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Jesus sacrifice and logic

savagewind

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
FearGod said:
So do you think punishing evildoers whom have their trust on Jesus will be unfair.
and how you could be sure that they will be saved.
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Punishing evildoers after they die in disproportion to what they did in life is unfair. I think it is not possible for an evildoer to trust 'Jesus'. Someone who chooses to do evil is not trusting in 'Jesus'. We all do evil, more or less. The evil that we do will lead to it's own effect. Sometimes God takes away effect, it is called grace.
 
L

loverOfTruth

Well-Known Member
Lady B said:
I agree, and you must not mistake God's mercy for us as a free pass to sin, This is dangerous and would only show we are not of Christ at all. Because I am saved by Christ's blood does not mean I can go be drunk and naked and free for all, It is more reason I should live a wholesome life in gratitude of his sacrifice.:facepalm: Now when I fall, I do the same as you do, I ask God to forgive me and get back on the path He sets for me, I may fall many times in my life and Go to him in prayer for forgiveness many times, but He wants us always to perservere and never give up our yearning for a holy life.

I can now see your next question coming....( I am learning your good mind). You want to ask , why do I need constance repentance and seeking of forgiveness when Christ paid it all for ever? Because God asks that all believers repent and seek him in prayer, so that we may draw closer to him and seek his plans for our lives and bear the fruit of our salvation.
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But what happens if a believer in Christ doesn't do that (part in Bold above).
 
Lady B

Lady B

noob
loverOfTruth said:
But what happens if a believer in Christ doesn't do that (part in Bold above).
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Ok let me give you an example may I?
When Christ was crucified, his cross was one of 3, one man mocked Christ and said " hey if your the king of the Jews get us down from here" The man on the other side said " why do you feel your the same as him? He is innocent, no blame be on him, we are guilty" then he looked to Christ and said, "Please remember me before your Father", Christ in seeing this man's faith assured him that this day he will be with him in heaven. Even though the man had led a life of crime, in the end his faith was in Christ and was enough.

Some people have said in this forum what about Hitler, could he have been saved? Who are we to say what went on between him and God in his end days? If I saw Hitler in heaven I would not say, "ummm Hey God what were you thinking?"
 
L

loverOfTruth

Well-Known Member
savagewind said:
OK. MY God suffers no one unfairly. How about that? All the spirits are subject to restriction. No spirit exists that can constrain another spirit EXCEPT The Holy Spirit***. The Holy Spirit is Holy and guards continually The Holy One's holiness. To be not fair is not holy.


LOL I mean only The Holy Spirit has power to restrain another spirit.
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Holy Moly - say what ? ;) - that's another flavor of Christianity right there ...:cool:
 
savagewind

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Lady B said:
Ok let me give you an example may I?
When Christ was crucified, his cross was one of 3, one man mocked Christ and said " hey if your the king of the Jews get us down from here" The man on the other side said " why do you feel your the same as him? He is innocent, no blame be on him, we are guilty" then he looked to Christ and said, "Please remember me before your Father", Christ in seeing this man's faith assured him that this day he will be with him in heaven. Even though the man had led a life of crime, in the end his faith was in Christ and was enough.

Some people have said in this forum what about Hitler, could he have been saved? Who are we to say what went on between him and God in his end days? If I saw Hitler in heaven I would not say, "ummm Hey God what were you thinking?"
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Really?

I would think I was in hell. Have you even read about the holocaust Lady B?
 
Lady B

Lady B

noob
savagewind said:
Really?


Yes of course, I even wrote a thesis on it in college, I in no way am defending the man, I am saying people use him as the worst of all men and show that he could not possibly be saved. That is not God's view that is man's view. We do not know if in Hitlers last days or hours if he repented and knew Christ. Look at Paul, He killed Christians yet he was saved. So how can we know sure the heart of any man in his deathbed? Sure we know his life and can draw assumptions from it. But can we be absolutely 100 % positive God didn't show him mercy in the end? I sure can't.
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L

loverOfTruth

Well-Known Member
Lady B said:
Ok let me give you an example may I?
When Christ was crucified, his cross was one of 3, one man mocked Christ and said " hey if your the king of the Jews get us down from here" The man on the other side said " why do you feel your the same as him? He is innocent, no blame be on him, we are guilty" then he looked to Christ and said, "Please remember me before your Father", Christ in seeing this man's faith assured him that this day he will be with him in heaven. Even though the man had led a life of crime, in the end his faith was in Christ and was enough.

Some people have said in this forum what about Hitler, could he have been saved? Who are we to say what went on between him and God in his end days? If I saw Hitler in heaven I would not say, "ummm Hey God what were you thinking?"
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That's not what I was asking. I can understand that a good believer in Christ falls into sin and repents for salvation and is always grateful. My question is about a believer in Christ who doesn't care about repentance and good deeds and consistently sins intentionally - only believing salvation through Christ is True. Is that person going to be punished in Hell or not ? I am asking what's the general rule for that person in this case. We all know that God can show mercy/grace to anyone and there's no point speculating on what is going to happen to this person in the hereafter.
 
Lady B

Lady B

noob
loverOfTruth said:
That's not what I was asking. I can understand that a good believer in Christ falls into sin and repents for salvation and is always grateful. My question is about a believer in Christ who doesn't care about repentance and good deeds and consistently sins intentionally - only believing salvation through Christ is True. Is that person going to be punished in Hell or not ? I am asking what's the general rule for that person in this case. We all know that God can show mercy/grace to anyone and there's no point speculating on what is going to happen to this person in the hereafter.
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If a Man does not care of repentance and sins intentionally nor does he care of good deeds, I would surmise Christ is not in him at all.
 
savagewind

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Lady B said:
savagewind said:
Really?


Yes of course, I even wrote a thesis on it in college, I in no way am defending the man, I am saying people use him as the worst of all men and show that he could not possibly be saved. That is not God's view that is man's view. We do not know if in Hitlers last days or hours if he repented and knew Christ. Look at Paul, He killed Christians yet he was saved. So how can we know sure the heart of any man in his deathbed? Sure we know his life and can draw assumptions from it. But can we be absolutely 100 % positive God didn't show him mercy in the end? I sure can't.
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Paul did not kill anyone. He was approving of the killing. BIG difference.

Hitler and his men as good as killed God. There is no forgiveness for that. No need to worry about Hitler and his cronies showing up again anywhere imHUMBLEo.
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L

loverOfTruth

Well-Known Member
Lady B said:
If a Man does not care of repentance and sins intentionally nor does he care of good deeds, I would surmise Christ is not in him at all.
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Can you absolutely positively 100% say that for sure - have you opened his heart and seen what's in it ? I suspect that you cannot. So it is absolutely possible that someone believed that they will eventually get salvation through Christ yet they were weak enough to not have shunned sin and did not perform any good deeds. So you still have not answered as to what should as a general rule happen to him ?
 
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