God we try to adhere to what has been revealed in the scriptures; teachings and laws. Loving God is a personal matter we all struggle with and it means different things to different people.

“The beginning of all things is the knowledge of God, and the end of all things is strict observance of whatsoever hath been sent down from the empyrean of the Divine Will that pervadeth all that is in the heavens and all that is on the earth.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 5

For all intents and purposes, with regards to life, meaning means the same thing as purpose:

The meaning of life, or the answer to the question "What is the meaning of life?", pertains to the significance of living or existence in general. Many other related questions include "Why are we here?", "What is life all about?", or "What is the purpose of existence?" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meaning_of_life

Significance is the same thing as meaning.

Meaning is assigned. People who believe in a God accept the meaning that God assigns through the scriptures of their religion and try to live according to them. That gives us hope because we believe there is an “ultimate” purpose for our existence, something beyond mere physical survival. This is related to the afterlife we believe is the main act of the play, since it is eternal.

Nonbelievers can assign their own meanings and I would expect that they would feel hope if they are living according to meanings they assign.

 

[Skwim]

What did you find out about replacing toilets?

Make sure the water supply is turned off.

Make sure the bowl is drained.

Make sure you properly seat the wax ring.

Use a new water supply line.

Don't over tighten the hold-down nuts.

Remember to turn the water back on.

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[Skwim]

I would think that “without god” means if god does not exist.

The other possibility is that one simply doesn't accept a supposedly existing god.

.

 

[Trailblazer]

The other possibility is that one simply doesn't accept a supposedly existing god..

That is possible, I kinda been there, done that myself...

 

[james bond]

I'm sure Rick Warren has something more in mind when he says this. In response, I don't think one needs God in this life to have a purpose. There are many successful people in "this" life who do not believe in God. I would think Rick is referring to the perfect spiritual life or the perfect second life when he talks about God in order to have a purpose. He's seeing the forest beyond the trees. I would think he's talking about worshiping and thanking God for our blessings in this life and what's to come if one's faith is true. All sorts of things crop up and get in the way in our physical life that could derail the best of intentions for keeping our faith in God.

 

[Buddha Dharma]

@Skwim the guy that made that statement comes across as extremely depressed

 

[ThePainefulTruth]

I happened upon the quote below while searching for information on replacing a toilet---don't ask. In any case, it appears to be just the
kind of religious chatter that would appeal to RF Christians. So, look it over and tell us what you think.

Just as a note of information: Richard Duane "Rick" Warren (born January 28, 1954) is an American evangelical Christian pastor and author.
He is the founder and senior pastor of Saddleback Church, an evangelical megachurch in Lake Forest, California, the eighth-largest church in the United States

​

Is it pretty much right on or is it just so much Sunday morning blather?

I suggest asking yourself:

Why would life necessarily have no purpose without god ? (Not quite sure what is meant by "without god.")

Why would life necessarily have no meaning if it has no purpose?

Why would would life necessarily lack significance or hope if it had no meaning?

.​

IF you define God as the equivalent of Truth, then yeah, without the pursuit/worship of Truth (knowledge, justice, love and beauty), life does have no purpose. Meaning simpley means having a purpose. And significance is just another word for meaning. And faced with deism and atheism as the only two reasonable possibilities concerning God, given the complete lack of evidence either way, the only difference between the two from our perspective, is hope.

 

[Scott C.]

I happened upon the quote below while searching for information on replacing a toilet---don't ask. In any case, it appears to be just the
kind of religious chatter that would appeal to RF Christians. So, look it over and tell us what you think.

I thought it was the atheists who frequently criticize Christians for thinking that life has meaning and purpose.

 

[Valjean]

I thought it was the atheists who frequently criticize Christians for thinking that life as meaning and purpose.

Why would anyone criticize that? We all seek meaning and purpose.

 

[Skwim]

Why would anyone criticize that? We all seek meaning and purpose.

Not all of us.

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