Many Mansions in the afterlife

[Shantanu]

I kind of see it the opposite way. I do not think we should live for the goodies in this world because they are vain and empty. That does not mean we cannot enjoy ourselves some, but what is there in this world that is so great? Not much really, compared to what lies ahead in the spiritual world.

"Bahá'u'lláh says that were we to have the proper vision to see the blessings of the other world we would not bear to endure one more hour of existence upon the earth. The reason why we are deprived of that vision is because otherwise no one would care to remain and the whole fabric of society will be destroyed.”
(From a letter written on behalf of Shoghi Effendi to an individual believer, October 22, 1932)
Lights of Guidance (second part)
​

I certainly would not want to spend eternity in this world, even if I could. The ultimate spiritual goal is to acquire spiritual qualities in this world and thereby prepare ourselves for our future life in the spiritual world, where we will spend all of eternity.

That is lovely: However Trailblazer, God has truly been great to me during my life here on this planet, I would not swop it for a life in heaven.

 

[Fool]

We are having some good discussions here, so please don't ruin everything by bringing in some man made mythology references that makes no sense.

the originator of this thread mentioned edgar cayce and the bible. i followed suit.


i'm not exclusively anything. u're using a symbol of ba over a sarcophagus; so then why are you disparaging mythology when you're using it?


do you understand the law of reciprocity, golden rule?

 

[ArtieE]

Thanks, I will try to find the time to read those...

Oh you'll be amazed how much more detailed and useful information there is especially in the Urantia Book and the Michael Newton books than what you have been quoting here from this Bahá'u'lláh.

 

[Trailblazer]

That is lovely: However Trailblazer, God has truly been great to me during my life here on this planet, I would not swop it for a life in heaven.

Conversely, my life on this planet has been mostly suffering. I would swap this life for a life in heaven any day.

I do not know what heaven will be like but I have faith that it will be better than this life, because that is what Baha'u'llah wrote.

“O My servants! Sorrow not if, in these days and on this earthly plane, things contrary to your wishes have been ordained and manifested by God, for days of blissful joy, of heavenly delight, are assuredly in store for you. Worlds, holy and spiritually glorious, will be unveiled to your eyes. You are destined by Him, in this world and hereafter, to partake of their benefits, to share in their joys, and to obtain a portion of their sustaining grace. To each and every one of them you will, no doubt, attain.”
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 329​

 

[Trailblazer]

Oh you'll be amazed how much more detailed and useful information there is especially in the Urantia Book and the Michael Newton books than what you have been quoting here from this Bahá'u'lláh.

Maybe so, but I have only quoted a few excerpts from the Writings of Baha'u'llah, I cannot quote all of His Tablets on a forum, but people can go and read them if they want to.

The Works of Bahá'u'lláh

 

[Shantanu]

Conversely, my life on this planet has been mostly suffering. I would swap this life for a life in heaven any day.

I do not know what heaven will be like but I have faith that it will be better than this life, because that is what Baha'u'llah wrote.

“O My servants! Sorrow not if, in these days and on this earthly plane, things contrary to your wishes have been ordained and manifested by God, for days of blissful joy, of heavenly delight, are assuredly in store for you. Worlds, holy and spiritually glorious, will be unveiled to your eyes. You are destined by Him, in this world and hereafter, to partake of their benefits, to share in their joys, and to obtain a portion of their sustaining grace. To each and every one of them you will, no doubt, attain.”
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 329​

Good luck with your quest, Trailblazer.

 

[Trailblazer]

Good luck with your quest, Trailblazer.

Same to you.

 

[Ancient Soul]

the originator of this thread mentioned edgar cayce and the bible. i followed suit.


i'm not exclusively anything. u're using a symbol of ba over a sarcophagus; so then why are you disparaging mythology when you're using it?


do you understand the law of reciprocity, golden rule?

I'm sorry, but I find the Christian bible/mythology to be spiritually void. So I get upset whenever a verse or verses are presented as as "proving" something "spiritual". When it's just some wildly generalized bunch of words that holds no true spiritual meaning.

And I overlooked the "many mansions" reference because it was just a tiny part of the opening statement of this thread, while everything else was more precise and meaningful.

Also, it's not a good idea to try using deceitful tactics when attempting to attack me. Like pointing out that I used the Ba avatar, then jumping from that, to falsely stating that I'm attempting to "disparaging mythology when you're using it", when you just made that up.

I decided upon the username of Ancient Soul so thought it fitting to use the Egyptian Ba, their symbol of the SOUL, as my avatar. That's it! So don't go making up stuff on what you want to claim to others my "intentions" are.

 

[Ancient Soul]

I do not know what you think about religions or any religion in particular, but just off the top of my head what if the religions are actually religions from God, and Jesus really does greet people in the afterlife? I actually believe there are spirit guides, holy souls who come down from higher levels (spheres) and assist those who are less spiritually developed, but I also believe it is possible that Christians will see Jesus and those of other religions will see whatever Prophet/Messenger/Holy Man they believed in. It is not a given they will see them, and I do not think everyone will see them, but those who are at higher levels will be more likely to see them. Maybe Jesus greets newcomers just to help them feel comfortable and then goes back to His own high place?

Well, people might see the "god" or religious figure of their beliefs during an NDE, but I doubt that will be the case if they pass their final judgment and get to enter the spiritual universe or "afterlife". For in an NDE there's usually some message, instruction, or just a hint that there is "something" beyond their normal physical existence, so it is best served to them in some way that they are more familiar with. But it's beyond my capabilities to view what others experience in NDEs thru their own perspective, so I can only speculate on what they actually did or did not really see.

As to being greeted in the "afterlife" by the "god" or religious figure of their beliefs, I seriously doubt it. For by the time they have spiritually evolved enough to pass their "final" judgment, they should already have enough spiritual experience and understanding to have dropped all of the false man made "god" constructs. That, and they should also be in full accord with the True God's nature, laws, and plan for ALL souls, so they can "hit the ground running" in taking their chosen part in helping out ALL of the souls still in the physical universe/realm, or a few other specialized assignments. So I just don't see how it would work out that they would still be admitted into the spiritual universe/realm clinging to a false religious beliefs that has nothing to do with what I just described. Now again, it's beyond my capabilities to view what others see, or think they see, or don't see when they DO get to enter the spiritual universe permanently, but from everything I DO know, I just don't see how they would be allowed to have such false beliefs.

As for that *bright light* people say they see, the jury is out as far as I am concerned. I suppose people attribute that light to whatever preconceived ideas or beliefs they have.

That's what it seems to be. Now while I try not to read anything spiritual related so as to not let things influence my own spiritual experiences or the interpretation of them, I did digress once in reading some NDE/OBE stories because someone claimed they read some that were similar to mine. And while I think they were just messing with me as I didn't find any at all like mine, I did read several who just guessed that the "white light" MUST have been "god" or "Jesus".

So what do you think is the *value* of not having any prior beliefs before we die?

I definitely think that religious beliefs could be a hindrance, especially if people cling to doctrines and dogma that has no value in the spiritual world, or a religion that was not even true, as they believed it. This was pointed out in the book I cited in the OP:

“A century earlier, Andrew Jackson Davis reported that many souls continue to subscribe to the same religious beliefs they held in the physical world. He referred to this sphere, or section of the sphere, as Altolissa. “Jews still believe in the doctrine of their fathers – Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob; the Roam Catholics hold the same views they did before death; and there are other sects in Altolissa who think and believe in the same things and forms of faith they learned on earth,” he stated, adding that they are so far below the ‘higher planes’ that this is required in order to make them feel ‘at home.’ However, all eventually evolve toward a single understanding of spirit.”​

Well, we ALL have our beliefs or atheist non-beliefs on spiritual matters and the "afterlife". It's just the insanely off base man made religions/mythologies that I have a problem with, and try my best to make them understand that they have been led astray and WHY this is so.

But those who actually WORK to seek spiritual understand and use their rational thinking, being able to compare what they believe with what they know about the world around them to see if their beliefs fit or not, and keep on CHANGING their beliefs as new information and/or experiences comes to light, or drop some beliefs that do not fit somehow, it is they who will make the greatest progress.

My material world is falling apart right now , so I will get back to what post I can when I can.

Try duct tape, that fixes everything except stupid people.

 

[Ancient Soul]

I am not sure where you got your information... I have seen what you have posted and I know you do not like religion but what you just said aligns with my religious beliefs. Note that the Baha’i Faith is nothing like the older religions such as Christianity except that we share the same spiritual truths which are eternal.

That's what I get for assuming things and thought it was already understood. Everything I state on spiritual matters comes from my own spiritual experiences, my understandings gained from them, or was imparted to me by God in response to my questions. It all depends upon how much time I have and the depth of understanding required, on which method is used.

I beg to differ, but after I posted a question on what religious beliefs you held, I noticed it was right there in your profile. And I make a distinction between "religion" and a "spiritual teachings", so after checking it out a little I would call your beliefs more in the "spiritual teachings" category.

I meant that once we go beyond the wall that separates life from death (separates the physical world from the spiritual world) we are permanently dead and we cannot come back to life, as those who had NDEs came back to life.

{{{ This is what I was referring to above, not being able to come back after we have gone beyond the wall}}}

I can see that you are quite set on believing that you only get one lifetime shot at passing or failing God's judgment, so I'll leave it at that. I pick my battles, and it's the ones like the Christians who are WAY off base and need some serious correcting that I willingly battle with. You seem to be doing fine on your own and I like you, so I'll not belabor the point.

It seems to me that God was showing you that once you died you would no longer have those things that you held so dear in the material world, and that is why you were afraid, but that is also why you were so happy to see your father’s face and realize you were still alive.

Naturally I've gone over the "events" of my NDE/OBE countless times, and I'm convinced that God was only explaining what "death" was because when he told me I was "dying", as soon as the question popped into my mind, he answered it with that.

So did that experience make you appreciate life more? I have heard that is what those who had NDEs experience, a greater appreciation for life. But also many do not want to come back here and do so only because of their families and things they feel they have to do here, all the while knowing the spiritual world is far better than anything in the material world. I do not have to die to know that because it is part of my religious beliefs and I have strong faith.

On one hand I thank God for every single minute of every single day. I fully savor the feel of the hot sun, the wind, the cold, the beauty of the clouds, sunrises, sunsets, forests, the feelings of friendships, of doing things, even enduring hardships, so long as I can crawl away and see another day, I'm HAPPY!

On the other, this physical life seems dull and boring overall compared to my spiritual experiences in the spiritual universe/realm which are beyond vivid and even mesmerizing at times. So I long to be there.

 

[dfnj]

Well, I'm sorry but I cannot agree with your comments.

There is nothing I've even experienced in my spiritual experiences, or that imparted and/or shown me that supports any of that.

That being said, I'm mainly on this forum website to debate with the Christians, and so have no quarrel with your beliefs. So long as you don't start slandering God as being this horrifically wrathful and demonic "god" like the Christians claim, then we're good.

You can't agree with it because you suffer from ego delusion. I don't think life continues after death. We just get absorbed into the mind of God. It's a one way ticket. It's the entire Universe that get's recycled. You are just being closed minded and clinging to ancient beliefs. There is nothing in any of our characters that is unique or not shared with millions of other people. Millions of people laugh at the same jokes, have the same hopes and dreams, have the same fears, and the same joys. Other than the shape of your face just what exactly do you think gets recycled?

You say you have spiritual experiences but are unwilling or unable to share them. Oh well. I have them too, and they do not agree with the ones you have had. So what does it mean? Who is right and who is wrong and who gets to decide?

I'm not here to debate either and I really don't care to hear that you are not interesting in quarreling. The strength of my convictions cannot be shaken by your fear based ego delusional perspectives. I only respond to posts to organize my thoughts. I don't do it for you. I organize my thoughts for me.

Why is slandering God a big deal for you? God is ultimately responsible for every facet of His creation including all the good and evil. The question we have to ask ourselves are we capable of still loving God and loving ourselves in spite of ALL our imperfections and everyone else's imperfections?

So far, other than hinting at your profound experiences there's no there there.

 

[dfnj]

Try duct tape, that fixes everything except stupid people.

You only criticize and hate in other people what you do not like about your own character. Otherwise you would just have love in your heart and not see people as being stupid.

You should read the Tibetan Book of the Dead which claims we are tortured by monsters of our own creation based on who we are as a person. The book is hundreds of prayers and mantras to help you get past the judgments of your own creation.

I think when we die we go into the light, stare into God's infinite beauty, and which point time ceases to exist the moment we achieve absolute full connection with the infinite of God's being. Almost all religious texts say our ego is a delusion and our separation from God is a delusion in one form or another.

In spite of our own disappointments with our own imperfections, I think God thinks we are ALL perfect creations otherwise we would be finger snapped out of existence. I think all are saved and everyone gets to experience looking into the face of God. If everyone gets to experience eternal heavenly bliss by looking into the face of God then I just don't have enough hate in my heart to care if Hitler or someone else who is pure evil doesn't get to experience it also. Whatever my life's purpose here on Earth serves its mission accomplished as far as I am concerned because otherwise it would not be part of God's master plan.

 

[Shantanu]

Same to you.

I do believe there is a heaven of sorts.

 

[Shantanu]

I do believe there is a heaven of sorts.

By becoming God on Earth first.

 

[Trailblazer]

I do believe there is a heaven of sorts.

I'm glad.

 

[Shantanu]

I'm glad.

I asked God this very question: and He said that only those who were God on Earth enter heaven (which in Hinduism is called Brahmaloka).

 

[Trailblazer]

By becoming God on Earth first.

I would say by becoming what you are potentially capable of becoming, a manifestation of the names and attributes of God, you will make it to heaven...

“Whatever is in the heavens and whatever is on the earth is a direct evidence of the revelation within it of the attributes and names of God, inasmuch as within every atom are enshrined the signs that bear eloquent testimony to the revelation of that Most Great Light. Methinks, but for the potency of that revelation, no being could ever exist......

To a supreme degree is this true of man, who, among all created things, hath been invested with the robe of such gifts, and hath been singled out for the glory of such distinction. For in him are potentially revealed all the attributes and names of God to a degree that no other created being hath excelled or surpassed. All these names and attributes are applicable to him. Even as He hath said: “Man is My mystery, and I am his mystery.””
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 177​

 

[Trailblazer]

I asked God this very question: and He said that only those who were God on Earth enter heaven (which in Hinduism is called Brahmaloka).

Maybe he meant those who become manifestations of God on earth enter heaven, as I just pointed out in my previous post.

 

[Shantanu]

I would say by becoming what you are potentially capable of becoming, a manifestation of the names and attributes of God, you will make it to heaven...

“Whatever is in the heavens and whatever is on the earth is a direct evidence of the revelation within it of the attributes and names of God, inasmuch as within every atom are enshrined the signs that bear eloquent testimony to the revelation of that Most Great Light. Methinks, but for the potency of that revelation, no being could ever exist......

To a supreme degree is this true of man, who, among all created things, hath been invested with the robe of such gifts, and hath been singled out for the glory of such distinction. For in him are potentially revealed all the attributes and names of God to a degree that no other created being hath excelled or surpassed. All these names and attributes are applicable to him. Even as He hath said: “Man is My mystery, and I am his mystery.””
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 177​

Do all people of every faith have the potential of becoming a manifestation of God?

 

[Shantanu]

Maybe he meant those who become manifestations of God on earth enter heaven, as I just pointed out in my previous post.

It is similar to my findings.