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Selective Translation

Discussion in 'Biblical Debates' started by Bass04life, Jun 6, 2005.

  1. Bass04life

    Bass04life New Member

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    I have a question concerning the bible. This is basically a question for those who believe in it but I'd like everyones viewpoint. I've noticed a lot of one thing in here from bible supporters and that is: When a question comes up that contradicts something else said in the bible or contradicts what the reader believes to be right, s/he digs up the old translations which nearly always shed a lot of light on the subject and clear things up. A good example of this could be found in Malachi 1: 1-5. I had some trouble with this for a while, why in the world would God love the theif and the coward, rather than the robbed and the forgiver? So I asked the pastor, who instantly told me not to take it literally because the word "hate" had been mistranslated. I thought that was interesting because most bibles ( That I've seen) try and include as many different translations you could take from certain words so that you might understand them, but gave no alternative for the word hate. Here's my issue, why is it that supporters only go to the old translations when they find things like, "God hated... or Fear God... or God destroyed..." and not the "happy" texts like "God loved, God protected, God gives eternal life, etc." ?

    One of the best arguments to support the bible is that it has been perserved so well despite time and numerous attempts to destroy it. So why is it that a supporter will believe the vast majority of the happy, supportive things the bible says but go as far back as necessary to justify the texts that don't make sense to them? Isn't that basically saying that God almost got it right but just missed the cut? Or does it mean we should all learn Hebrew and find the oldest translation possible and read that? (I think it was written in hebrew...don't rage if I'm wrong:) ) If thats true, then isn't the good christian then obligated to go down to all the places where mission trips have been held, take their english bibles that they taught them to read, tell them that their all-knowing, all-powerful God just allowed a few typos and hand them scrolls and teach them that? I think thats ridiculous personally. There's no such thing as a bible that jumps between two languages purely so that the reader can feel comfortable with what he's reading. So judging from the standpoint that God would not allow his word to be corrupted to a point where it is no longer possible to understand the content, I take the bible as is. That doesn't necessarily mean I take everything it says literally, on the contrary, you wouldn't get far doing that. However, I do think that the bible God gave everyone, not just the educated people who can dig up scrolls and find different answers to compensate their viewpoints, is a complete book that has the original content God wanted in it, whatever that may be.
     
  2. Uncertaindrummer

    Uncertaindrummer Active Member

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    We need to read translations approved by God's Church, which was founded by Him for purposes such as this one. ;)
     
  3. jewscout

    jewscout Religious Zionist

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    or you could learn some hebrew...it's not that hard:jiggy:
     
  4. angellous_evangellous

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    You're right. All of the biblical languages (for Christians: Greek, Hebrew, and Aramic) are much easier than German. :D
     
  5. Quiddity

    Quiddity UndertheInfluenceofGiants

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    Bass, taking the Bible "as is" does not fix the clarity of Scripture. All it does is save you time from doing research. If multiple intelligent, educated, faithful minds don’t agree as to the meaning of some text they’ve studied for years, then the true meaning of that text is obviously not readily apparent and easily understood. Perhaps because God never intended for us to take the BIBLE ALONE. Let me know your thoughts.

    ~Victor
     
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  6. Bass04life

    Bass04life New Member

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    You're right, taking the bible as is and trying to understand it doesn't clarify anything. It can actually make it pretty confusing. But thinking from the christian perspective: isn't it through the holy spirit, prayer, and fellowship that God's word is understood? I'd also agree that God doesn't just give us the bible alone to see his character, he gives us other examples as well. So my main problem is that I have yet to see christians questioning the comforting texts, or the texts that give hope. The only texts that christians really go back to dig up research on and compare translations on are the ones that don't fit in to their own picture of what God is supposed to be like therefore making it their word, not God's. Basically mistaking interpretation for personal translation. But if your argument is that the intelligent, educated, and faithful minds will do the necessary research to find answers then does God leave the uneducated out in the cold? I wanted to use an analogy in the first post with a mission trip for this reason. What if the only thing we can give them is a bible? Is that not good enough? I disagree.
     
  7. EnhancedSpirit

    EnhancedSpirit High Priestess

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    And which translations are approved by God's Church? And which church is God's Church?
     
  8. Mister Emu

    Mister Emu Emu Extraordinaire
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    Bass,

    The reason why some people(I included) go back and look at the translation, is because men did the translating.

    Which Bible? There are many, and some of them say completley different things in some passages. You cannot go by the premise that God did not allow the Bible to be corrupted, because you would have to accept every Bible out there, even when they contradict each other.
     
  9. almifkhar

    almifkhar Active Member

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    this statement of mine does not just go for the bible. i think that people try to change or rewrite religious texts simply because they don't want to follow it as a whole. pope john paul 2 said it best "religion is not to be changed." it is understandable that times do infact change, but it does not mean that people who aligin themselves to a religion should. religious peoples can still do what they are supose to do religiously while living a modern life. instead, people like to pick and choose what they will and will not follow in religious texts. by this action, it cheepens the religion, it goes against it in every way possible. look at cathloicism for example, homosexuals want to be reconized, women want to have the right to have an abortion, and be a preist. because the pope said no to these things the result was that lots of people have turned against the cathloic chruch. yet they would have stayed if the "rules" were bent to their will. i think that it is important to ask questions and to debate, but if the religion as a whole does not work for you, why align yourself with it.
     
  10. EnhancedSpirit

    EnhancedSpirit High Priestess

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    The basic doctrine that is held by most mainline denominations is that once we are saved, our job is to take salvation to others. The emphasis is on teaching Christians about Jesus so that they can go out and evangelize the world.

    No, there is nothing wrong with that doctrine. Yes, God does want us to evangelize the world. However, the work is being hindered by not fully understanding the system God means to implement. Not all people are evangelists and teachers. There are many many other positions in the Body of Christ that are unfilled because people do not know about them. People do not know what God wants them to be doing.

    I do agree that everything we need to know IS in the Bible; however, we need to allow God to interpret the scriptures to us. God can add clarification and direction to what is already written. He can tell you how the scripture applies directly to you. There is much more than what is there...the application is what is missing from the Bible!

    Don't allow tradition or man-made doctrine to dictate your relationship with God! Don't try to define God in human terms! Don't decide what God will and won't do! You don't need men to teach you. 1John 2:27 says:[font=LUCIDA CALLIGRAPHY,ARIAL,HELVITICA,TIMES NEW ROMAN]"But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him." [/font]

    [font=ARIAL,VERDANA,TIMES NEW ROMAN]The Holy Spirit will teach you if you will let Him! Be open to any and all possibilities. "...for with God all things are possible." (Mark 10:27)[/font]
     
  11. greatcalgarian

    greatcalgarian Well-Known Member

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    It does not matter which version of bible you used. Your interpretation of bible will depend on your own past education and experience, how you learn the meaning of the word "hate", "love", "father", "mother", "family", "life", "dead", "morality", .......etc. A person brought up in a conservative family environment, will then have one set of idea about what the bible is telling him. His understanding of bible passages is always attributed to "holy spirit" guiding him. Actually, this holy spirit, is made up of all his experience in life from the time the sperm met the egg. Since no two man have the same beginning (identical twin is the closest as to be starting from being the same), and subsequesnt life experience is never the same, no two persons can have the same interpretation on the same sentence or word in the bible.
    Most of the time, Christians are seeking comfort in the bible since the faith required them to do so, believe in the bible. So when they encountered a part of the bible that is contrary to their comfort zone, they simply either close their mind on that, or try to find an alternate way to become comfortable with that part of the bible. Hence a lot of effort to try to explain away the errant part of the bible, and the part that teaches goodness need no further changing, so is left intact, so that the next reading will bring more comfort. Make sense?
     
  12. EnhancedSpirit

    EnhancedSpirit High Priestess

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    Selective Hearing and Selective Memory are two of my favorites.
     
  13. greatcalgarian

    greatcalgarian Well-Known Member

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    I thought : hear no evil, see no evil, and speak no evil should be the motto of our life:jiggy:
     
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