Political correctness

[sillygeezer10]

I ask you, Is PC okay or not?
PC according to me is a bit stupid, freedom hating hag.
In NZ, PC is so unbearably every where I pull my hair just thinking about it. If PC existed in biblical times then the bible won't exist, you atheists won't debate about it, Christians would have no God to worship.
There would be no things which make life so fun, things to discuss, no free will, Naziness everywhere. Your life would be boring. I've researching this subject loads, I came to this conclusion, PC is evil.

God bless I'm allowed to say this!

 

[Pah]

Political correctness is no less a modifying stategy for social behavior as is the sermon mentioning sin.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

I do not like political correctness...nor do I like the sermon mentioning sin. Of course, the sermon mentioning sin does not put me at an unfair disadvantage when applying to college...*violin plays*

 

[wulfhere]

I think that Political Correctness is well intentioned, but has gotten a bad rep for a few reasons:

1. It is, at its root, a form of censorship, since it tries to curtail language that offends various groups.
2. It is almost impossible to get the various groups to agree on what is offensive. It is definitely impossible to get all groups to agree on what is offensive.
3. Exchanging a term that has a negative connotation for one that doesn't is only going to give that new term the negative connotation, eventually. Take "handicapped" for example. People used to say crippled, then handicapped, now differently abled, or x-challenged. The truth is that all these terms mean the same thing, which is not a desirable condition to be in (not that I'm knocking handicapped people - just saying that most of us would prefer NOT to be handicapped).

Basically, its a worthwhile cause to try to avoid language that offends people, both because of the Golden Rule, and because it's an impediment to true, open communication, which this world seems to be sorely lacking.

So basically, I don't think that political correctness is inherently bad, but I do think that trying to force your values on someone else is.

My 2 cents.

 

[DontFearMe]

who determines what is pc?

 

[Pah]

who determines what is pc?

Usually the loser of the issue - the winner is just getting justice.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

I am not sure I understand what you are saying there, pah. Could you please elaborate?

 

[Yerda]

I once read that if people were so politically correct back when 'The Life Of Brian' was being made the film would have been banned. This immediately sets me at odds with the issue. PC also tries to prevent us from using our most colourful and descriptive adjectives in public (which I will not use for fear of being thrown out). Just about everything is racist, sexist, homophobic etc according to the rules of PC. I say to F**K with political correctness!!

 

[sillygeezer10]

I use non PC words whenever I can in my cartoons. That'll be banned. In one cartoon, messchird said "Long live the words " n word" and "shelia" on as freedom of speech" another one from messchird "f**k PC let it all ouT!"

 

[Pah]

Political correctness has as it's intention to foster inclusion of minorities into a more cohesive social structure. It has the same aim as laws against hate-speech but it's underlying force is moral persuasion not punishment, So when political correctness suceedes, it is a victory for justice.

Those who are offended by the practise of political correctness may be said to foster the denial toward a fuller equality either inadvertantly or purposely. There will be a hue and cry from those who say "But I'm not biased or prejudiced" and perhaps they are not. But using the words of those who are biased encourages the continuence of bias.

How difficult is it to learn to say "humankind" instead of "mankind"? It is much nicer to show respect for another human and use the "prefered label" than to use what might be taken as a pejorative. This seems to be a matter of education - or lack ot it - but it is definetly a sign of disrespect.

I have always been offended by comedians from Don Rickles (who used no "nasty" words) through Andrew Dice Clay (who rarely used a "nice" word when a "nasty" one could be found). Insult and shock were rarely funny though this genre had a large following. The same is true, for me, for the artist who vulgarizes his or her art. - it plays to the basest of human qualities.

 

[sillygeezer10]

There's sanitized posts by me called What's the antediviluvian world's like? or Where's man come from?
I'm never really a "sanitized" person.
I'm putting a warning soon for people like you. But you have a free will. Nothing will stop you anyway.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

pah-- I see what you are saying, that does make sense. However, you are forgetting that sometimes it is politically correct to be prejudiced against particular groups...it seems very PC nowadays to criticize Christians, but it is not PC to criticize Muslims. It is even PC for someone to be at a disadvantage to be accepted to college on the basis that they are white.

Remember back in the 90's, when that guy was cheating on his wife, and she cut his you-know-what off while he was asleep? It was politically correct for women to state on TV that "he deserved it" and so forth...but if a man had harmed a woman who was cheating on him, it would not have been PC for men to go on TV and praise his actions.

Sometimes it just seems like political correctness goes too far...it not only stops prejudice, but it pushes it in another direction.

 

[Pah]

pah-- I see what you are saying, that does make sense. However, you are forgetting that sometimes it is politically correct to be prejudiced against particular groups...it seems very PC nowadays to criticize Christians, but it is not PC to criticize Muslims. It is even PC for someone to be at a disadvantage to be accepted to college on the basis that they are white.

Remember back in the 90's, when that guy was cheating on his wife, and she cut his you-know-what off while he was asleep? It was politically correct for women to state on TV that "he deserved it" and so forth...but if a man had harmed a woman who was cheating on him, it would not have been PC for men to go on TV and praise his actions.

Sometimes it just seems like political correctness goes too far...it not only stops prejudice, but it pushes it in another direction.

I wouldn't call those incidents "politically correct" - a "popular" action maybe - but certainly not from a motive of inclusiveness.

So very much of "Christian bashing" is the "fledging" use of a new voice from those who were disadvantaged and oppressed but it is not correct in any manner. I also believe that the "persecution" some Christians feel is a result from a tradition of praising martydom - it's part of the history (a very small part) and expected.

And yes, reverse discrimination is a difficult solution for some whites to stomach for the hundreds of years of "being on top" but that is perhaps the only case of PC you've mentioned. It correctly tries to use social policy to remedy an evil toward an "approved" social goal.

There will always be those that praise violence from support of the killer of abortion doctors, the bombing of clinics, the personal threats to doctors to the case you cited for genital mutilation.. It seems to me that these are products of bitterness or malignant zeal and will never be correct.

 

[wulfhere]

I agree that there is a lot of Christian bashing going on, at least in America. I don't think that is necessarily in line with PC thinking though - it's supposed to be inclusive (and specifically tries to avoid insulting anyone).

Unfortunately, there's also a tendency in the U.S. to "pick on" the perceived overdog. Just look at sitcoms today: when was the last time you saw a dad on TV that wasn't an oafish caricature? This, combined with the intolerance and overbearing actions of some of those who call themselves Christians, means that they seem to have become targets.

I DON'T think that this represents the spirit of Political Correctness. I don't think that we have to knock the people down to raise others.

Just like anything else, a good idea can be (and usually is) taken too far. While words CAN hurt, and it's important for everyone to try to avoid hurting each other (remember that Golden Rule?), it's equally important to avoid forcing your ideas on everyone else.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

And yes, reverse discrimination is a difficult solution for some whites to stomach for the hundreds of years of "being on top" but that is perhaps the only case of PC you've mentioned. It correctly tries to use social policy to remedy an evil toward an "approved" social goal.

I haven't been on top for hundreds of years...I'm only 18 years old for crying out loud. I thought PC was supposed to be about treating people as individuals...not lumping them together in a group.

And it's not just "some whites" pah...reverse discrimination is hard for a lot of blacks to stomach, too. Some of my black friends find it insulting.

 

[sillygeezer10]

Hello

I want to give you this link

//http://pcwatch.blogspot.com/

 

[Pah]

And yes, reverse discrimination is a difficult solution for some whites to stomach for the hundreds of years of "being on top" but that is perhaps the only case of PC you've mentioned. It correctly tries to use social policy to remedy an evil toward an "approved" social goal.

I haven't been on top for hundreds of years...I'm only 18 years old for crying out loud. I thought PC was supposed to be about treating people as individuals...not lumping them together in a group.

And it's not just "some whites" pah...reverse discrimination is hard for a lot of blacks to stomach, too. Some of my black friends find it insulting.

The tradition of "being on top" has been around for hundreds of years and you would be a benefitiary of that tradition if you are male and white.

Political correctness is for groups. The solution is, borrowing a phrase, "Think globally and act locally" - which means to me, in this case, to treat the individual in accordance with what should extend to the whole group. Individual acheivement would be next to zero if the group were being kept from opportunity.

I don't doubt that some blacks have trouble with being connected to an antii-discrimination policy. They would still be at risk of discrimination from those who would say "You couldn't make it on your own but you suceed only because the policy gave you a "jump up". I think that was one of the complaints that Justice Thomas had in his confirmation hearing when he was asked why he did not support anti-dicrimination efforts.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

That sort of makes sense, though I think all the disadvantaged kids from the inner cities--black and white--should benefit in that case. That would give the truly disadvantaged folks--the people in inner cities at poor schools, whether they be black or white--some needed help.

As it is, seems like a lot of colleges discriminate against people of white race because that's PC and having lots of minorities makes them look good...but do you really think those colleges are going to deny the truly advantaged--the rich and powerful? Yeah, right...they do everything they can to get the rich and powerful into their schools so they can milk them after they graduate. It's hypocrisy on multiple levels.

 

[wulfhere]

I haven't been on top for hundreds of years...I'm only 18 years old for crying out loud. I thought PC was supposed to be about treating people as individuals...not lumping them together in a group.

And it's not just "some whites" pah...reverse discrimination is hard for a lot of blacks to stomach, too. Some of my black friends find it insulting.

Isn't discrimination in any form BAD??? The only way we are ever going to get along in this world is if everybody tries their best to treat everyone as equals To love their neighbor as they love themselves, as Jesus aptly put it. And heck, since this is a religious forum, if you've been discriminated against, aren't you supposed to "turn the other cheek"? Reverse discrimination seems to fly in the face of that.

I know that noone is perfect, and everyone has prejudices, but one of my goals has always been to try to overcome this kind of thing.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

I am a supposed beneficiary of the tradition of white males "being on top" but I would say the pendulum has swung the other way...it is a disadvantage to be a white male nowadays in many respects. I am made to feel like I, being a white male, am the "bad guy" all the time....in movies, TV, etc. it's always a white male killer, or a white male boss sexually harassing a woman. In American history, the main bad guys are white men--Nazis, slave owners, British redcoats, the KKK, and Native American killers. It's socially acceptable to make criticisms of white men, like they have no rhythm, or they are boring. Even in the classroom, I can't make the following comment without being ganged up on by all the girls as a sexist pig: "Why is it that there are more girls than boys in the AP classes, yet girls score lower than boys on the SAT's?" These facts are accurate, but coming from a white male they are more readily interpreted as sexist or racist. Plus I am at a disadvantage applying to colleges and jobs before my credentials are even looked at simply because I am a white male--no other reason.

My great grandpa came to the U.S. because life was so terrible in Germany and war was about to break out. My dad was very poor but he worked his way through college. Many of his classes in the engineering school were filled with foreign students getting free tuition. He skipped meals a lot during college, worked multiple jobs and night shifts, and spent many years afterwards paying off debts. Is this the "being on top" tradition of which I am a beneficiary?

I am not saying PC is totally wrong, I just think reverse discrimination is wrong.