How are these Great Beings explained?

[Unveiled Artist]

@loverofhumanity

Again I have to read all of your posts. I can't remember and make my points in a long post so I have to separate them so I can each part of the posts individually. That, and it is better because I can address all your points. I'm trying to figure out a better way to do it because I have many questions and many points but it's unrealistic to expect you to answer them all.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Refuse? We just have different options. No one refuses to follow one religion and not another (if they don't have any bad qualms about their former religion). "I like both red and orange; and, if I had the choice I would choose red." I didn't refuse it. It's not something offered to me that I will have a consequence for if I don't take the offer. Rusal is a confrontational word in this context and abrahamic mindset.

With the diversity, abrahamic god-religions don't define diversity the way other religions do. You accept diversity under specific conditions. Diversity doesn't work that way. God sets up conditions. If you don't follow those conditions, you lose out on what he offers. You can make it sound less harsh by saying "we have a choice" but the harsh reality is that without making the choice for god, from a god-religion (abrahamic) point of view, we lose out.

I don't have a god that defines me and the love I have. It's not defined by god and any god thereof. So, by default, I would lose out if your god offered me a hand and I did not take it. (Not refuse just chose not to take it)

Think about it. How is that good that I refused god's hand?

If god was for diversity, why would he set up conditions that when broken, we would not have the benefit he is suppose to give?

Plus, I honestly can't see the fact that god is the foundation of a god-less religion regardless of what you believe. People believe a lot of things about others. Unless they ask the person directly with confirmation, it's just their opinion. Regardless of who they are prophet or not.

You would not necessarily lose out even if you chose not to take God's Hand because in the end He may cinsuder you, in His Eyes, more worthy than me.

So you cant just assume that because I'm a Baha'i and you are not you won't be blessed or go to heaven so to speak. I may go to hell and you may go to heaven if Gid us happier with you than me.

I should have used the word choice and not refusal but if I'm in the habit and I do use it again, I really mean choice. I'm terrible st posting aren't I? Apologies.

Ok. Let's imagine there's a God that created you and me. He considers you as every bit His child as He dies myself regardless of whether you believe in Him or not. The sun shines on everybody as fires the rain also fall on everyone. God does not discriminate.

Can you explain which benefit and which conditions, perhaps an example of what you're speaking about .......

If god was for diversity, why would he set up conditions that when broken, we would not have the benefit he is suppose to give?

I don't believe you lose out. I am in the same boat as you.

I have no guarantees that I'm saved or my sinscare firgiven and so on. I will be judged in my deeds and life I lived not on what I claim to believe in.

You will very likely be richly rewarded for using the talents given to you.

 

[loverofhumanity]

I'm reflecting on your first posts. The rest of them are repeats and quotes from Bahaullah. You said that people haven't accept Bahaullah's teachings. People add to doctrines and wars are caused because of it.

If not, how can greater peace happen if you didn't believe it could happen without the teachings of Bahaullah?

Also, again I asked before. If greater peace does not depend on a single religion, why follow Bahai or any religion for that matter?

World Peace can happen either of two ways without the Baha'is.

1. The leaders of the world voluntarily decide to form a coalition of peace and bury their differences
2. We have WW3 and as a result then choose peace or even an economic collapse we don't know.

There are two peaces we refer to.

1. The Lesser Peace which people will establish without the Baha'is will be the abolishment of war and the political,unification of governments. It will improve life substantially as monies used for war will be invested into people and things such as education, employment and Medicare.

2 The Most Great Peace is the brotherhoods of man when the world will have accepted the Bahá'í Faith and will be governed by the Bahá'í system. All religions will become one united religion.
But this Most Great Peace is dependent on the people. If humanity never accepts Baha'u'llah then it won't happen. But there will still be peace.

Why follow Bahá'í? Because I want to see universal brotherhood and not just a political unity.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Go back over. I think you accidently forgot the close a quote.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

2 The Most Great Peace is the brotherhoods of man when the world will have accepted the Bahá'í Faith and will be governed by the Bahá'í system. All religions will become one united religion.

Oh my gosh. You already told me about greater and lesser world peace.

The bolded is not respecting diversity. Period.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Yes, absolutely. Dogma. That and egocentricity.

Ok that's understandable as it's something humanity has never had before and we tend to reject things that are new and untested so your skepticism is justified.

 

[loverofhumanity]

No. You didn't answer the question. Humanity as in human beings?

Race, religion, belief, culture, custom, language, and nationality shapes humanity. What is humanity without these things?

We're just people.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Oh my gosh. You already told me about greater and lesser world peace.

The bolded is not respecting diversity. Period.

Yes it is because I stressed it's people's decision to ours.

If tomorrow the entire world decided they wanted Baha'u'llah's Word Order that is their right to choose is it not?

If you decide you want to eat out tomorrow night why is that disrespectful? You may choose to eat at home or eat outlandish. That's your decision.

Never Baha'is nor anyone can tell humanity what to do, if humanity decides they don't want Baha'u'llah ever then we respect their decision right? Of course we do. And if they decide they all want to become one religion then we respect their decision don't we? Of course.

It is up to the people to decide who they want and who they don't want just like in one of your elections. Freedom of choice must be respected by all Bahá'í or not.

It would not be disrespectful if the entire world themselves CHOSE to follow Baha'u'llah

 

[Unveiled Artist]

We're just people.

That does not mean anything outside of race, nationality, culture, language, and religion.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Haha. This one is a great example. The end of the world was supposed to happen in 1999. Prince predicted it. People actually bought survival food. Bible comments and shows were on the air constantly. Every other person talked about the world ending. No exaggeration.

Yes but Baha'u'llah has appeared and so has a new age of humanity spawned simultaneously.

It's not a bogus occurrence. With Baha'u'llah's Revelation came international air travel, world communications such as the internet and mobile phones, computers, cars, electricity, television and every modern technology such as space flight and such.

The bottom line is Baha'u'llah came with a Revelation to unite humanity so the sciences and technology has been brought into existence to be able to accomplish that.

Imagine that when Baha'u'llah said that the world is but one country and mankind it's citizens if world communication never happened? No internet, no air planes, no phones etc. How would it make His 'world vision' look like if the technologies and sciences never came about to make it possible?

But they did happen. All the technologies and sciences have served Baha'u'llah's Words stunningly by turning this world into a global village proving His Words are not empty platitudes but a living Reality relevant to today's needs.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Yes it is because I stressed it's people's decision to ours.

If tomorrow the entire world decided they wanted Baha'u'llah's Word Order that is their right to choose is it not?

If you decide you want to eat out tomorrow night why is that disrespectful? You may choose to eat at home or eat outlandish. That's your decision.

Never Baha'is nor anyone can tell humanity what to do, if humanity decides they don't want Baha'u'llah ever then we respect their decision right? Of course we do. And if they decide they all want to become one religion run we respect their decision don't we? Of course.

It is up to the people to decide who they want and who they don't want just like in one of your elections. Freedom of choice must be respected by all Bahá'í or not.

It would not be disrespectful if the entire world themselves CHOSE to follow Baha'u'llah

Does greater peace depend on Bahaullah's teachings?

Bahaullah as in does god need to be the foundation to make greater peace? (not lesser, greater)

Abrahamic god-religions, again, define "choice" differently than other religions do. There is always a disbenefit (or in some religions consequence) for not choosing god. In other religions, choice does not have a "peace or no peace" black and white view.

It's a cultural outlook about black and white thinking. Nothing wrong with it, you jjust don't see it.

 

[loverofhumanity]

That does not mean anything outside of race, nationality, culture, language, and religion.

You may put in another way.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Also, why does Bahaullah talk in thees and thous. It reminds me of King James but not familiar with the history behind that language. It confuses the mess out of me.

Baha'u'llah spoke and wrote in Persian and Arabic. His Grandson, the Guardian of the Cause, Shoghi Effendi went to University in England to learn English to translate the writings. Shoghi Effendi achieved high honors in English and chose the King James style as the best rendering possible in English of both Persian an Arabic.

Be well, be happy Regards Tony.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Yes but Baha'u'llah has appeared and so has a new age of humanity spawned simultaneously.

It's not a bogus occurrence. With Baha'u'llah's Revelation came international air travel, world communications such as the internet and mobile phones, computers, cars, electricity, television and every modern technology such as space flight and such.

The bottom line is Baha'u'llah came with a Revelation to unite humanity so the sciences and technology has been brought into existence to be able to accomplish that.

Imagine that when Baha'u'llah said that the world is but one country and mankind it's citizens if world communication never happened? No internet, no air planes, no phones etc. How would it make His 'world vision' look like if the technologies and sciences never came about to make it possible?

But they did happen. All the technologies and sciences have served Baha'u'llah's Words stunningly by turning this world into a global village proving His Words are not empty platitudes but a living Reality relevant to today's needs.

You don't need Bahaullah to know this?

You don't need his prophecies to know this? and why would his prophecies matter if they are valid or not?

 

[Unveiled Artist]

You may put in another way.

No. One is without religion, culture, and tradition. The other statement says the opposite.

Differences of opinion are not confrontational. They don't cause divisions. See the differences as a blessing. We don't all cause wars because of divisions in our beliefs.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Haha. This one is a great example. The end of the world was supposed to happen in 1999. Prince predicted it. People actually bought survival food. Bible comments and shows were on the air constantly. Every other person talked about the world ending. No exaggeration.

Instead of laughing, you could ask how it was fulfilled. Stands to reason if it is the Truth many explanations would be available. (Laughing is great medicine though) Ha Ha

Again the Bible does not say end of the world, it states it is the end of an era. It is obvious that with great change since the mid 1800's, that something indeed has happened.

Regards Tony

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Instead of laughing, you could ask how it was fulfilled. Stands to reason if it is the Truth many explanations would be available.

Again the Bible does not say end of the world, it states it is the end of an era. It is obvious that with great change since the mid 1800's, that something indeed has happened.

Regards Tony

It is true. People actually thought the end of the world would happen. They said it was based on biblical teachings. The bible isn't an authority over my life nor is it inspirational to me. So, the wave of "armageddon" was interesting to see nonetheless the movie as well.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Where did you read this? According to Adrian, your prophet, his son, and his grandson said very little about Hinduism at all. In my searching I have found nothing at all.

Most Hindus simply don't want to share out of respect for the other religion, and in order to not cause confusion, and I somehow don't think we'd be listening to a Baha'i's advice on it. That's rather condescending, isn't it? You're now in a position to advise me? When did I ask for your advice?

It's a question someone asked Baha'u'llah directly about some practices of Hinduism on conversion.

I'm not advising you just sharing with you some comments made by Baha'u'llah Himself about Hindu practices. He spoke about some other Hindu things too.

I read it in an official translation of some of His Writings. I didn't quote it because you don't like quotes but He did mention other things about Hinduism as well in response to questions asked.

 

[Vinayaka]

Ok that's understandable as it's something humanity has never had before and we tend to reject things that are new and untested so your skepticism is justified.

This is a perfect example of what I meant when you criticise others but can't see it in yourselves. Very little about Baha'i' is new and untested. It's not a major shift from previous Abrahamic faiths. The name of the prophet has changed, but infalliblity, etc. is the same old same old.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

It is true. People actually thought the end of the world would happen. They said it was based on biblical teachings. The bible isn't an authority over my life nor is it inspirational to me. So, the wave of "armageddon" was interesting to see nonetheless the movie as well.

Yes this was the expectation. the expectation got the date right but got the signs wrong. We do not live in the mid 1800's, if we had done so, we too, if we were spiritually inclined, would have been caught up in the expectations that the world was moving towards a big event.

Many, many people of many, many Faiths arose at this time to preach messages of renewal. This is all in the History books now and it will take justice to search and find this was a fact, not fiction.

But that is for you to decide, we can only offer what we have found in our search to assist others that do want to know if it is true or not true.

Regards Tony