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Labour Leadership Contest

J

Jeremy Taylor

Active Member
Jaiket said:
Nobody likes Blair except the tories.
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And a lot of the Labour party.

What like the Queen?
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When did her majesty ever show she was a friend to IRA terrorism? Corbyn showed his sympathies for the likes of Sinn Fein even at the height of the troubles, long before the Major and Blair governments began the shameful surrender to terrorists.

In fact, Corbyn seems almost like a George Galloway sort of individual. Is there any anti-British cause or government he hasn't supported?
 
J

Jeremy Taylor

Active Member
You prefer front men for terrorist groups, involved in terrorism against your own nation, to the your sovereign? No wonder you have a soft spot for Corbyn. Even the BBC, always shamefully sympathetic to IRA terrorism, recently made Adams very uncomfortable in finally asking him about his involvement with disappearances in the seventies and eighties, including of Catholics.

I'm not sure what that link proves. Corbyn was pally with the likes of Adams at the height of the troubles. Her majesty's actions would have more to with mistaken ideas of reconciliation between sections of Ulster society, and were probably heavily influenced by those advising her.
 
J

Jeremy Taylor

Active Member
Jaiket said:
At least he's not a terrorist.
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I think you could definitely work on his campaign staff. I think you have the makings of a great campaign slogan for Corbyn there.

With Corbyn you actually have someone worse than the Blair creature or Mr. Slippery, our current PM - which is no small feat!
 
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Laika

Laika

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Speaking as someone on the Far Left, I'm left with the impression Jeremy Corbyn is a dangerous and vacious non-entity. Admittedly, I'm happy to see some more radical issues being raised and discussed, but as far as I can tell the man won't deliver and he will face extreme institutional resistence within his own party simply for winning the leadership contest. it looks very empty, badly prepared and if they even got a hint of power at this stage, potentially very destructive because they're so incomptent.

Ultimatum said:
Well, that would be a good start! Unfortunately,

In a statement released to the Guardian, Corbyn said: “Labour should set out its own clear position to influence negotiations, working with our European allies to set out a reform agenda to benefit ordinary Europeans across the continent. We cannot be content with the state of the EU as it stands. But that does not mean walking away, but staying to fight together for a better Europe.”

So he is, therefore, spineless, and is hopping along on the status-quo train. He hasn't a definite position--but holds a let's wait and see approach.
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His lack of clarity on the position to the EU raises many issues; to the best of my knowledge, any serious attempt to launch a socialist economic remodeling of the UK would require we leave the EU. The fact he's [supposedly] offering a left-wing alternative and can't even answer "yes" to a question as simple as this one rings alarm bells. one nation cannot single handedly reform the EU, whether it's from the right or the left, so demands for "reform" really isn't a viable platform in the long-term.

If he can't be straight-forward about this, I cannot see how he can be trusted on anything else. If the people want change, you're job is to deliver it and tell them what it entails so it's an informed decision. actual leaders don't take the support of the people for granted becaue appealing to principles is generally not enough to get people's support. It sounds like SYRIZA all over again.
 
Yerda

Yerda

Veteran Member
Jeremy Taylor said:
I think you could definitely work on his campaign staff. I think you have the makings of a great campaign slogan for Corbyn there.

With Corbyn you actually have someone worse than the Blair creature or Mr. Slippery, our current PM - which is no small feat!
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Honestly? You really think he's that bad? He seems like a totally inoffensive woolly sweater of a man. We had Red Ed. Next up, Beige Jez. I always expect him to start distributing Werther's and find I await reports of him drowning in a cup of lukewarm herbal tea.

I haven't really paid a lot of attention to what any of the candidates are saying. I did hear that he has been talking about renationalising the railways (along with Burnam) and getting all the PFI contracts out of the NHS. That's not particularly radical given that polls constantly show the public want this. Even Tory party members want to renationalise the railways. Of course anyone who wants support can say this stuff. The chances are pretty slim that he'll ever be in a position to deliver and I suspect he knows this.

The media response and the rhetoric coming from the right of the Labour party has been fascinating though. The Tories must be wetting themselves and wondering why God loves them so much. For the first time in my life I feel like I'm on the inside of a Tory joke.
 
J

Jeremy Taylor

Active Member
From his wiki:

Corbyn has been a long-standing supporter of a United Ireland and controversially invited Sinn Féin President Gerry Adams to London in 1984. A second meeting in 1996 was cancelled following pressure from the Labour Party.[14][15][16] He has been strongly criticised by Labour and Conservative MPs for holding meetings with former members of the IRA in the Houses of Parliament to discuss topics such as conditions in Northern Irish prisons and the IRA ceasefire.[17][18] In an interview on Northern Irish radio in August 2015, Corbyn stressed his opposition to "all bombing" and welcomed the ceasefire and peace process, although he did not express a direct opinion about the actions of the IRA specifically.[19][20]

I actually thought Corbyn was harmless til I looked him up. I'm not socialist or social democract, but I'm a traditional conservative and economically something of a Schumacherite/distributist and environmentalist. I don't think much more highly of Thatcherism (though I think Lady Thatcher our best PM since Churchill - but that isn't saying much) and certainly not Blairism, so Old Labour doesn't scare me that much. I tend to be a localist and decentralist, but I'm not necessarily opposed to nationalising certain utilities like railways.

Genuine Old Labour was Eurosceptic and often wasn't that interested in social liberalism (it was Methodist and Catholic MPs from Merseyside that were a great force in blogging the legalisation of abortion in the 60s), so I was a little disappointed when it became clear Corbyn was more like Red Ken than Peter Shore, but as most Tories and Blairites are more or less left-liberal and Europhiles as well, this didn't really set me against Corbyn. It was only his record with the IRA, idiotic anti-Israel politics, and an almost Galloway-like sympathy with anyone who opposes Britain that has set me against him.
 
Mycroft

Mycroft

Ministry of Serendipity
Laika said:
Speaking as someone on the Far Left, I'm left with the impression Jeremy Corbyn is a dangerous and vacious non-entity. Admittedly, I'm happy to see some more radical issues being raised and discussed, but as far as I can tell the man won't deliver and he will face extreme institutional resistence within his own party simply for winning the leadership contest. it looks very empty, badly prepared and if they even got a hint of power at this stage, potentially very destructive because they're so incomptent.
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He's dangerous in that his being Labour Leader will secure another Tory victory in 2020. HIs ideas are too good, and don't fit with what the establishment wants. Renationalising the Energy companies, railways, and scrapping trident will affect a lot of profits if he was Prime Minister. For this reason, the people whose votes actually count would simply vote Tory to protect their profits.
 
Yerda

Yerda

Veteran Member
Jeremy Taylor said:
From his wiki:

Corbyn has been a long-standing supporter of a United Ireland and controversially invited Sinn Féin President Gerry Adams to London in 1984. A second meeting in 1996 was cancelled following pressure from the Labour Party.[14][15][16] He has been strongly criticised by Labour and Conservative MPs for holding meetings with former members of the IRA in the Houses of Parliament to discuss topics such as conditions in Northern Irish prisons and the IRA ceasefire.[17][18] In an interview on Northern Irish radio in August 2015, Corbyn stressed his opposition to "all bombing" and welcomed the ceasefire and peace process, although he did not express a direct opinion about the actions of the IRA specifically.[19][20]
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I can't see anything dangerous here.
 
J

Jeremy Taylor

Active Member
Jaiket said:
I can't see anything dangerous here.
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You mean you see nothing wrong with support terrorists who are at war with your own country? Is this how far the left has sunk in modern Britain?

I am sure that those who were blown up, shot, or disappeared by IRA terrorists would be much cheered to see how flippant the contemporary left is towards such actions.
 
J

Jeremy Taylor

Active Member
Being pally with the front men for IRA terrorism, who were well known to be linked to it (see all the stuff that has come out over the years about the likes of Adams and McGuiness and their involvement), is not being sympathetic to IRA terrorism? He may not have announced his support for the acts themselves, but his behaviour clearly shows much sympathy for the IRA course and a breathtaking lack of concern for terrorist actions against his own country.
 
Altfish

Altfish

Veteran Member
Jeremy Taylor said:
Being pally with the front men for IRA terrorism, who were well known to be linked to it (see all the stuff that has come out over the years about the likes of Adams and McGuiness and their involvement), is not being sympathetic to IRA terrorism? He may not have announced his support for the acts themselves, but his behaviour clearly shows much sympathy for the IRA course and a breathtaking lack of concern for terrorist actions against his own country.
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Are you suggesting that the UK and NI in particular is worse off now than before the Good Friday Agreement of the late 90s?
 
P

philbo

High Priest of Cynicism
Jeremy Taylor said:
Farage is worse than Galloway?
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Hell, no.. Though I guess it depends on your definition of "worse".. Galloway's in a class of his own for massively over-inflated ego, absolute conviction of his own rectitude irrespective of any facts and tendency to bully and browbeat anyone who tries to speak against him. Farage is a pussycat in comparison.
 
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