What's wrong with Sharia Law?

[TashaN]

What are the most issue people have with Sharia Law, and what are some of the challenges those who are willing to apply it in their lives might face?

Any thoughts?

 

[.lava]

What are the most issue people have with Sharia Law, and what are some of the challenges those who are willing to apply it in their lives might face?

Any thoughts?

most of it based on hadiths, not Qur'an. there are thousands of fake hadiths. Qur'an never say anything like "throw them rocks till they die and force everyone to watch it and punish anyone who does not and refuses to throw rock." that is not Islam.


.

 

[Nehustan]

What are the most issue people have with Sharia Law, and what are some of the challenges those who are willing to apply it in their lives might face?

Any thoughts?

I'd say that one of the most primary in the minds of people is the one brought up in particular by the Archbishop, the case pertaining to women.

This would include issues like the divorce the archbishop directly spoke of, but also female mutilation in some communities, domestic violence, and forced marriages. There can be no doubt that issues of shame impact on how individuals and thus community leaders deal with these problems i.e. not calling in the Police. Even when some of them can take place outside the UK; they often still happen to British citizens. I attended a seminar given by a member of the FCO, whose job it is to go and snatch back girls being married off against their will. If a Shariah official was legally duty bound to call in the authorities, being guilty of conspiracy to the act if he did not, then I think statutory law would become more available rather than less.

 

[TashaN]

Do we have a living example of how Shariah is implemented in any country in the world today?

I think we can start from there to see how applicable it is today.

 

[Nehustan]

Do we have a living example of how Shariah is implemented in any country in the world today?

I think we can start from there to see how applicable it is today.

We have people that strengthen their cultural tradition by use of the word 'Shariah', so I guess we have shades of Shariah. I think the Archbishop's point about 'the spirit of the law' is of primary importance, i.e. what does the law hope to achieve?

 

[TashaN]

Which means, to have a special version of Shariah "Partial law" based on the needs of the Muslims in the UK?

 

[TashaN]

most of it based on hadiths, not Qur'an. there are thousands of fake hadiths. Qur'an never say anything like "throw them rocks till they die and force everyone to watch it and punish anyone who does not and refuses to throw rock." that is not Islam.


.

I hope this would answer your question regarding this issue.

http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/general-discussion/34228-death-stoning.html

 

[Laila]

Thank you for the invitation to respond to your thread. However, I feel that I had made my feelings clear about the sharia that is practiced in some parts of the muslim World today I agree with Lava; it hardly conforms to Quranic principles.

Nehustan also brought up some interesting points. However, I would have to question the ease of accesibility of getting to a sharia official, more effectively/efficiently than the local police, when the citizen is under such circumstances as described. It happened to a friend of mine; so callled religious people in the community (UK) failed to protect her. Luckily she was able to make contact with the law. The law was more accesible to her than any support from the Imams. We don't really need separate laws (or a sharia court in the UK) we just need more righteous muslims who will stand against oppression.

 

[Nehustan]

Which means, to have a special version of Shariah "Partial law" based on the needs of the Muslims in the UK?

Well I don't think the Archbishop was suggesting any laws that conflicted with statutory law. The word he used was 'supplementary', as has been pointed out Muslims are subject to English law, and rights enshrined by law, as much as any other citizen or guest. I seem to recall there is an edict instructing Muslims to respect the law of the lands wherein they find themselves, so long as they are not being oppressed by that law???

 

[TashaN]

Thank you for the invitation to respond to your thread. However, I feel that I had made my feelings clear about the sharia that is practiced in some parts of the muslim World today I agree with Lava; it hardly conforms to Quranic principles.

You are most welcome.

So, can i assume that, as a principle, you don't have a problem with Shriah law, but you dislike it for how it's being practiced today in some muslim countries?

Nehustan also brought up some interesting points. However, I would have to question the ease of accesibility of getting to a sharia official, more effectively/efficiently than the local police, when the citizen is under such circumstances as described. It happened to a friend of mine; so callled religious people in the community (UK) failed to protect her. Luckily she was able to make contact with the law. The law was more accesible to her than any support from the Imans. We don't really need separate laws (or a sharia court in the UK) we just need more righteous muslims who will stand against oppression.

I think the need of shriah law stem more from people being frustrated of how the courts in UK deal with their families issues and these kinds of relationships. Don't you think it would be good if muslims could find a muslim judge who has an understanding of the root of the problem, than one who might give a vague judgement for not being able to understand the root of the problem or the comlexity involve in such cases. That is just one example though.

 

[TashaN]

Well I don't think the Archbishop was suggesting any laws that conflicted with statutory law. The word he used was 'supplementary', as has been pointed out Muslims are subject to English law, and rights enshrined by law, as much as any other citizen or guest. I seem to recall there is an edict instructing Muslims to respect the law of the lands wherein they find themselves, so long as they are not being oppressed by that law???

If they allowed the muslims to have their own courts, do you think Muslims would "choose" either to go to the the normal courts, or the islamic courts or it's a must for all muslims?

 

[Nehustan]

If they allowed the muslims to have their own courts, do you think Muslims would "choose" either to go to the the normal courts, or the islamic courts or it's a must for all muslims?

I'd imagine it would be an opt in scheme, always with recourse to British law if desired. I can envisage a time when the initial situation is dealt with using sharia, say in a tight knit community, and if the problem persists, and/or the sanction of the law of the land, i.e. resulting in prison, is required, then the officials of a Shariah court would be bound to contact the relevant state authorities. In fact I'd imagine they would be legally required to in regard to crimes such as assault, kidnap, rape, etcetera. I also imagine an account of daily proceedings and transcripts would also be required to be submitted to the state as with normal courts, so as to allow for transparency.

 

[Laila]

You are most welcome.

So, can i assume that, as a principle, you don't have a problem with Shriah law, but you dislike it for how it's being practiced today in some muslim countries?

The shariah is man made. So yes, the rules & laws practiced (in the guise of a god-given shariah) in some muslim countries is way off the mark from Quranic principles

I think the need of shriah law stem more from people being frustrated of how the courts in UK deal with their families issues and these kinds of relationships. Don't you think it would be good if muslims could find a muslim judge who has an understanding of the root of the problem, than one who might give a vague judgement for not being able to understand the root of the problem or the comlexity involve in such cases. That is just one example though.

No we don't need a UK shariah court all British citizens muslim & non-muslims should follow the law of the land. Give me an example of how using the British law system prevents a muslim from practicing their faith. Having a dual system will create apartheid in the UK. If muslims are frustated with how the UK courts deal with them and feel that they cannot practice their faith they have the option to leave the UK.

 

[TashaN]

The shariah is man made. So yes, the rules & laws practiced (in the guise of a god-given shariah) in some muslim countries is way off the mark from Quranic principles

Shariah stem from what prophet Mohammed was applying in his life time, and how he set up the law to be followed. It's based on the Quran, hadith, thoughts of scholars, ijtihad, etc.

No we don't need a UK shariah court all British citizens muslim & non-muslims should follow the law of the land. Give me an example of how using the British law system prevents a muslim from practicing their faith. Having a dual system will create apartheid in the UK. If muslims are frustated with how the UK courts deal with them and feel that they cannot practice their faith they have the option to leave the UK.

Assuming all Muslims in UK are immigrants? :no:

 

[TashaN]

I'd imagine it would be an opt in scheme, always with recourse to British law if desired. I can envisage a time when the initial situation is dealt with using sharia, say in a tight knit community, and if the problem persists, and/or the sanction of the law of the land, i.e. resulting in prison, is required, then the officials of a Shariah court would be bound to contact the relevant state authorities. In fact I'd imagine they would be legally required to in regard to crimes such as assault, kidnap, rape, etcetera. I also imagine an account of daily proceedings and transcripts would also be required to be submitted to the state as with normal courts, so as to allow for transparency.

Don't you think that some Muslims would love rather to be governed by the British law than a Muslim one?

Do you think it would be fair to judge something in the shariah court upon someone while having another person being judged differently in the other normal British court? why would the UK ever pay an attention to this suggestion while they are still struggling with how Muslims from the middle east especially are able to fit into the society.

Is there any similar experience, like a Jewish one as in "Jewish court" in the UK?

 

[.lava]

I hope this would answer your question regarding this issue.

http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/general-discussion/34228-death-stoning.html

thank you for your respond but i do not have questions, not yet
in my opinion, the real problem of shariah is being called Islamic law. when we say Islamic, i think we should be able to find related verses in Qur'an. if not, i am not willing to call it Islamic. Islam is written in Qur'an, not in other places.


.

 

[Nehustan]

Don't you think that some Muslims would love rather to be governed by the British law than a Muslim one??

Nobody is suggesting taking that away.

Do you think it would be fair to judge something in the shariah court upon someone while having another person being judged differently in the other normal British court? why would the UK ever pay an attention to this suggestion while they are still struggling with how Muslims from the middle east especially are able to fit into the society.?

There shouldn't be any difference, except perhaps in cultural sensitivity. The law isn't proposed to be a replacement, but a supplement. The UK seems to be paying attention given the response by two senior political figures, i.e. the Archbishop and Lord Chief Justice.

Is there any similar experience, like a Jewish one as in "Jewish court" in the UK?

Yes there is.

 

[TashaN]

Nobody is suggesting taking that away.



There shouldn't be any difference, except perhaps in cultural sensitivity. The law isn't proposed to be a replacement, but a supplement. The UK seems to be paying attention given the response by two senior political figures, i.e. the Archbishop and Lord Chief Justice.


Yes there is.

Then why they are up to arms when there is already a Jewish experience?

 

[Laila]

Assuming all Muslims in UK are immigrants? :no:

Any muslim immigrant or muslim English man/woman should leave the UK if they feel they can't practice their faith here. I'm waiting for a contradiction between the British law system and Islam that undermines a muslim being able to practice their faith.

As to your kind education on what the shariah is you'll find enlightenment in .lava's posts.

 

[Laila]

Then why they are up to arms when there is already a Jewish experience?

Perhaps the Jewish do not under value their women like many muslims do. Within the muslim World a woman is the property of her father, then her husband and finally her son - no identity and no autonomy. Non of this is line with Quranic principles.

This is most apparent when you compare the Jewish state to many muslim countries. Men and Women work side by side in the former.