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Is Jesus Christianity?

SeekingAllTruth

Well-Known Member
But again this is all your opinion, right Thomas? For example, Matthew says

"And so was fulfilled what the Lord had said through the prophet: “Out of Egypt I called my son.” Matthew 2:15.

So your opinion is that the Bible is right and and God did call Jesus out of Egypt. But Matthew pulls a sleight of hand. He doesn't give you the context of the whole verse which is from Hosea 11:1

"When Israel was a child, I loved him, and out of Egypt I called my son."

So we see that God wasn't referring to Jesus at all. He was referring to Israel. He calls Israel His son in this verse, not Jesus and called Israel out of Egypt when Moses led the Jews out of Egypt and into Canaan, right?
But then I can apply the verse metaphorically to just about anybody, can't I? It can apply it to Moses, to Joshua, in fact Joshua would be a better candidate than Jesus.

Scholars believe Matthew had Jesus going to Egypt specifically to add this Hosea verse to his gospel. Scholars recognize the probability of being able to safely get through Herod's territory on a mule with a baby in tow as being near zero. They recognize that Matthew was only trying to give credentials to Jesus as the Messiah and he could have pulled any passage out of the OT he wanted and then written something in reference to Jesus. "Let's see, Psalm 2 says, You will break them with a rod of iron; you will dash them to pieces like pottery.” I'll have Jesus go into a temple where merchants are selling pottery and have Jesus get furious and start breaking all their pots. Then I can say, 'Thus was fulfilled that which was spoken by the prophet, 'You will break them with a rod of iron; you will dash them to pieces.” "

Writing something to fit facts written earlier is the simplest con in the religion business. I visited Egypt once and came out to Israel. Anyone who visited Egypt and then traveled to Israel fulfilled Hosea 11:1.
 

SeekingAllTruth

Well-Known Member
I think earliest found is not necessary the same as earliest written. And I believe Gospel of John is really from the disciple of Jesus, as told in John 21:24. But, that is obviously a matter of belief. However, if we would know surely who wrote them, would it really make any meaningful difference to you?



Even if Jesus would be like a mirror, I think it could still be said that God lives in him, because God can be seen in him. However, I think God is more than a reflection, because He can have influence to the person.

Bible tells God is spirit and love. I think He could be compared to team spirit that affects on team members certain way.

God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.
John 4:24

He who doesn't love doesn't know God, for God is love.
1 John 4:8



They don’t remain in words of Jesus. they have replaced the teachings of Jesus by their own doctrines.

Jesus therefore said to those Jews who had believed him, "If you remain in my word, then you are truly my disciples. You will know the truth, and the truth will make you free."
John 8:31-32
It'd make a difference to me. If all the things Christians say about Jesus could be verified with FACTS I'd believe in Jesus again.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Out of touch with reality.

O People of the Book! Commit no excesses in your religion or utter anything concerning Allah but the truth. The Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, was only a messenger of Allah, His Word that He sent to Mary, and a Spirit from Him [that He sent]. So believe in Allah and His messengers, and do not say “Three.” Desist, it is better for you! Allah is one God.
The reality is that The Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, was only a messenger of Allah, and that is not anti-Christ.

To say that Jesus was a Messenger of God does not demote Jesus in any way. Christians believe that Jesus is somehow superior to all the other Messengers of God but beliefs do not comport with reality. The only logical reason Christians are compelled to believe that Jesus is superior is so they can feel superior, and unfortunately, that is exactly what comes across in conversations with Christians, as much as some try to hide it.

Christians believe they are better than everyone else because only they know the truth about God and the rest of the people in the world are just lost souls. I could never belong to such an arrogant religion and it is not the religion of Jesus; it is the religion of Christianity that veered far from the teachings of Jesus. Thank God I can believe in Jesus without having to be a Christian.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
It'd make a difference to me. If all the things Christians say about Jesus could be verified with FACTS I'd believe in Jesus again.
And I would not be a Baha'i if everything Baha'is say about Baha'u'llah could not be verified with facts about Him.
The very first thing I did when I heard about Baha'u'llah back in 1970 was pull out the Encyclopedia Britannica. ;)

And after I became a Baha'i I never had to worry about whether Jesus existed or what He did on His mission from God because Baha'u'llah verified that in no uncertain terms.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
The Bible is the only way to identify Christians. To help in identifying them, here are a few scriptures to narrow it down:
They worship the God Jehovah exclusively Mat 4:10

They do not war 2 Cor 10:3,4; 2 Tim 2:24

They preach the good news of the Kingdom of God Luke 4:43; Mat 28:19,20

They make God's name known Jn 17:26; 1 Pet 2:21

They live the faith 1 Jn 5:3; Mat 6:33

That should help in identifying true Christians.
But what about ALL the other scriptures? o_O
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Just disregard the book of revelation because it doesn't support your beliefs?

Daniel 2:44 ESV
And in the days of those kings the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that shall never be destroyed, nor shall the kingdom be left to another people. It shall break in pieces all these kingdoms and bring them to an end, and it shall stand forever.

Luke 11:2
And he said to them, “When you pray, say: “Father, hallowed be your name. Your kingdom come. Your will be done on earth as it is in Heaven..."

Zechariah 14:9
And the Lord will be king over all the earth. On that day the Lord will be one and his name one.

Revelation 5:10
And you have made them a kingdom and priests to our God, and they shall reign on the earth.”
I do not have to disregard the Book of Revelation or any of the Bible because all of the Bible supports my beliefs.

Apocalypse Secrets: Baha'i Interpretation of the Book of Revelation

This lovely book is an illustrated interpretation of the Book of Revelation based on Baha'i sources revealing the Apocalypse as the story of seven Faiths and Empires whose materialism and militarism have caused the mess the world is in, specifically the apocalyptic war now waging between the Muslim Militarism of the Middle East and the Malignant Materialism of the Christian West. Its strikingly lively translation sticks to the intention of the Greek original. The original, rationally consistent, remarkably holistic, and comprehensively profound interpretation bridges religious faiths, transcends religious dogma, and explains nineteen centuries of troubled events in Christianity and Islam with clear insight. It supplies a template of understanding and global peace that will influence many future works. This book is must reading for anybody striving to penetrate the hidden secrets of the Apocalypse. Its readers will never look at the Apocalypse the same again.

All the verses about the future Kingdom of God on earth refer to the Kingdom that will be built by humans as the result of the Coming of Baha'u'llah who laid out all the blueprint instructions that will be necessary to build that Kingdom.

Zechariah 14:9 refers to Baha'u'llah, not Jesus, as Jesus never claimed to be a King. Jesus denied that when He explained exactly why He came into the world.

John 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

John 18:37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.

These two verses in John 18 completely negate that Jesus is the King of this world or that Jesus will ever come to this world to rule it, and they fit perfectly together with John 17:4 and John 17:11. Jesus came into this world to bear witness unto the truth about God. He did that so there is no more reason for Jesus to come back to this world again. That is why Jesus said “I am no more in the world.”
 

Colt

Well-Known Member
The reality is that The Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, was only a messenger of Allah, and that is not anti-Christ.

To say that Jesus was a Messenger of God does not demote Jesus in any way. Christians believe that Jesus is somehow superior to all the other Messengers of God but beliefs do not comport with reality. The only logical reason Christians are compelled to believe that Jesus is superior is so they can feel superior, and unfortunately, that is exactly what comes across in conversations with Christians, as much as some try to hide it.

Christians believe they are better than everyone else because only they know the truth about God and the rest of the people in the world are just lost souls. I could never belong to such an arrogant religion and it is not the religion of Jesus; it is the religion of Christianity that veered far from the teachings of Jesus. Thank God I can believe in Jesus without having to be a Christian.
I see, you have a chip on your shoulder, an inferiority complex. That's your own problem to solve.

The Son of God who incarnate from heaven and revealed his Father, was also a revelation about his own identity and office. Returning to heaven and invested with all power and authority he is to all intents and purposes God to us. Its up to you, you can reject him and therefor his Father also.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
There is nothing wrong with interpreting prophecy in a metaphorical way.
So you do not believe like most Christians that the same man Jesus is going to come down from heaven in the physical clouds in the sky accompanied by trumpets and angels at which time every eye will see Him?

Revelation 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.

Matthew 24:30-31 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
 
I do not have to disregard the Book of Revelation or any of the Bible because all of the Bible supports my beliefs.

Apocalypse Secrets: Baha'i Interpretation of the Book of Revelation

This lovely book is an illustrated interpretation of the Book of Revelation based on Baha'i sources revealing the Apocalypse as the story of seven Faiths and Empires whose materialism and militarism have caused the mess the world is in, specifically the apocalyptic war now waging between the Muslim Militarism of the Middle East and the Malignant Materialism of the Christian West. Its strikingly lively translation sticks to the intention of the Greek original. The original, rationally consistent, remarkably holistic, and comprehensively profound interpretation bridges religious faiths, transcends religious dogma, and explains nineteen centuries of troubled events in Christianity and Islam with clear insight. It supplies a template of understanding and global peace that will influence many future works. This book is must reading for anybody striving to penetrate the hidden secrets of the Apocalypse. Its readers will never look at the Apocalypse the same again.

All the verses about the future Kingdom of God on earth refer to the Kingdom that will be built by humans as the result of the Coming of Baha'u'llah who laid out all the blueprint instructions that will be necessary to build that Kingdom.

Zechariah 14:9 refers to Baha'u'llah, not Jesus, as Jesus never claimed to be a King. Jesus denied that when He explained exactly why He came into the world.

John 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

John 18:37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.

These two verses in John 18 completely negate that Jesus is the King of this world or that Jesus will ever come to this world to rule it, and they fit perfectly together with John 17:4 and John 17:11. Jesus came into this world to bear witness unto the truth about God. He did that so there is no more reason for Jesus to come back to this world again. That is why Jesus said “I am no more in the world.”
You don't actually read the Bible because if you did you'd know it says God will set up a kingdom on earth and Jesus will be the King. But sure keep listening to whatever Baháʼu'lláh tells you.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
I see, you have a chip on your shoulder, an inferiority complex. That's your own problem to solve.
I do not have an inferiority complex, I just do not have a superiority complex.
The Son of God who incarnate from heaven and revealed his Father, was also a revelation about his own identity and office. Returning to heaven and invested with all power and authority he is to all intents and purposes God to us. Its up to you, you can reject him and therefor his Father also.
I do not reject Jesus. I agree with everything you just said and I agree with most of what Christians say about Jesus, because for all intents and purposes Jesus is God since He manifested all the attributes and of God in the world. But Jesus was also a Messenger of God because He brought a message from God, and Jesus was also a Servant of God since He served God, and Jesus was also the Voice of God since He spoke for God.

“Were any of the all-embracing Manifestations of God to declare: “I am God,” He, verily, speaketh the truth, and no doubt attacheth thereto. For it hath been repeatedly demonstrated that through their Revelation, their attributes and names, the Revelation of God, His names and His attributes, are made manifest in the world....... And were any of them to voice the utterance, “I am the Messenger of God,” He, also, speaketh the truth, the indubitable truth ..........For they are all but one person, one soul, one spirit, one being, one revelation. They are all the manifestation of the “Beginning” and the “End,” the “First” and the “Last,” the “Seen” and the “Hidden”—all of which pertain to Him Who is the Innermost Spirit of Spirits and Eternal Essence of Essences. And were they to say, “We are the Servants of God,” this also is a manifest and indisputable fact. For they have been made manifest in the uttermost state of servitude, a servitude the like of which no man can possibly attain. Thus in moments in which these Essences of Being were deep immersed beneath the oceans of ancient and everlasting holiness, or when they soared to the loftiest summits of Divine mysteries, they claimed their utterances to be the Voice of Divinity, the Call of God Himself.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 54-55

The only thing I disagree with is the Christian belief that the same man Jesus is going to return from heaven and come to earth in the flesh as He came from heaven to earth the first time and build a Kingdom on earth. That is an untenable belief because it is in no way supported by the Bible.

Baha'is believe that Jesus reigns on His Eternal Throne in heaven where He will reign forever.

Luke 1:32 He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:

“The Throne upon which He sat is the Eternal Throne from which Christ reigns for ever, a heavenly throne, not an earthly one, for the things of earth pass away but heavenly things pass not away. He re-interpreted and completed the Law of Moses and fulfilled the Law of the Prophets. His word conquered the East and the West. His Kingdom is everlasting.” Abdu'l-Baha, Paris Talks
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
You don't actually read the Bible because if you did you'd know it says God will set up a kingdom on earth and Jesus will be the King. But sure keep listening to whatever Baháʼu'lláh tells you.
Baha'u'llah did not tell me anything, I did my own Bible research.

Talk is cheap. Please cite any and all verses that say that God will set up a kingdom on earth and Jesus will be the King.
Then I will explain what I believe those verses mean.

I am not the one who is claiming that God will set up a kingdom on earth and Jesus will be the King, you are, so you bear the burden of proof.
 

Colt

Well-Known Member
I do not have an inferiority complex, I just do not have a superiority complex.

I do not reject Jesus. I agree with everything you just said and I agree with most of what Christians say about Jesus, because for all intents and purposes Jesus is God since He manifested all the attributes and of God in the world. But Jesus was also a Messenger of God because He brought a message from God, and Jesus was also a Servant of God since He served God, and Jesus was also the Voice of God since He spoke for God.

“Were any of the all-embracing Manifestations of God to declare: “I am God,” He, verily, speaketh the truth, and no doubt attacheth thereto. For it hath been repeatedly demonstrated that through their Revelation, their attributes and names, the Revelation of God, His names and His attributes, are made manifest in the world....... And were any of them to voice the utterance, “I am the Messenger of God,” He, also, speaketh the truth, the indubitable truth ..........For they are all but one person, one soul, one spirit, one being, one revelation. They are all the manifestation of the “Beginning” and the “End,” the “First” and the “Last,” the “Seen” and the “Hidden”—all of which pertain to Him Who is the Innermost Spirit of Spirits and Eternal Essence of Essences. And were they to say, “We are the Servants of God,” this also is a manifest and indisputable fact. For they have been made manifest in the uttermost state of servitude, a servitude the like of which no man can possibly attain. Thus in moments in which these Essences of Being were deep immersed beneath the oceans of ancient and everlasting holiness, or when they soared to the loftiest summits of Divine mysteries, they claimed their utterances to be the Voice of Divinity, the Call of God Himself.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 54-55

The only thing I disagree with is the Christian belief that the same man Jesus is going to return from heaven and come to earth in the flesh as He came from heaven to earth the first time and build a Kingdom on earth. That is an untenable belief because it is in no way supported by the Bible.

Baha'is believe that Jesus reigns on His Eternal Throne in heaven where He will reign forever.

Luke 1:32 He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:

“The Throne upon which He sat is the Eternal Throne from which Christ reigns for ever, a heavenly throne, not an earthly one, for the things of earth pass away but heavenly things pass not away. He re-interpreted and completed the Law of Moses and fulfilled the Law of the Prophets. His word conquered the East and the West. His Kingdom is everlasting.” Abdu'l-Baha, Paris Talks
Jesus taught a spiritual kingdom of believers.
Jesus founded the spiritual kingdom while on earth .The original Gospel of the kingdom slumbers currently in Christiandoms institutional stagnation.

Jesus knew that the kingdom would take long ages to come to fruition, that mankind must first become dissatisfied with its secularism and worldliness after which we will become more thirsty for the fruits of the Kingdom.

He did promises to return but just for a visit, this isn’t Jesus’ permanent home.
 
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Trailblazer

Veteran Member
I think earliest found is not necessary the same as earliest written. And I believe Gospel of John is really from the disciple of Jesus, as told in John 21:24. But, that is obviously a matter of belief. However, if we would know surely who wrote them, would it really make any meaningful difference to you?
I have read John 21 more than once, but I never really noticed that verse, so thanks for pointing that out. I definitely believe everything that is recorded in the Gospel of John although I interpret some of it differently than Christians. My belief that it is accurate is further confirmed by what the Guardian of the Baha’i Faith wrote to an individual believer:

...we cannot be sure how much or how little of the four Gospels are accurate and include the words of Christ and His undiluted teachings, all we can be sure of, as Bahá'ís, is that what has been quoted by Bahá'u'lláh and the Master must be absolutely authentic. As many times passages in the Gospel of St. John are quoted we may assume that it is his Gospel and much of it accurate.
(23 January 1944 to an individual believer)


The Bible: Extracts on the Old and New Testaments
(From Letters Written on Behalf of the Guardian)

It might make a difference if I knew that the disciples wrote the gospels, if that could ever be proven but it would not make a big difference, since as noted below Baha’is believe that the essence, or essential elements, of what Jesus intended to convey has been recorded and preserved in the New Testament.

The Bahá'ís believe what is in the Bible to be true in substance. This does not mean that every word recorded in that Book is to be taken literally and treated as the authentic saying of a Prophet....

The Bahá'ís believe that God's Revelation is under His care and protection and that the essence, or essential elements, of what His Manifestations intended to convey has been recorded and preserved in Their Holy Books. However, as the sayings of the ancient Prophets were written down some time later, we cannot categorically state, as we do in the case of the Writings of Bahá'u'lláh, that the words and phrases attributed to Them are Their exact words
(9 August 1984 to an individual believer)


The Bible: Extracts on the Old and New Testaments
(From letters written on behalf of the Universal House of Justice)
Even if Jesus would be like a mirror, I think it could still be said that God lives in him, because God can be seen in him. However, I think God is more than a reflection, because He can have influence to the person.
Yes, I think it can be said that God lives in Jesus, but metaphorically, not literally, because obviously God cannot be contained in any human body. Moreover, God is more than a reflection because he directly influences the person.

I believe that it can be said that God lives in our hearts in a metaphorical sense, but not in a literal sense. I just recalled what Baha’u’llah wrote about God living in our heart:

“That the heart is the throne, in which the Revelation of God the All-Merciful is centered, is attested by the holy utterances which We have formerly revealed.

Among them is this saying: “Earth and heaven cannot contain Me; what can alone contain Me is the heart of him that believeth in Me, and is faithful to My Cause.” How often hath the human heart, which is the recipient of the light of God and the seat of the revelation of the All-Merciful, erred from Him Who is the Source of that light and the Well Spring of that revelation. It is the waywardness of the heart that removeth it far from God, and condemneth it to remoteness from Him. Those hearts, however, that are aware of His Presence, are close to Him, and are to be regarded as having drawn nigh unto His throne.”
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 186

Bible tells God is spirit and love. I think He could be compared to team spirit that affects on team members certain way.

God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.
John 4:24

He who doesn't love doesn't know God, for God is love.
1 John 4:8
Yes, I can agree that God is spirit and love, even though I often have difficulty connecting to God and feeling that love.
They don’t remain in words of Jesus. They have replaced the teachings of Jesus by their own doctrines.

Jesus therefore said to those Jews who had believed him, "If you remain in my word, then you are truly my disciples. You will know the truth, and the truth will make you free."
John 8:31-32
Well, I fully agree with you on that, as I believe that Christian doctrines have replaced and even usurped the teachings of Jesus and in that sense Christians have strayed far from the truth that Jesus revealed which was recorded in the New Testament, as Baha’u’llah explained below:

“Certain traditions of bygone ages rest on no foundations whatever, while the notions entertained by past generations, and which they have recorded in their books, have, for the most part, been influenced by the desires of a corrupt inclination. Thou dost witness how most of the commentaries and interpretations of the words of God, now current amongst men, are devoid of truth.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 171-172
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Jesus taught a spiritual kingdom of believers.
Jesus founded the spiritual kingdom while on earth
That is what I believe, that Jesus laid the foundation for the spiritual kingdom on earth, as explained in this excerpt from a chapter entitled Jesus Christ, Herald of the Kingdom.

“Jesus created a power of perceiving God which was new, and in order that it might operate clearly, had to cleanse the spirit of man from all worldly encumbrances. Virtue becomes detachment from the world, sin attachment to it. Jesus demanded this sacrifice — losing the life of the world for the life of the spirit, but He made God so attractive, so joyous, loving, powerful, that the Christian was ready to abandon all for Him, and for Christ Who revealed Him.

Thus the tremendous and fearsome Deity of the Old Testament wins men's hearts in the New. We read of the poor sparrow whose fall was watched by a loving Father, of the flower of the field and the bird of the air, and the tenderest stories that ever have won men's hearts — the prodigal son and the good Samaritan.

A new quality of love now characterizes the Kingdom, a love which united the believers not only with God, but with each other, and even extended to enemies and "them that hate you." "That ye love one another" became the test of Christian discipleship.

The supreme ideal of this love was, as shown in John, the relationship between Christ and the Father, and though revealed in the most simple language and the plainest words, stands as the highest expression of Divine love in scripture.

The result was that Jesus' teachings let loose upon the soul and heart of man a spiritual power such as never had been known in the world before. Historians have said that Jesus' teaching has done more to elevate human nature and civilization than all the laws of legislators and the disquisitions of philosophers combined. By releasing religious energies measured to the needs of the hour and the people, He opened the way to the Kingdom of God in men's hearts. New affections and aspirations, hopes and loyalties were brought into being and the whole moral world was carried into a state of flux.”
Jesus knew that the kingdom would take long ages to come to fruition, that mankind must first become dissatisfied with its secularism and worldliness after which we will become more thirsty for the fruits of the Kingdom.
Indeed, I am sure that Jesus knew that, and that is exactly what has happened. ;)
 
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SeekingAllTruth

Well-Known Member
Jesus taught a spiritual kingdom of believers.
Jesus founded the spiritual kingdom while on earth .The original Gospel of the kingdom slumbers currently in Christiandoms institutional stagnation.

Jesus knew that the kingdom would take long ages to come to fruition, that mankind must first become dissatisfied with its secularism and worldliness after which we will become more thirsty for the fruits of the Kingdom.

He did promises to return but just for a visit, this isn’t Jesus’ permanent home.
Ahhh, the beauty of having the freedom of interpreting scripture however one chooses. That's what I love about religion.
 

Colt

Well-Known Member
Ahhh, the beauty of having the freedom of interpreting scripture however one chooses. That's what I love about religion.
Jesus said, "My kingdom is not of this world. If it were, my servants would fight to prevent my arrest by the Jewish leaders. But now my kingdom is from another place."

Jesus spent 3+ years teaching the same theme, the Gospel of the Kingdom of Heaven.

That’s not an interpretation, it’s a fact.


Jesus Begins His Ministry

12 Now when Jesus heard that John had been taken into custody, He withdrew into Galilee; 13 and leaving Nazareth, He came and settled in Capernaum, which is by the sea, in the region of Zebulun and Naphtali. 14 This was to fulfill what was spoken through Isaiah the prophet:
15
“The land of Zebulun and the land of Naphtali,
(e)By the way of the sea, beyond the Jordan, Galilee of the (f)Gentiles—
16
“The people who were sitting in darkness saw a great Light,
And those who were sitting in the land and shadow of death,
Upon them a Light dawned.”

17 From that time Jesus began to (g)preach and say, “Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.”




Matthew 4:23-24

23Jesus went throughout Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing every disease and sickness among the people. 24News about Him spread all over Syria, and people brought to Him all who were ill with various diseases, those suffering acute pain, the demon-possessed, those having seizures, and the paralyzed—and He healed them.
 
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capumetu

Active Member
But what about ALL the other scriptures? o_O

Of course not all scriptures are meant to identify the people of God, I gave you a few to help, there are many more which identify God's people.

You do realize that if God didn't identify the path, then obviously no one could be held accountable, correct?
 

1213

Well-Known Member
...Yes, I think it can be said that God lives in Jesus, but metaphorically, not literally, because obviously God cannot be contained in any human body... ...I believe that it can be said that God lives in our hearts in a metaphorical sense, but not in a literal sense. ...

It is an interesting question, what people think God living in person means literally. However, Bible tells, people are God’s temple (Romans 8:11, 1 Corinthians 3:16), and I believe what the Bible tells.

...Yes, I can agree that God is spirit and love, even though I often have difficulty connecting to God and feeling that love...

I don’t think love is a feeling, in the Bible. It is spirit and spirit is more like an caring attitude. What people commonly call love, is in my opinion really more like attachment, or desire.
 

1213

Well-Known Member
It'd make a difference to me. If all the things Christians say about Jesus could be verified with FACTS I'd believe in Jesus again.

Why it would be useful? In Biblical point of view, eternal life is promised for righteous. That is more than believing Jesus is real.

These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
Mat. 25:46

For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Romans 6:23

I don’t think knowing Jesus is real makes anyone righteous, which is why I think that knowledge is not necessary.
 
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