Thank you. As if its not enough that one doesn't do enough study before making the claims and criticisms, but the insistence is whats most disturbing.
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What has islam contributed to the world?
- Thread starter TaqiyyaWatch
- Start date
Thank you. As if its not enough that one doesn't do enough study before making the claims and criticisms, but the insistence is whats most disturbing.
croak
Trickster
From a quick web search, it seems different schools are divided on that point. Perform Hajj - A Woman's Guide to Hajj
waitasec
Veteran Member
the question i posited remains...
"Both males and females share these conditions. However, the Muslim woman has an extra condition before she can be held accountable for not performing Hajj and that is the accompaniment of a Mahram...
...However, if she has already performed her first obligatory Hajj and this is a voluntary performance, then she is not permitted to travel alone - she must be accompanied by a husband or a Mahram. In this case, traveling with a group of trusted women is not permitted; this is the more correct position in the Madhhab."
why can't a women go on hajj by herself or with other women?
croak
Trickster
No, the question you posited was answered. You chose one school of thought. Here's an example of another:
Perform Hajj said:
waitasec
Veteran Member
nothing but double standards, don't you think?
the fact that there is more than 1 school of thought is a way to reconcile the inequality between men and women in this religion...
if there was one standard to adhere to then one standard would apply to all...right?
Chisti
Active Member
The problem with men dominating women has nothing to do with religion. It's all about power structure. Look at it this way. Let's say every religion on the planet favors women's rights and freedoms. You think women's rights and freedoms would be protected on this account? Nope, because regardless of what religion says, those who hold power are going to curb the rights of those who don't (with or without religious sanction).
waitasec
Veteran Member
and muhammad happened to be a man, so was jesus and so was abraham...
from what i gather about islam is that it gives too much power to the male counter part by assuming he will abide by the laws of allah...
surprise....it's not working and allah should have known it wouldn't so why then did allah not make the same provisions for women to ensure equality?
religion (the main 3) are subjected to a male bronze age understanding of the world. it's pretty dang obvious...
Chisti
Active Member
Why did that happen?
waitasec
Veteran Member
because of the bronze age understanding of the world...
because men abused their physicality to rule over women by implementing fear of harm
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I'm not sure about your point, but I want to say that the existence of several schools of thought is expected and healthy. In this respect Islam is no different from any other religion, and we all are better for it. Centralized thought tends to be a liability to creeds. It breeds unhealthy conformity and lack of needed renewal and questioning.
Chisti
Active Member
There you go! So the problem is one group having power over another.
Though i personally am not too sure about accepting this notion in the first place, however the reasoning as i understand it goes that this was not as much of a rule on women as it was a measure of protection. As traveling 1400 years ago was not the same as it is today. It was extremely more difficult and dangerous.
Today however, this no longer applies as traveling is fairly simple. Or at least thats how some see it. Others think it still apply but recognize the difference, however they think that traveling today still include many difficulties, and that a woman should have someone with her.
I'm sorry, but that is just a poor evaluation and understanding of something that is actually positive. These different schools do not only apply in cases of men and women rights, but in various parts of the religion. Different understanding, different attempts at understanding that results in a wide range of opinions that does not hurt in the least, quite the contrary. And that still happens, and will happen as long as we're trying to get a better understanding.
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waitasec
Veteran Member
brawn is not power...
knowledge is.
bronze age man were not privy to this fact were they...
waitasec
Veteran Member
how so? if the speed limit is 90 km/hr it applies to everyone right? no matter if they were male or female.
Chisti
Active Member
You do know what power means in this context, power in the sense of authority?
Honestly i still fail to see how is the existence of more than one opinion about a subject is supposed to be a bad thing. It exists in all parts of the religion. Parts that apply to both women and men exactly the same way. Yet there still is different opinions on how men and women are going to do that certain thing in the exact same way.
However if your point is not about the different opinions but on there ever being any difference between the expectations/obligations on women and men, that would be because although women and men are equal, they are still different or unique in some areas. Obviously for example women get pregnant while men do not. To expect the same from them in certain situations when there condition is not similar is injustice.
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waitasec
Veteran Member
how so?
implementing fear of harm is not a sense of authority, it is a sense of insecurity because of the understanding that the implementor is intellectually inferior
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waitasec
Veteran Member
well it only takes common sense to figure that out...
or maybe for those who follow the islamic faith it isn't so common...
this is purely elementary. mutual respect wouldn't leave room for control over anyone else, no matter who.
the quran 2:223 basically says hey if you want some (to the man) come and get it, the very idea of the woman's feelings is not even asked to be considered simply because this is her duty and he has the right to demand it because he simply feels the urge...
"Women are your fields: go, then, into your fields whence you please"
that is giving the men permission to not consider the woman's feelings, because it is common sense that the woman has feelings about it but his actions are now justified because allah said so...