Sorry for your loss

[Shadow Wolf]

Seeing as how you don't want to see my point let me ask you this,

If that were the case, I would skipped asking and just called you an insensitive prick. I have Asperger's, I don't really feel empathy, and even I experience loss and mourning, pretty much as most people describe it, and understand that people will be hurting to lose someone precious in their life.

Seems we lost to ability to morn the loss of herd/pack members, unless they are close to us and even that is regulated.

A pack member is inherently going to have some sort of emotional relationship with other members of that pack. It may not always be a good and positive thing, but being that they are members of the same pack means they have some sort of emotional connection. The members of other packs, not so much and rarely when it happens. Beyond that, we wouldn't be able to function if you had deep connections like that much further, similar to how we simply would not function if our senses didn't filter out most of the things they take in.

 

[oldbadger]

................How can the death of someone in one's life be considered as a loss, how can we be so presumptous that we think we have some thing coming.........

On the occasions when I have lost a loved one I have been so numbed that any lecture you might have given to me would not have been heard. Just as well?

I was chastized for my insensitivity by people, with most of their needs met, with myoptic vision, oblivious to the pain and suffering just beyond their door, but they feel good about themselves because they said, Sorry for your loss.

You have no clue about how other people feel about themselves.
I don't think that death is a suitable occasion for you to get out your orange box.

..... just sayin'.....

 

[SabahTheLoner]

Now I know what he meant by, Let the dead take care of the dead.

I'm not complaining about sympathy but that its wasted. If the individual didn't get everything out of the relationship and the time they had together then why should one expect sympathy because of their neglect. Kind like me saying, I'm sorry you finished your milkshake so fast.

Get the picture, it ain't about death, its about living.

"When mama ain't happy, ain't nobody happy."

My country folk grandparents gave my mother a sign that said that. I think it's pretty reflective of the truth. One person's sadness rubs off onto another. Empaths and HSPs are especially sensitive to this. If a person didn't get anything out of someone else, of course they'll be less affected, but that's not
why they are saying "sorry".

Also why be sorry you finished a milkshake quickly? Brainfreeze is usually very mild and not traumatic like not being able to talk to a loved one again. It passes with little emotion while someone dying takes some people time to emotionally heal. It's an attachment unlike milkshakes.

 

[Ingledsva]

Weak!

I'm serious. Posts meant to incite.

*

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Only the most highly evolved souls, of which I am not one, can view death dispassionately. I've even known of dogs who have felt the loss of their owner so strongly that they've been depressed. Feeling a loss is more than human.

"sorry for your loss" at its best means "I too have suffered loss and have felt what you are feeling now. From that knowing of your pain, I can see and feel your pain and my words reflect that knowing."

Nope, not just enlightened souls. Some psychopathies would also result in this.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Can you empathize with the people who are starving to death, who at this moment are begging for one more minute/second of life, who would gladly eat your defecation if it would get them more time.

Empathize? Or sympathize?

 

[oldbadger]

Empathize? Or sympathize?

Little Oxford......

Empathy: the ability to share and understand another's feelings.

Sympathy: Sorrow at someone else's misfortune; understanding between people; support or approval.

Not you, but many folks object to the word sympathy when dirrected towards them.
I don't get it.. . For yonks now there has been this 'fashion' that the use of sympathy is in some way obtuse, or wrong.

Using a simple definition like the above, I would feel more sympathy for a person who has lost than empathy. How can I understand their feelings? But I can surely sympathise.

 

[Jumi]

So you bow to tradition.

As much as it's useful.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Little Oxford......

Empathy: the ability to share and understand another's feelings.

Sympathy: Sorrow at someone else's misfortune; understanding between people; support or approval.

Not you, but many folks object to the word sympathy when dirrected towards them.
I don't get it.. . For yonks now there has been this 'fashion' that the use of sympathy is in some way obtuse, or wrong.

Using a simple definition like the above, I would feel more sympathy for a person who has lost than empathy. How can I understand their feelings? But I can surely sympathise.

Exactly.
Empathy generally requires that you've worked a mile in their shoes. At least to a degree.

 

[Enoch07]

Yesterday I responded to a post that generated this response, "Sorry for your loss". (I on the other hand did not interpret the post as a plea for synpathy and responded accordingly)

How can the death of someone in one's life be considered as a loss, how can we be so presumptous that we think we have some thing coming. We are not satisfied with what we have, we get upset because we don't get what is only an assumption, how did we become these people?

I was chastized for my insensitivity by people, with most of their needs met, with myoptic vision, oblivious to the pain and suffering just beyond their door, but they feel good about themselves because they said, Sorry for your loss.

Everyone handles grief in different ways. Some want to be consoled, others want to be left alone, and anything in between. While I do feel saddened by the loss of someone close to me. I do find comfort in Ecclesiastes 7:1 A good name is better than precious ointment, and the day of death than the day of ones birth.

This pasage never made sense to me until the day my daughter was born. Because my first thoughts, for whatever reason, was a mixture of joy and sadness. The sadness came from the realizatiom that today was her first day of "life", and how much pain and suffering she would have to endure over the course of her entire life in the coming years.

Where as even if you don't believe in an afterlife. One thing you can take comfort in when someone dies is that the pain of life is over. They no longer have to endure heartbreak, anger, jealousy, or physical pain. They are free, and I believe that should be rejoiced! At least to some extent.

 

[Tmac]

If that were the case, I would skipped asking and just called you an insensitive prick. I have Asperger's, I don't really feel empathy, and even I experience loss and mourning, pretty much as most people describe it, and understand that people will be hurting to lose someone precious in their life.

A pack member is inherently going to have some sort of emotional relationship with other members of that pack. It may not always be a good and positive thing, but being that they are members of the same pack means they have some sort of emotional connection. The members of other packs, not so much and rarely when it happens. Beyond that, we wouldn't be able to function if you had deep connections like that much further, similar to how we simply would not function if our senses didn't filter out most of the things they take in.

Does the Asperger's comment merit an I'm sorry. (We all have handicaps, whether they are obvious or not.

If you were to say, Sorry, you didn't take advantage of the relationship in the time you had, yea I could go for that but to call it a loss when you didn't get all that you were supposed or could have gotten out of it in the time you had, is just incorrect.. Life is "precious" and all that is in it is precious, nothing is ever loss.

To bad, your pack example is disregarding the "6 degrees of separation" Their are no "other packs" except in the minds of people like you.

 

[Brickjectivity]

Only the most highly evolved souls, of which I am not one, can view death dispassionately. I've even known of dogs who have felt the loss of their owner so strongly that they've been depressed. Feeling a loss is more than human.

"sorry for your loss" at its best means "I too have suffered loss and have felt what you are feeling now. From that knowing of your pain, I can see and feel your pain and my words reflect that knowing."

Well put, sir.

 

[Tmac]

Everyone handles grief in different ways. Some want to be consoled, others want to be left alone, and anything in between. While I do feel saddened by the loss of someone close to me. I do find comfort in Ecclesiastes 7:1 A good name is better than precious ointment, and the day of death than the day of ones birth.

This pasage never made sense to me until the day my daughter was born. Because my first thoughts, for whatever reason, was a mixture of joy and sadness. The sadness came from the realizatiom that today was her first day of "life", and how much pain and suffering she would have to endure over the course of her entire life in the coming years.

Where as even if you don't believe in an afterlife. One thing you can take comfort in when someone dies is that the pain of life is over. They no longer have to endure heartbreak, anger, jealousy, or physical pain. They are free, and I believe that should be rejoiced! At least to some extent.

Now this is empathy.

Ever watch most young children at a funeral, they have no idea what's going on, except that the big people are acting funny/different, they still want to play and have fun only to be chastised for their insensitivity. With enough practice (and they'll get it), they'll learn how to behave when some one "close" to them dies.

Life is what we are experiencing and as far as I can see death is part of it, the spirit may go on but (fact) the matter begins to decay when the animation leaves. Tempus fugit and we are wasting it because we are stuck in antiquated tradition about a part of life that we have come to think of as the end.

 

[Tmac]

As much as it's useful.

I can empathize with your response (I am guilty of this as well) but sometimes peer pressure, the fear of ostracism, is felt and we capitulate. Stay in the herd.

 

[Tmac]

Empathize? Or sympathize?

Really, well lets see, if I sympathize with their plight then I'm basically saying, there but for the grace of God their go I; but if I empathize with them then maybe I'll say whatever happens to the least of me happens to me.

 

[Tmac]

On the occasions when I have lost a loved one I have been so numbed that any lecture you might have given to me would not have been heard. Just as well?


You have no clue about how other people feel about themselves.
I don't think that death is a suitable occasion for you to get out your orange box.

..... just sayin'.....

I think the Buddha felt numb when he first realized that there was more to reality than he was aware and then feelings of empathy overwhelmed him, moving him towards enlightenment, hopefully you can find your way off your ivory tower.

 

[BilliardsBall]

Yesterday I responded to a post that generated this response, "Sorry for your loss". (I on the other hand did not interpret the post as a plea for synpathy and responded accordingly)

How can the death of someone in one's life be considered as a loss, how can we be so presumptous that we think we have some thing coming. We are not satisfied with what we have, we get upset because we don't get what is only an assumption, how did we become these people?

I was chastized for my insensitivity by people, with most of their needs met, with myoptic vision, oblivious to the pain and suffering just beyond their door, but they feel good about themselves because they said, Sorry for your loss.

If a person is in your life, not excluded from your life, and then they leave the country or die, that is not a loss worth noting?

You would be a callous person in relationships if you didn't see it that way, yes. Did I misunderstand your post?

 

[oldbadger]

...................
hopefully you can find your way off your ivory tower.

......ha ha...! Gotcha!
Now, for somebody who wants to lecture others about the way that they communicate to a person who has lost, you've kind of left yourself open to a lecture about the political correctness of ivory towers...... ...... now what do you think that you were doing on that other thread, eh?

Really, I just don't think that you've ever lost badly enough to understand the ways that others (who probably have lost) want to try to communicate to a breaved.
And .... No! Don't tell me about your nearest and dearest...

Let me get this right...... you posted some criticism of other's communications upon a thread connected to a breaved person, right? In my book that's a bit like standing up during a funeral and attempting to show everybody how well you can play a trumpet, or whatever!

Be well. Be happy! Bye-Bye!

 

[Sanzbir]

I was chastized for my insensitivity by people, with most of their needs met, with myoptic vision, oblivious to the pain and suffering just beyond their door, but they feel good about themselves because they said, Sorry for your loss.

Congrats, you see the truth of death. But alas, the rest of mankind react with hostility to these truths, I'm afraid.

People are so desperate to cling to their blind faith in suffering that they will attempt to demonize anyone who suggests otherwise. They project their hatred and fear of death onto those who neither hate nor fear death. We're seen as collaborators I suppose.

Ultimately I can't fault or blame them too much. It's a fear that, while irrational and false, is so ingrained into human biology and culture that they react with hostility to having their belief that death is bad challenged.

 

[Sanzbir]

herd/pack members

This thread needs more brevity. So I will critique this phrasing here.

You mean troop. A group of primates is neither a herd nor a pack. It is a troop.