The Witch of Endor

[sandy whitelinger]

There are MANY scriptures as which lilithu has given and many more that tell us wrong from right and associate these sorts of things with evil thus the devil.

Where in scripture does it state that everything evil is from Satan?

 

[may]

True, the witch of Endor claimed to get in touch with the dead prophet Samuel, but did she actually do so? She could not have, for the dead are unconscious, asleep in the grave. (Ps. 146:3, 4; Eccl. 9:5, 10) Then whom did the witch see? She saw a demon impersonating the prophet Samuel. (1 Sam. 28:3-25) A demon?

 

[Green Gaia]

True, the witch of Endor claimed to get in touch with the dead prophet Samuel, but did she actually do so? .....Then whom did the witch see? She saw a demon impersonating the prophet Samuel. (1 Sam. 28:3-25) A demon?

That's not what the Bible says.

 

[may]

That's not what the Bible says.

remember that king saul was being unfaithful to Jehovah by going to a spirit medium in the first place .it was a no no , Jehovah did not aprove of calling on so called dead spirits because he knew that it was a lie , in fact satan the devil has always told lies , and made it appear to be true . right back in the garden of eden he decieved eve by telling her that she would not die and he promotes the false belief that we are alive in the spirit world when we die, this is the false thing and a lie ,the bible is the truth when it tells us that the dead are dead ,and anyone who says or does any thing to go against what the bible tells us is getting the power from satan not from God . thats what i like about the bible it does not hide what goes on but helps us to learn by the mistakes of others . just because others go against Jehovahs ways and even seem to work wonders it is based on a lie, so no wonder Jehovah tells them to not go to a spirit medium its the old devil up to his old tricks again .
The teaching that there is life after death because man has an immortal soul contradicts the plain statements of the Scriptures and poses many dilemmas.

‘Do not turn yourselves to the spirit mediums, and do not consult professional foretellers of events, so as to become unclean by them. I am Jehovah YOUR God ..........leviticus19;31

As for the soul who turns himself to the spirit mediums and the professional foretellers of events so as to have immoral intercourse with them, I shall certainly set my face against that soul and cut him off from among his people ...leviticus 20;6....... i would say unfaithfulness to Jehovah is never a good thing ,seems he will turn his back on those who do that

When you are entered into the land that Jehovah your God is giving you, you must not learn to do according to the detestable things of those nations. There should not be found in you anyone who makes his son or his daughter pass through the fire, anyone who employs divination, a practicer of magic or anyone who looks for omens or a sorcerer, or one who binds others with a spell or anyone who consults a spirit medium or a professional foreteller of events or anyone who inquires of the dead. For everybody doing these things is something detestable to Jehovah, and on account of these detestable things Jehovah your God is driving them away from before you. You should prove yourself faultless with Jehovah your God.....Deutoronomy 18;9-12......... that word detestable is there for a reason it is detestable to the true God . so saul was not being a good person was he :tsk: he went to believing a lie

 

[Green Gaia]

Spin it however you like, May. But the 1 Samuel 28 passage clearly says that the women brought up the spirit of Samuel who was dead.

 

[may]

Spin it however you like, May. But the 1 Samuel 28 passage clearly says that the women brought up the spirit of Samuel who was dead.

true, as we all know satan is an angel of light , thats what the witch of endor did , call up spirits and those who went along with it went to believing the lie, satan uses other people like spirit mediums to promote the lie that we do not die, just because the bible tells us that is what happened , does not make it true . satan has great power to decieve people even now , people who go to spirit mediums are decieved into believing that their dead relatives are talking to them, the demons have been around a long time it is no big deal for them to inpersonate our dead relatives, even mentioning things that only your family would know about , demons are spirits so that is what the witch of endor called up a spirit or demon
the account reads: "When the woman saw ‘Samuel’ she began crying out at the top of her voice," it obviously recounts the event as viewed by the medium, who was deceived by the spirit that impersonated Samuel. (1Sa 28:12)

 

[Draka]

I realize that I'm just joining this, but if it was supposedly a demon that the woman brought forth to speak to Saul...then why would it scold Saul for his actions that were not obedient to God? That would make no sense. And why would you claim the Bible lied about this? How can you pick and choose what it truly means from one verse to another?

 

[may]

I realize that I'm just joining this, but if it was supposedly a demon that the woman brought forth to speak to Saul...then why would it scold Saul for his actions that were not obedient to God? That would make no sense. And why would you claim the Bible lied about this? How can you pick and choose what it truly means from one verse to another?

i am not saying that the bible lied , but the bible is telling it as it was . the witch of endor called up a so called spirit and as i mentioned in last post the demons are out to decieve. what better way could you get to decieve someone that you are truely a dead person than to talk about things that are personal to you , saul knew that he had personally gone away from the true god for quite sometime beforehand , that is why Jehovah was not answering his prayers
When Saul went to the medium, Jehovah’s spirit had for some time been removed from him, and in fact, God would not answer his inquiries by means of dreams or by the Urim (used by the high priest) or by the prophets. (1Sa 28:6) God would have no more to do with him; and God’s prophet Samuel had not seen Saul for a long period of time, from before David’s being anointed to be king. So it would be unreasonable to think that Samuel, even if still alive, would now come to give Saul advice. And God would certainly not cause Samuel, whom he had not sent to Saul before his death, to come back from the dead to talk to Saul.—1Sa 15:35.

 

[Draka]

i am not saying that the bible lied , but the bible is telling it as it was . the witch of endor called up a so called spirit and as i mentioned in last post the demons are out to decieve. what better way could you get to decieve someone that you are truely a dead person than to talk about things that are personal to you , saul knew that he had personally gone away from the true god for quite sometime beforehand , that is why Jehovah was not answering his prayers
When Saul went to the medium, Jehovah’s spirit had for some time been removed from him, and in fact, God would not answer his inquiries by means of dreams or by the Urim (used by the high priest) or by the prophets. (1Sa 28:6) God would have no more to do with him; and God’s prophet Samuel had not seen Saul for a long period of time, from before David’s being anointed to be king. So it would be unreasonable to think that Samuel, even if still alive, would now come to give Saul advice. And God would certainly not cause Samuel, whom he had not sent to Saul before his death, to come back from the dead to talk to Saul.—1Sa 15:35.

But it doesn't say that God caused Samuel to rise...it says the woman did. And that still does not explain the scolding. Even if Samuel had not seen Saul in a long time it does not mean that he did not know what was going on. Also, how would the woman know it was Saul if she had not been told by Samuel? Which would explain the gasp...fear of Saul and being tricked by him and the possible repercussions that might befall her. Also, the message to Saul had been the truth...not deception. Saul did indeed die as Samuel had predicted. Wouldn't a demon spread untruths? By this we would have to admit that demons do, infact, tell the truth. And this makes everything very confusing does it not? If demons are the ones being raised and making predictions and giving warning and they are true...then what is the purpose of that? Why would a demon WARN or SCOLD anyone? You'd think they would encourage wrongdoing or try to be misleading, as you say they are. But that's not what happened here is it?

 

[may]

But it doesn't say that God caused Samuel to rise...it says the woman did. And that still does not explain the scolding. Even if Samuel had not seen Saul in a long time it does not mean that he did not know what was going on. Also, how would the woman know it was Saul if she had not been told by Samuel? Which would explain the gasp...fear of Saul and being tricked by him and the possible repercussions that might befall her. Also, the message to Saul had been the truth...not deception. Saul did indeed die as Samuel had predicted. Wouldn't a demon spread untruths? By this we would have to admit that demons do, infact, tell the truth. And this makes everything very confusing does it not? If demons are the ones being raised and making predictions and giving warning and they are true...then what is the purpose of that? Why would a demon WARN or SCOLD anyone? You'd think they would encourage wrongdoing or try to be misleading, as you say they are. But that's not what happened here is it?

yes the woman did allow satan to use her to promote an untruth about so called dead people. and of coarse the demons know lots of things going on in the world thats why they use spirit mediums to get there thoughts across ,even if things are true that they say does not mean they are that dead person .it is the lie that they are promoting that is the deception . and that lie is that people have an immortal soul and live on after death .satan is an angel of light he does not always do things that seem to be bad , he decieves people with things that sometimes look good thats why eve in the garden of eden was decieved because satan made it appear good to break the rules , but all it did was serve the means of satan .and satan has many followers who are the demons
Saul died for his unfaithfulness with which he had acted faithlessly against Jehovah concerning the word of Jehovah that he had not kept and also for asking of a spirit medium to make inquiry

 

[Green Gaia]

true, as we all know satan is an angel of light , thats what the witch of endor did , call up spirits and those who went along with it went to believing the lie, satan uses other people like spirit mediums to promote the lie that we do not die

None of that was stated in that 1 Samuel 28 passage, you just added it.

just because the bible tells us that is what happened , does not make it true

So we can't trust that everything in the Bible actually happened the way it says history happened? Thank you.

 

[Green Gaia]

i am not saying that the bible lied , but the bible is telling it as it was

But you just said, "just because the bible tells us that is what happened , does not make it true". So which is it? Did the woman bring back Samuel or not? And if not then why does the Bible say she did?

 

[sandy whitelinger]

That's not what the Bible says.

I always find it interesting that people have so much trouble just taking the Bible for what it says without trying to bend it's meaning or adding something to it that makes scripture make sense to them or fit their agenda. I'm reminded that every time Jesus interpreted the Old Testament He took it literally.

 

[may]

But you just said, "just because the bible tells us that is what happened , does not make it true". So which is it? Did the woman bring back Samuel or not? And if not then why does the Bible say she did?

sorry i think maybe i worded that in the wrong way , what i meant was, the bible says she brought up samuel because that was her line of work and she thought it was samual because satan decieves people , but the bible tells us that when we die we are dead so that is what the bible tells us about the dead so it must be a lie because the bible is correct not spirit mediums so who do we believe what God telss us or what a spirit medium tells us

 

[Draka]

yes the woman did allow satan to use her to promote an untruth about so called dead people. and of coarse the demons know lots of things going on in the world thats why they use spirit mediums to get there thoughts across ,even if things are true that they say does not mean they are that dead person .it is the lie that they are promoting that is the deception . and that lie is that people have an immortal soul and live on after death .satan is an angel of light he does not always do things that seem to be bad , he decieves people with things that sometimes look good thats why eve in the garden of eden was decieved because satan made it appear good to break the rules , but all it did was serve the means of satan .and satan has many followers who are the demons
Saul died for his unfaithfulness with which he had acted faithlessly against Jehovah concerning the word of Jehovah that he had not kept and also for asking of a spirit medium to make inquiry

The fact of the matter is that this chapter of Samuel makes NO mention of the devil, now does it? And if it were intregal to the story then why would it not be mentioned? Why no word of deception? It even protrays the woman to be kind and hospitable. She and her handmaidens (a sign which promotes that the woman was well-to-do) fed and took care and sheltered Saul for that night before he journeyed home the next day. Ahhh...yes...this is the sign of an evil person. This is why I am such a good hostess in my home as well then...must be I am luring people to the devil and promoting his evilness:jam: :biglaugh:

 

[may]

The fact of the matter is that this chapter of Samuel makes NO mention of the devil, now does it? And if it were intregal to the story then why would it not be mentioned? Why no word of deception? It even protrays the woman to be kind and hospitable. She and her handmaidens (a sign which promotes that the woman was well-to-do) fed and took care and sheltered Saul for that night before he journeyed home the next day. Ahhh...yes...this is the sign of an evil person. This is why I am such a good hostess in my home as well then...must be I am luring people to the devil and promoting his evilness:jam: :biglaugh:

who said that spirit mediums would not be hospitable, she could have no dought thought she was doing good for others . its satan himself who is the wicked one by decieving others. satan is the wicked one who uses others to serve his purpose of telling lies, i am quite sure you are a nice person but it is up to the individual who they are used by it all boils down to free will .

 

[may]

I always find it interesting that people have so much trouble just taking the Bible for what it says without trying to bend it's meaning or adding something to it that makes scripture make sense to them or fit their agenda. I'm reminded that every time Jesus interpreted the Old Testament He took it literally.

i agree with this also, the bible tells us that when we die we go to dust and we are not aware of any thing. but the spin on things is the ( immortality of the human soul ) the bible does not teach this, so this is where people become confused because of the teachings of the lier satan the devil,so many people are decieved by this teaching that it is global and in most if not all of the religions of the world........

 

[Draka]

Again, as I have said before...

The fact of the matter is that this chapter of Samuel makes NO mention of the devil, now does it? And if it were intregal to the story then why would it not be mentioned? Why no word of deception?

this point has never been answered by anyone. Nor does it even elude to works of satan.

 

[may]

Again, as I have said before...


this point has never been answered by anyone. Nor does it even elude to works of satan.

it doesnt need to be answered ,God had already told us what happens to the dead , the believe in the immortality of the human soul was a belief praticed by those not into Gods ways and it was based on a lie thats why God said not to have anything to do with it ,because it was lies and deception out to decieve people

 

[Fascist Christ]

For those who believe in a literal reading of the Bible, does this story prove that it is possible for a human to conjure up the spirits of the dead?

I do not take the bible literally, but I do like to ask why it says such things. And so I noticed this:

"What does he look like?" he asked.
"An old man wearing a robe is coming up," she said.
Then Saul knew it was Samuel...

Right. As if that could not be a description of anybody else? The woman was a deceiver, not unlike today. Whoever retold the story probably believed that such a thing was possible.