The Me Generation

[Aštra’el]

People get what pronouns I assign to them. If you look like a dude you are a “he”. If you look like a chick you are a “she”. How you identify is irrelevant. If it’s the internet I’ll probably just use your screenname.

I might make exceptions, for those who give me reason to. Good luck with that.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

No, I'll use "they/them". But I'm also not going to be continously snapped at people. No one "refuses" my pronouns because no one knows I'm trans irl unless I tell them, and the ones I tell obviously dgaf if I'm trans. I'm not in the same boat as them.

I agree that people need to be patient and reasonable when they correct people on their pronouns. If someone's not trying to misgender, just making an honest mistake, there's no reason to bite someone's head off.

But if people are just being belligerent (like the OP would from the sounds of it) then screw 'em.

 

[JustGeorge]

Part of the problem is that many or most of the non-binary people don't transition beyond wanting to be called certain pronouns, and don't do anything to change their appearance. So you'll have pepple who obviously read as a man or a woman but want to be called a neopronoun. I've had some of them get attitudes with me and others, like one who got mad at a server at a restaurant for calling them a "she" when that's what they looked like, as if the server was supposed to automatically know. I felt bad for the server and honestly should've said something on her behalf. It's not my fault you just look like a female, and that's what the mind defaults to in a split second. Take it up with science or, you know, actually do something to look non-binary. Androgyny is something I can respect.

Personally, I'm not going to bother speaking to such people who are being that pushy and unreasonable.

Sometimes my husband gets misgendered from people behind him. He's thin and has super long full blonde hair. He thinks its funny. He just turns and smiles. (He has a long goatee, so its obvious he's not a female.) No big deal.

If I'd wanted a thoughtful and nuanced answer I'd have asked for it.
You surname is raisol?

Saylor.

Lately, I've felt obligated to learn some sea shanties due to it...

 

[ADigitalArtist]

That's true, there is a spectrum. But I also believe that society has been using these labels to 'excuse' these behaviors rather than trying to help overcome them. If someone leans more on the high-functioning side of autism and they are constantly told "it's okay because you're autistic" that is counterproductive, they're not learning anything. And I think there is a distinguishable difference between high-functioning and low-functioning autism and that's simply by looking at the level of comprehension this autistic person has. I'd say there are a lot of autistic people, capable of at least moderate comprehension and rationality, that are not being tutored or guided to try to control their behavior.

I wouldn't consider learning to control your emotional outbursts to be masking, I'd call it a skill you're strengthening yourself in the more you do it.

The reason high and low functioning autism isn't a term used much anymore is that we're learning that there's *so* much variety within that spectrum that there's no consistency on what makes high or low functioning. One person may be really good at self soothing but cannot desensitize to specific sensory input. Or they don't even appear to have social symptoms but their ASD causes regular seizures.

For me, I got *so* good at masking that I never, even in private, actually felt like myself because I was deliberately. and with great effort, suppressing non-harmful behavior like stimming and self-soothing. To such a degree I felt noticeably more tired and lethargic doing something I shouldn't need to do.

While I agree emotional outbursts where you're liable to harm yourself or others should be curbed as a matter of health and safety, I see more society expecting autistic people to 'act normal' in a tone that's like telling depressed people to just stop being sad, but worse because things like stimming or emotional outbursts are not necessarily harmful. It just make people who aren't used to it uncomfortable. So in that way letting them see 'how the sausage gets made' so to speak, is helpful to society at large I think.

 

[amorphous_constellation]

There's a lot more to autism than learning social queues. In many cases it comes with neurotransmitter differences or completely differently formed amygdala which often means emotional regulation issues and sensory overload. And while there are treatment options you can't learn your way or willpower your way out of a differently configured brain. And trying to conceal autistic symptoms (known as masking) is extremely tiring if you can even do it at all. So expecting some patience and acceptance of non-neurotypical behavior is a must. And total independence or not needing disability care is sometimes just not possible.

There's a spectrum. Sometimes autistic people can blend with neurotypicals more or less seamlessly but sometimes that isn't the case.

Well you know, all people of all types have different outcomes, some good and some bad. My younger brother, who is 10 years younger, also apparently has autism, though there is marked difference in his manifestation of symptoms, to mine. For example, his motor coordination is such that he doesn't do many things with dynamic variability - he shuts doors/walks hard, for example, whereas I am gentle. His voice is markedly monotone in character, whereas I talk with a dynamic capacity. But he is also way more social than I am

And he is also more prone to aggressive behavior, unfortunately, and that could possibly be from the influence of his friends, and of his choice to go drinking. For example, he once kicked some furniture so hard that he broke his foot, and had to wear a cast for many months.

But besides that, there are some examples, I think, of people probably strengthening the internal world they have, probably to the point where they supersede the ability of neurotypicals. I take for example, the youtuber vaush. He said that they wanted to send him to a special school for autism, but that didn't happen. He talks well of his parents though, and says he was raised in hollywood, surely without a lot of privation. He is loquacious in a way that anyone could envy, having developed an idiosyncratically powerful personality

That's not to say that I agree with many of his conclusions, as I don't, but I recognize the sheer force of his personality, and obvious success.

 

[Gargovic Malkav]

But then my only two relationships in my life so far have been with transgender people. The first one I made her believe she was mentally ill and she discarded her male identity (which is why I refer to her now as a "her"). I regret that. I was in the wrong.

Do you know how she's doing now?
Such people are a curiosity to me because I've always wondered what life would be like for them when they deal with their gender dysphoria that way; when they willingly try to get rid of it or cope with it without the whole sex change process.

That path is often demonized as it is considered oppressive and unnatural, but I find it hard to believe all (former)trans people are the same in that regard.

 

[SkepticThinker]

People get what pronouns I assign to them. If you look like a dude you are a “he”. If you look like a chick you are a “she”. How you identify is irrelevant. If it’s the internet I’ll probably just use your screenname.

I might make exceptions, for those who give me reason to. Good luck with that.

What if someone "looks like a dude" to you, but is actually a chick? Who cares, it's all about you and your perceptions and feelings about it?

 

[Reyn]

*disappears and ceases to exist* *my native american two spirit ancestors cease to exist cuz even tho they aren't always considered these days to be nonbinary they are a third gender* *Loki disappears from mythology as a genderfluid god* *my anscestors that were called insultingly ergi cease to exist* *5 of the genders in classical judaism cease to exist* *lot of african genders just vanished* *ancient European third and fourth genders vanished from history* *intersex folk disappeared into the void*

Look you can say you don't agree with folk identifying as nonbinary but we do exist.

Loki is also a deity, not a human. He switches between sexes, literally. Humans can’t do this.

 

[VoidCat]

Loki is also a deity, not a human. He switches between sexes, literally. Humans can’t do this.

Still doesn't refute my point. There is historical record going back hundreds of years up till now of people idenifying as something other then man or woman.

 

[Reyn]

Still doesn't refute my point. There is historical record going back hundreds of years up till now of people idenifying as something other then man or woman.

Sure but that doesn’t mean they lopped off our inverted their Johnson over it. Likewise, it doesn’t mean little girls mutilated their arms or legs to make a fake Johnson. All “non binary” means to me is that someone doesn’t fit into classical sex roles. Since those mean nothing to me, gender identity likewise means nothing, and therefore non binary is a non thing. You’re a boy who likes dolls? A girl who likes to playing pirate? Have fun. Neither thing makes you a boy or girl, your genitalia does.

 

[an anarchist]

Do you know how she's doing now?
Such people are a curiosity to me because I've always wondered what life would be like for them when they deal with their gender dysphoria that way; when they willingly try to get rid of it or cope with it without the whole sex change process.

That path is often demonized as it is considered oppressive and unnatural, but I find it hard to believe all (former)trans people are the same in that regard.

She seems not to have it on her mind anymore. But I dont know for sure.

 

[muichimotsu]

Sure but that doesn’t mean they lopped off our inverted their Johnson over it. Likewise, it doesn’t mean little girls mutilated their arms or legs to make a fake Johnson. All “non binary” means to me is that someone doesn’t fit into classical sex roles. Since those mean nothing to me, gender identity likewise means nothing, and therefore non binary is a non thing. You’re a boy who likes dolls? A girl who likes to playing pirate? Have fun. Neither thing makes you a boy or girl, your genitalia does.

So you don't acknowledge sex roles or gender norms at all in society? You don't associate someone as being manly or womanly based on their body type, by superficial associations?

 

[Reyn]

So you don't acknowledge sex roles or gender norms at all in society? You don't associate someone as being manly or womanly based on their body type, by superficial associations?

No. Why would I? Women can be muscular. Men can be thin. Women can enjoy football. Men can like ballet.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

your genitalia does.

That can be very cruel and uncalled for, and not where you're thinking.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

"it's okay because you're autistic"

I've always been told to quit doing things like stiming. It wasn't until I was older and connected with other autistic people that anyone has told me it's ok.
The expectations to hide and mask, it's not really good either. I fidget a lot, something I've been told since a child to not do. What this has me doing in certain situations instead of going for something harmless to harmless expend that energy I do at times pick my palm until it's sore in blistered, entirely in front of people but hidden so well that no one to my best knows has ever noticed when I'm doing it.

 

[The Sum of Awe]

I've always been told to quit doing things like stiming. It wasn't until I was older and connected with other autistic people that anyone has told me it's ok.
The expectations to hide and mask, it's not really good either. I fidget a lot, something I've been told since a child to not do. What this has me doing in certain situations instead of going for something harmless to harmless expend that energy I do at times pick my palm until it's sore in blistered, entirely in front of people but hidden so well that no one to my best knows has ever noticed when I'm doing it.

I was more so talking about controlling one's emotions and learning more proper social behaviors (eye contact when talking for example, or watching body language, etc). People that tell other people to stop doing things that aren't causing any harm are just being jerks for no reason imo.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

As a trans man, I will never introduce myself with my pronouns. I find it extremely offensive, as if I physically transitioned for nothing. And I refuse to learn new sets of pronouns. I draw the line at "they/them".

Yeah, I'm not a fan of the gendered introductions either. My name isn't ambiguous or used for both, I wouldn't be out as a guy telling people I'm a girl, and I just don't see the point.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I was more so talking about controlling one's emotions and learning more proper social behaviors (eye contact when talking for example, or watching body language, etc). People that tell other people to stop doing things that aren't causing any harm are just being jerks for no reason imo.

Or people can just get over themselves and accept some people do things differently. Like body language. For some of us it takes conscious effort and thought, and we aren't always sure what it is our body language is saying anyways. Oh well.

 

[The Sum of Awe]

Or people can just get over themselves and accept some people do things differently. Like body language. For some of us it takes conscious effort and thought, and we aren't always sure what it is our body language is saying anyways. Oh well.

Absolutely. I always keep my judgments of others to myself and I always try to understand another person. But that's not to say I wouldn't be off-put if someone couldn't control their emotions or wasn't receiving my nonverbal language that they are bothering me in some form or another so I'd say these are important skills for people to learn instead of trying to excuse it. (even "neurotypical" people struggle with these things so I'm not only talking about autistic people, the only reason I'm bringing up autism is because autistic people struggle with these things the most).

In my experience, trying to explain my quirks has been less successful in earning acceptance/respect than trying to change my behavior. And I'm a big believer in "fake it until you make it" so I don't see it as masking, more like self-betterment.

 

[JustGeorge]

Or people can just get over themselves and accept some people do things differently. Like body language. For some of us it takes conscious effort and thought, and we aren't always sure what it is our body language is saying anyways. Oh well.

I can read other's body language pretty well, but abhor using it. It doesn't feel natural, and it feels like I'm being a cartoon character when I have to use it. I don't really make myself much anymore. Its just too yucky(yes, that's the technical term).