Why Desire Moksha?

[Aupmanyav]

Can Brahman, existing alone in a state of bliss, become self aware through experiencing creation? ..

could such people be those who will be harvested at the next evolutionary step, the ones who go on to lead humankind, .. What do you think?

Bliss is another problem. Brahman can experience bliss only if it is taken to be a being. Is Brahman a being? For me, Brahman is a force, physical energy, heat, light, magnetism, gravity, sub-atomic, etc. That way I escape many problems. Brahman then cannot be blamed for the maladies of humans (without creating any additional beings, Devil, Satan, Rakshasas and Asuras).

I am not very hopeful on the second count. Humans are a flawed product. Jesus told his disciples that the Kingdom of God will come during their lifetime. It does not seem to have worked out that way. Allah asks us to wait till the Mahdi comes. Hindus ask you to wait for 427,000 years, when the tenth avatara of Lord Vishnu, Kalki, will appear. May the predictions of these Nostradami come true.

 

[Daniel108]

There are only two ways, IMO. Either experience for self or have sraddhA in guru and/or scripture.

Yes. Perhaps having faith in the latter way, finally leads to the former way

 

[Shantanu]

Namaskaram Shantanu ji



Certainly one should maintain Rightious behavior , if this is what you call dignity , ...yes realising what the right behavior is we should allways behave in a rightious manner , ....not stooping to un dignified behavior is prehaps what I would call not stooping to un Dharmic behavior , ......we should without doubt follow the example set by Lord Rama who came to rid the world of the evil , ....but to do this he took the incarnation of a Kshatrya , thus showing that the lord himself does not tollerate evil , ..but that it must be dealt with in the correct way , ...even in Ram Lila the evil ravan must give Lord Rama the reason to have him killed , ..equaly in the Mahabarata Krsna first advises the Kuravas to desist from their evil ways only when they do not head his warnings does the situation become so irreversable that the Lord instructs Arjuna to fight , .....

the question I think you and I need to ask is how we are supposed to deal with Ignorance or evil , ....we must first understand our own Dharma and be fully surrendered to the supreme , ...what l am prehaps trying to say is that we are not in the best position to deal with adharmic behavior if we are not fully surrendered as there is gerat danger of our acting from a point of self interest , ...this Krsna warns against when he says we should act without expecting any result , ....as only the truely surrendered soul understands the intricacies of Karma , .....if we act from self interest we may be making a grave mistake as self interest blinds us to the true situation, ....

God residing within our hearts, when surrendered to, definitely outlines the plan that is to be adopted in fighting evil so that the selfish-self wanting revenge, mankind generally, and other inhabitants of the planet all benefit from the appropriate destruction of evil which propagates lies and perpetrates inhuman cruelty and decimation of nature. We should definitely leave God to dish out the justice that is appropriate on evildooers. When the shloka goes 'yada yada hi dharmasya...' etc, what is implied is the excess of evil in the world which prevents ordinary people from living in good way. God has to attack the very core of evil to save mankind.

 

[Daniel108]

Bliss is another problem. Brahman can experience bliss only if it is taken to be a being. Is Brahman a being? For me, Brahman is a force, physical energy, heat, light, magnetism, gravity, sub-atomic, etc. That way I escape many problems. Brahman then cannot be blamed for the maladies of humans (without creating any additional beings, Devil, Satan, Rakshasas and Asuras).

I am not very hopeful on the second count. Humans are a flawed product. Jesus told his disciples that the Kingdom of God will come during their lifetime. It does not seem to have worked out that way. Allah asks us to wait till the Mahdi comes. Hindus ask you to wait for 427,000 years, when the tenth avatara of Lord Vishnu, Kalki, will appear. May the predictions of these Nostradami come true.

It is difficult to be sure that predictions are wrong because of human errors in dating, translations, and those who have “muddied the waters” through the centuries for their own reasons. Perhaps when we speak of the Messiah, the Mahdi, and the avatara of Lord Vishnu we are speaking of the same person. Those who study predictions of great worldly changes say we are in prophetic times now. So it is possible that the holy person/personages predicted walks/walk among us now. If he was here now would we recognize him? Would we accept him, as he may not look, nor say what we expect. Let us hope that we have the eyes to see and ears to hear the truth.

Like yourself, it is my great hope that the predictions for the coming of a great enlightened soul come true, if they have not already.

 

[Aupmanyav]

We have Donald Trump and Caliph Ibrahim walking around at the moment.

 

[Daniel108]

We have Donald Trump and Caliph Ibrahim walking around at the moment.

IMO, if evolution is true, and a remnant of humankind progresses (and is about to progress), then our best course would be to make ourselves the best people we can be (internal purification), no matter those who may be on a backwards course; I believe we should help them amend their lives for the better, using ourselves as examples of peace and love as best we may. If evolution is occurring, then the Earth holds special meaning to the advancement of life (Nature), and we should always remain immovable from her.

Namaste,
Your brother Daniel

 

[Aupmanyav]

Thanks. Nice sentiments, Brother Daniel. Wish the world was not as unjust as it really is.

 

[Daniel108]

Thanks. Nice sentiments, Brother Daniel. Wish the world was not as unjust as it really is.

Life has its mysteries. Perhaps I am here to give you hope, and so you can keep a smile in your heart. With that thought in mind, here are the lyrics to Charlie Chaplin's song, SMILE:

Smile, though your heart is aching
Smile, even though it’s breaking
When there are clouds in the sky
you’ll get by
If you smile through your fear and sorrow
Smile and maybe tomorrow
You’ll see the sun come shining through
for you

Light up your face with gladness
Hide every trace of sadness Although a tear may be ever so near
That’s the time you must keep on trying
Smile what’s the use of crying
You’ll find that life is still worthwhile
If you’ll just
Smile

 

[Aupmanyav]

Oh, I smile all the time. Advaitist Hindu. World is but an illusion.

 

[Daniel108]

Oh, I smile all the time. Advaitist Hindu. World is but an illusion.

I'll pass it on!

 

[shivsomashekhar]

Thanks. Nice sentiments, Brother Daniel. Wish the world was not as unjust as it really is.

The problem may be with our definition of "just".

 

[Aupmanyav]

If it is an illusion, like a dream, it will naturally show us many scenarios. Just or unjust is for people who take it to be real.

 

[Vinayaka]

Ramakrishna made the quote; "I want to taste the sugar, not be the sugar"

So why is Moksha the goal? Why not taste sugar as a being on the higher planes?

The desire for moksha, IMHO, is a natural outcome of the soul's maturity. It intuits, through the superconscious mind, that 'I'm ready' or 'there is nothing else to do here. Therefore I sense my sojourn as an individual soul on this planet is over, time to move on.' It's because there are very few remaining karmas, or worldly desires left. So the desire for moksha ends with self-realisation. Then you've lost something. You've lost that desire too.

 

[Aupmanyav]

With realization one understands that it is Brahman all around and there is no need for any further 'moksha' or 'liberation' - Advaita.