Why Do You Suppose Athiests Are So Interested In Religion

[greatcalgarian]

Generally that's right. Non-Atheists may ask questions but may not present views. That's true for all the forums in Discuss Indivivual Religions

No wonder these threads are so quiet and not exciting at all.:jiggy:

 

[Pah]

No wonder these threads are so quiet and not exciting at all.:jiggy:

Yeah, the purpose here is a more direct attempt at education and that can be quite dry. But there is no reason not to bring a subject to other parts of the board for a larger audience.

 

[michel]

Hi Pinoy, Namaste.

I notice that this is your first post on this forum, and I wanted to take the opportunity to welcome you; You might find this helpful: Articles for New Members ; from there, there is a link to the forum rules.

I hope you enjoy the forum, and happy posting.

 

[s2a]

I have no belief, yet I am fascinated by religion. For myself this is a bizarre contradiction, I'm not technically athiest - I coudn't actually care less if God exists, yet I like to discuss the implications of religion. I don't care if other people believe in god (insofar as I do not feel compulsed to judge) but I like to hear what they have to say. I think I might just like to argue.

Any non-theistic people have similar disposition? Or are the wheels in my head in need of oiling again?

Is this the counter of the religious tendency of some to ask me similarly reversed questions?

It's not so much that I am "interested" in religion (as in a "search" for "truth") than the plain fact that I am virtually surrounded by sectarian adherents to (primarily) the Christian faith.

Most earnestly and sincerely, I don't care whether someone "believes in" a "God", multiple "gods", planetary alignments, or some spiritual "force". It's all bunk to me. If "believers" could keep and apply their dogma, "commandments", and "truths" to themselves...and worship/follow their god(s)/spirit(s)/"force(s)" strictly for their own placation/needs/purposes - I would have no interest in "religion" whatsoever.

But...(and here's the rub), some religious adherents (primarily Christian within the United States), seek to impose their dogmatic/religious beliefs as a matter of civic policy and criminal law upon all U.S. citizens, regardless of any individual's beliefs (or lack thereof).

I once (most sincerely) swore a solemn oath (which I intend to dutifully honor until my final breath) to "...Preserve, protect, and defend THE CONSTITUTION of the United States against all enemies, both foreign and domestic...".

It is most worthy of demonstrably abject fact that the US Constitution is a purposefully *secular* document, with NO mention of "God", "Jesus", the "Bible", or Christianity (or any other popular religion/myth/superstition). The ONLY two references the Constitution (and attached Amendments) offers regarding ANY religion is that NO religious TEST be imposed upon any public servant of the people, and that government neither impede nor favor any religious belief or sect (and NO..."secularism/pluralism" is NOT a religion - it's a concept that NO religion/belief is superior/inferior to another in the circumspect eye of governmental control/influence).

Ergo, those that seek to impose (as a matter of civic policy/criminal law) their religious DOGMA within a secular/pluralistic self-governed republic of FREE (to choose) citizens, are...to my sworn and (succinctly) defined perspective...*enemies* of the Constitution that I have sworn with my very mortal existence (such as it may be) to preserve and protect. It is my patriotic DUTY to understand any enemies that, by inexorable will or by economic/political force, would choose to subvert/dispose/obviate the very basic tenants and protections that the Constitution affords to ALL citizens.

Those that seek to minimize/obviate/eradicate the civil liberties/freedoms of citizens otherwise deemed to be "immoral", "sinful", or generically heretically "secular" - primarily predicated upon imposed religious dogma and obedience to said same - are "enemies' (no matter how "well intentioned" or piously motivated) of foundational constitutional principles and ideals, and are necessarily opposed by oath-bound defenders of intrinsic/inherent/foundational constitutional principles and ideals.

"If you know the enemy and know yourself you need not fear the results of a hundred battles."
- Sun Tzu, "The Art of War"

It is most noteworthy, and must be said that I do not deem Christians (or others of sectarian/religious/mythological/supernaturalist beliefs) as preternatural "enemies" (of self-determination or democratically republican governance); not unless/until they seek to impose and enforce their "beliefs (dogma)" upon unbelievers...

It's not what religious adherents "believe" that is at constant issue...it's "why" they believe "what" they believe...that causes the conflict and clash of "cultural" ideologies. Understanding polarized and divergent religiously-derived viewpoints (even absent concession and/or acceptance) is the only viable course and method of ultimately sustaining and preserving any secular/pluralistically founded society that seeks to preserve, protect, and defend the rights of the individual to 'believe" their own ordained or derived personalized "truths".

 

[Pah]

I have to echo s2a's purpose. The enemy within has become those Christians that would impose religious morality in social law. It is never the sodliers on the field that typify the enemy; it is the "generals" leading the charge based upon a doubtful religious scripture. They fight against my privacy, my freedoms, and my rights. Why mine, when I'm not a direct target of their opprobrium? Because, to borrow from a Christian principle, when they succeed in surpressing the least of my brother citizens, they diminish me as well.

Why do I have an interest in Religion - the Christian religion? Because I am as armed as they with what the bible teaches. Not by verse but certainly the concepts and many details they mistakenly apply. The more I see some Christians "in action" the more I know without doubt there is no God. And, that my friends, is a prized American recognized right

 

[Yerda]

If "believers" could keep and apply their dogma, "commandments", and "truths" to themselves...and worship/follow their god(s)/spirit(s)/"force(s)" strictly for their own placation/needs/purposes - I would have no interest in "religion" whatsoever.

I see.

Over here (Scotland) there is not a great deal of religious zeal attempting to convert the populace, or force (supposedly) divinely inspired morality upon everyone.

I think (to answer my own question) my interest in religion has followed from my interest in humans, the differences and similarities, the rise and fall. Religion might hold useful clues as to the nature and environment of pre-historic peoples as well as more recent civilisations. Failing that, they make for interesting reading.

 

[greatcalgarian]

Canadian likes to follow the US. Alberta is the 'strong hold' of evangelical Christianity. I hope it will not proceed to the stage currently happening in the US.

 

[Vet873]

the thing is that people keep pointing us out and saying false statements about us and so in turn we are so iteressted in their religion so as to exclude it. it makes me wonder why people are so weak as to have to look to an alternate force and make up all this stuff to make other people follow.i study religion to find flaws and to prove them wrong so they understand the truth.

 

[s2a]

Hello Vet873,

You said,

"the thing is that people keep pointing us out and saying false statements about us and so in turn we are so iteressted in their religion so as to exclude it."

I would readily concede (as a self-professed atheist myself) that misunderstandings and mischaracterizations of what atheism IS (or more succinctly, what it is NOT) are commonplace in general society, and often manifested/magnified in religious discussion forums amongst the willfully ignorant and naively uninformed (or purposed and motivated nay-saying evangelists).

However, as a "life-long" atheist, I can earnestly state that I maintain no "checklist" of religions/superstitions/myths/legends to somehow categorically "write-off" as "excluded", or "illegitimate". If supernatural cause/effect claims are unacceptable as logical (and/or scientifically derivable) explanations of natural phenomena, then all such "beliefs" are so much bunk and wishful-thinking superstition. "Legitimacy" of any one specified religion/belief is subject to the same standards and burdens of proof as any other. When such standards and burdens are unmet or unsubstantiated (most of which retain a requisite standard or burden of "faith" in acceptance of specified claim as "true"), then specified "checklists" of denominational/organized/affiliated religious sects/beliefs/superstitions are rendered essentially moot (if predicated upon acceptance of "faith" in supernatural claims).

Rejection (non-acceptance) of religion is not the same as atheism. If you retain doubts as to the credibility or validity (or verifiability) of supernatural cause/effect claims, then perhaps you might consider yourself an agnostic, or erstwhile generalized "freethinker". Atheists retain no reasonable doubts whatsoever as to the validity/verifiability of supernatural claims/explanations of natural phenomena.

"it makes me wonder why people are so weak as to have to look to an alternate force and make up all this stuff to make other people follow.

"

Be not so quick to judge others. Religion offers many in times of crisis or loss a feeling of hope and "ultimate" purpose, that atheism neither offers nor promises. Many "believe" in the "spirit" of a secular Christmas, or promoting happy and uplifting icons of imaginary promise and reward, like Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny , and the Tooth Fairy. Is it cruel and mortally dishonest to suggest such imaginary and invisible icons to a child befuddled and confused by a hugely complex and fast-paced world that some compassionate and caring entity and third-party values and is focused upon their youthfully idyllic individual needs and concerns? I think not.

Of course, at some point, we need to mature emotionally and intellectually - and assume adult responsibilities/accountabilities - and realize/accept that invisible, compassionate, and benevolently-acting omniscient entities are merely constructs of abject hope and wishful thinking...but let's not (just yet) expect critical thinking and rational extrapolations, predicated upon experience and informed evaluation, from a four-year-old child.

"i study religion to find flaws and to prove them wrong so they understand the truth."

Oh?

I too am a student of religious beliefs. While I would accede that many flaws of reason or credulity are veritably extant within such (claims of supernatural cause/effect), I have yet to unveil any "truths" (beyond some personalized and individualized existential truth) that lends "disproof" of claims purely predicated upon faith itself.

If you have some "universal truth" that an atheistic perspective is categorically and irrevocably so ascribed...I'd like to hear what it may be.

 

[Majikthise]

Just a reminder to everyone that the Atheism forum is for discussing Atheism, not for putting down other religions,that's not what atheism is about.

That depends on the atheist you talk to.

 

[Snowbear]

... but now I am concerned not with what makes you you but with what makes you want me to be you.

I would never want anyone to be me. That would be too cruel.

Even before I was a Christian, I was interested in religions, including the "non-religion" of atheism/agnostisism.

I actually still am interested in the various religions (and again, non-religions), though I'm pretty much put off by the trappings, rituals and icons of most of them.

Though of course, I would not deny anyone their right to practice or not practice any religions or "belief system" they choose

 

[Bennettresearch]

Maybe someone here would be interested as to how an Atheist became a Christian?
I was raised by Atheists and by the time I was in my early twenties I didn't really know anything about religion at all. Sure, I was taught morals as such, but it was not attached to any religion.
Sure, I read about buddism and other religions but didn't sign on to anything. My transcendance into Christianity came about as a personal revelation and epiphany. I quickly became non-sectarian though because I had problems with sects that I encountered.
I am most happy with this position because I am not struggling with or defending a particular faith that I was raised in. I maintain objectivity. The entire spectrum of Christian sects and faiths can be overwhelming. This is where I think Atheism becomes a choice for some people. Dogma runs rampant in many cases.
It may interest some Christians in this forum that I arrived at my position through a Gnostic approach even though I was not aware of Gnosticism at the time. The inner path to enlightenment so to speak.
I think that many Atheists are here because they may be seeking but have not found what they are looking for yet. Just a thought.

 

[Darkdale]

the thing is that people keep pointing us out and saying false statements about us and so in turn we are so iteressted in their religion so as to exclude it. it makes me wonder why people are so weak as to have to look to an alternate force and make up all this stuff to make other people follow.i study religion to find flaws and to prove them wrong so they understand the truth.

Religion, for me, is about tradition. It's no different than say, celebrating Thanksgiving, the 4th of July or Saint Patricks Day. Religion takes myth, adds tradition and allows people to indulge their spirituality (or what you might call, imagination). As long as people keep their religious beliefs to themselves, what possible harm could it do to others?

For people who do not have a religious tradition, I understand atheism. It makes sense. But, I choose to follow the religious traditions of my eldest ancestors.

 

[s2a]

Hello Bennettresearch,

You said:

I think that many Atheists are here because they may be seeking but have not found what they are looking for yet. Just a thought.

Well, that's one thought....

...here's another. ;-)

[ http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=15962 ]

 

[Aletheia Athanatos]

I think you have a selection effect going on.

When talking online, if a particular atheist happens to be interested in religion, that increases the chance of your noticing that they are an atheist.