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That bad girl, Lilith
- Thread starter Maureen
- Start date
Splarnst
Active Member
OK, their boat will be floated, but that doesn't mean that Mary is a counter-example to Biblical misogyny. I don't understand why we're discussing belief here.
Shades-o-Blue
Member
Sounds like Lilith was far too busy destroying men to be encumbered with their patriarchal tyranny.Bad Lilith. Refused to stay two steps behind her man. Refused to be on the bottom. Wanted to be equal to Adam. Or so I heard.
The bible doesn't say much about her. It must have been deleted during the transcribe process by the men who thought woman should know her place. Barefoot, pregnant and in the kitchen. Which is one of the many reasons why I take the Bible with a grain of salt.
Has anyone ever played the game where there is a line of people and the first person says The Sky Is Blue but by the time it gets to the end of the line, the words are not The Sky Is Blue but instead is John Boinked Jill At The Top Of The Hill or some such wacko sentence.
The bible has been transcribed by too many men (I stress the word men), who had others in higher power that had agendas, so they took some passages out to suit their own during those particular times and did as they were told. Some passages never made it into what is now known as The Word Of God. And some complete gospels have been left out as well. After all, it would not suit to have the Gospels of Mary. She did not belong in the parlor with the men while they had their brandy, nor was she to bother her pretty little head over men talk. She was regulated to the other parlor, with her crochet or knitting needles with the other women folk.
So, back to Lilith. Eve was not first woman. Lilith was. And the bible is very silent about her, isn't it? I guess she wanted to be in the parlor with the brandy and "men talk".
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She would have been equal to adam since being created the same way as Adam instead of from Adams rib like Eve. I've always thought the rib thing was odd but it was all a conspiracy to keep women under men. After all Adam wanted a helper not an equal making all the others unworthy.
fallingblood
Agnostic Theist
There was no conspiracy. The story of creation did not change male female relations. They were already that same way long before Genesis was written.
If men wanted to keep power why wouldn't they conspire to put words in the mouth of god. That or bible God is a misogynist. God must have already created women same as the rest of the animals of both genders. Seems Eve got the shaft...
JacobEzra.
Dr. Greenthumb
There is plenty of holy women. Mary, Eve, Judith, Esther, Ruth, Sarah, Rachel, Leah,Rebecca, etc
JacobEzra.
Dr. Greenthumb
She was never dismissed. And she brought the Word incarnate to life.
You want a warrior rolemodel, look at Judith.
JacobEzra.
Dr. Greenthumb
Oh Righhhttt, there was more women in the bible then just man pleasing Eve and "baby factory" Blessed Virgin! 
fallingblood
Agnostic Theist
Did they need to? No. They were trying to get power, they weren't trying to get more power. They were even trying to keep power. There was no fear in loosing the power they had. So why would then conspire to do something that wasn't needed in any way?
More so, Eve only gets the shaft if one wants to see it that way. There are two creation stories. One has them created as equal. If the Bible writers were really conspiring, that would not have been the case. You wouldn't see such an idea in the Bible. More so, one wouldn't see any leadership with women.
Splarnst
Active Member
Well, that's my characterization of Mark 3:31-35. The passage certainly doesn't suggest she was important.
That's the only thing she does. You're proving my point by repeating it, since there's nothing else to mention. At all.
Shermana
Heretic
Don't forget the part about lying with all the beasts and becoming the Evil one's mistress. Definitely a role model for women indeed. Maybe a role model for donkey show workers?
And the Bible does indeed refer to "Lilith" as a "Night Spirit" as in something to be terrified by.
Color me confused. Is this not the general religious debates forum???
Splarnst
Active Member
We're talking about the content of the belief, not whether the belief is held. (At least, I think so) My point was that whether I or anyone else believes it is irrelevant to discussing how the Bible portrays women.
Um. Ok. You're the one asking why we are discussing it here. I answered.
In your opinion, it is irrelevant. To others, maybe not so much irrelevant. See what I mean? Differing opinions. Or are we all supposed to goosestep to what you think we all should be thinking?
JacobEzra.
Dr. Greenthumb
Doesn't surprise me. You take it out of context and do not consider the over all meaning.
How about you also comment on the other women>
JacobEzra.
Dr. Greenthumb
Oh Rightt, actually taking note of the other women I mentioned, especially Judith, destroyed your silly arguments of sexism bs.
Splarnst
Active Member
You quoted and responded to me (post #19) when I didn't ask a question. I'm still not sure why.
It is irrelevant to a discussion about what the text itself says. Belief of the text is outside of the text.
You're free to discuss whatever you want; I'm just telling you what I was saying.
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Splarnst
Active Member
@JacobEzra
My sole point is that Mary doesn't do anything besides have a baby. I didn't say whether the Bible as a whole was sexist. I didn't say anything about any other women. I didn't say the verse in question didn't have a message. You're expecting me to defend the entire thread rather than points I actually made.
You held Mary out as an example of the Bible giving woman a great responsibility in post #16. This whole time I've been saying that her only responsibility was to have a baby. It's a job only a woman could do anyway and the only thing she does, so it's not a good example at all. That's it. That's all I'm saying.
My sole point is that Mary doesn't do anything besides have a baby. I didn't say whether the Bible as a whole was sexist. I didn't say anything about any other women. I didn't say the verse in question didn't have a message. You're expecting me to defend the entire thread rather than points I actually made.
You held Mary out as an example of the Bible giving woman a great responsibility in post #16. This whole time I've been saying that her only responsibility was to have a baby. It's a job only a woman could do anyway and the only thing she does, so it's not a good example at all. That's it. That's all I'm saying.