Horses have rights..............

[jonny]

If the rodeo is abuse for anyone, I'd say its the cowboys. All the animals left the arena just fine. It was the cowboys who were taken to the hospital in ambulances (two in the rodeo I went to last week) and limping out of the arena.

 

[kreeden]

If the rodeo is abuse for anyone, I'd say its the cowboys. All the animals left the arena just fine. It was the cowboys who were taken to the hospital in ambulances (two in the rodeo I went to last week) and limping out of the arena.

I was just about to say that . Cowboys are strange people . Most Bullrides I know are quite proud of the fact that they are unlikely to ever produce off-spring ....

 

[michel]

Horses have just as much rights as they ask for. In writing.

Wow; would you say the same to an illeterate, deaf and dumb human?

 

[Hope]

I think with the technology we have now, putting down a horse every time a leg is broken is quite unnecessary. If we have the technology to save them after we've used them for our own whims, we should do so.Can the same be said of fetuses, people in comas, etc?

I understand what you are saying, but the fact is, horses aren't people, and a leg getting broken on a horse is far different than a leg getting broken on a human. Horses, obviously, are much bigger, for one thing, and putting one in a wheelchair or on bedrest for several weeks so the bone can heal is an impossibility. They are almost constantly on their feet----they even sleep on their feet. So, unless one has massive amounts of money to use all that technology to keep the injured horse stabilized for a long period of time ( and stabilizing a horse is a major task---not quite the same as stabilizing a human or other smaller animal ), it is actually in the best interest of the horse to put it down. If it isn't stabilized, it will only reinjure its leg, the leg will never heal, and the horse will be in excruciating pain. And racehorses aren't the only horses who suffer leg injuries----any horse can, in various ways, and if it is a bone injury, the horse will most likely be put down. That's the other thing----not all leg injuries to horses require that they be put down. Severe bone injuries are usually the ones that are life-threatening.

Believe me, as a horse lover, I don't like the fact that horses have to be put down any more than anyone else----it saddens me greatly that such a method has to be employed. But, I'd rather them be pain-free than anything else.

 

[Hope]

FYI- Barbaro wasn't put down since they can breed him and make $$$$$ selling his offspring. (biggest win since Secratariat means selling power)

Yeah, I realize that---though in the article I posted above, they said they weren't 100% certain he would be physically able to breed. They're obviously hoping he can, but due to the extent of his injuries, they're not sure.

 

[Valjean]

If the rodeo is abuse for anyone, I'd say its the cowboys. All the animals left the arena just fine. It was the cowboys who were taken to the hospital in ambulances (two in the rodeo I went to last week) and limping out of the arena.

The difference is, the animals didn't choose to participate in the spectacle, and, as I'm sure you're aware, injuries to amimals aren't uncommon, and some of those that left the arena "just fine" were clearly brutalized.

 

[jonny]

The difference is, the animals didn't choose to participate in the spectacle, and, as I'm sure you're aware, injuries to amimals aren't uncommon, and some of those that left the arena "just fine" were clearly brutalized.

I didn't realize you were at the rodeo with me?!?

I didn't see any animals "clearly brutalized." In fact, the animals looked just fine to me and we were sitting right next to their pens.

 

[Valjean]

A panicked calf is roped, painfully jerked to a halt by a noose around its neck, then thrown to the ground by a cowboy wrenching its neck, and tied up.

This does not sound like fun for the calf.

The bucking horses and bulls are not bucking just to dislodge the rider. They're bucking because a buck strap was pulled tightly over a "sensitive area" of their flank as they left the chute, often as not they are hit with an electric prod as well.

Did you miss this part?

 

[jamaesi]

I have an American Mustang who has saved my life. Another horse had me cornered in the barn and turned to kick me- when she ran in from nowhere, got between us, kicked the offending horse to the ground, and guided me to the safety of the gate.

She's my best friend and we trust each other without any reservations. She'll follow me anywhere- even in situtations horses would avoid like opengrate bridges- and I trust her to protect and guide and carry me. When something scares her I can just hold on to her muzzle and tell her softly to whoa and she'll immediately stop spooking and calm and wait for me to give her further guidance.

She came to me after living for in the wild in the mountains of Neveda for two years and in just a few days she would let me do anything to her,groom, lead, and saddle, and would follow me like a rather large hooved puppy.


Why doesnt she deserve "rights"? The right to being protected and taken care of and not abused and not exploited for a few chuckles and amusement isn't that much for those with "superiour" intellect and thumbs to grant on these lowly, stupid beasts.



It sickens me when people treat these animals like playthings that can be slaughtered when no longer "useful" or profitable.

 

[Bastet]

I have an American Mustang who has saved my life. Another horse had me cornered in the barn and turned to kick me- when she ran in from nowhere, got between us, kicked the offending horse to the ground, and guided me to the safety of the gate.

She's my best friend and we trust each other without any reservations. She'll follow me anywhere- even in situtations horses would avoid like opengrate bridges- and I trust her to protect and guide and carry me. When something scares her I can just hold on to her muzzle and tell her softly to whoa and she'll immediately stop spooking and calm and wait for me to give her further guidance.

She came to me after living for in the wild in the mountains of Neveda for two years and in just a few days she would let me do anything to her,groom, lead, and saddle, and would follow me like a rather large hooved puppy.


Why doesnt she deserve "rights"? The right to being protected and taken care of and not abused and not exploited for a few chuckles and amusement isn't that much for those with "superiour" intellect and thumbs to grant on these lowly, stupid beasts.



It sickens me when people treat these animals like playthings that can be slaughtered when no longer "useful" or profitable.

That's beautiful, Jamaesi. I had a relationship very much like that with one of my horses when I was a teenager.

So, tell me - if your horse badly broke her leg such that if it healed at all, she would be in pain for the rest of her life, what would you do?

 

[jonny]

A panicked calf is roped, painfully jerked to a halt by a noose around its neck, then thrown to the ground by a cowboy wrenching its neck, and tied up.

This does not sound like fun for the calf.

The bucking horses and bulls are not bucking just to dislodge the rider. They're bucking because a buck strap was pulled tightly over a "sensitive area" of their flank as they left the chute, often as not they are hit with an electric prod as well.

Did you miss this part?

Yeah, actually I did. You're obviously misinformed and don't know what you're talking about. :sorry1: :run:

 

[jonny]

*IF* there is anything close to "animal cruelty" at the Rodeo, the only thing that would fit into that category is the calf roping. The calf is not "panicked." It runs out of the chute with a head start when the gate is opened. He does rope the calf around the neck, but he doesn't throw it to the ground by "wrenching its neck." (did you get your descriptions of these events from PETA?). The calf is tied up for about six seconds and then it gets up and walks away.

The bucking broncos and bulls "buck strap" (actually called a flank strap) isn't around a sensitive area. I'm assuming you're claiming that it is wraped around their testicles. If you actually watched rodeo you'd know that isn't true. If someone wrapped a rope around your testicles would you buck or would you keel over in pain? Did you know if the flank strap is too tight that the bull rider actually gets a re-ride? I have never seen a bull hit with an electric prod. I'm not saying that it doesn't happen, but I've never seen it.

The most cruel of the rodeo sports has got to be the barrel racing. Oh, and the toddlers chasing bunnies.

 

[Quoth The Raven]

I think with the technology we have now, putting down a horse every time a leg is broken is quite unnecessary. If we have the technology to save them after we've used them for our own whims, we should do so.Can the same be said of fetuses, people in comas, etc?

Read this: http://www.horse-sense.org/archives/20021109111000.phtml ...the reasons for putting down a horse with a broken leg are myriad, and largely the more humane option.
However...there is quite a bit of research being done into injury prevention to racehorses, which is where most people in the industry seem to agree is where the difference can be made. There is also some stem cell research going on as well - both by universities and private companies - looking into ways to generate new cartilege and reduce the effects of degenerative diseases.
The problem lies not in having the technology...the problem lies in not having $100,000 to pay for getting the injury seen to and the extended period of convalescence that may result in the animal dying anyway - in a far more miserable and pain filled fashion than it otherwise would have - or having such a reduced quality of life that in comparitive terms you wouldn't want it for yourself. There's compassion, but there's also a point at which that can turn into doing something for your own selfish ends rather than because you care about the animal.

 

[michel]

*IF* there is anything close to "animal cruelty" at the Rodeo, the only thing that would fit into that category is the calf roping. The calf is not "panicked." It runs out of the chute with a head start when the gate is opened. He does rope the calf around the neck, but he doesn't throw it to the ground by "wrenching its neck." (did you get your descriptions of these events from PETA?). The calf is tied up for about six seconds and then it gets up and walks away.

The bucking broncos and bulls "buck strap" (actually called a flank strap) isn't around a sensitive area. I'm assuming you're claiming that it is wraped around their testicles. If you actually watched rodeo you'd know that isn't true. If someone wrapped a rope around your testicles would you buck or would you keel over in pain? Did you know if the flank strap is too tight that the bull rider actually gets a re-ride? I have never seen a bull hit with an electric prod. I'm not saying that it doesn't happen, but I've never seen it.

The most cruel of the rodeo sports has got to be the barrel racing. Oh, and the toddlers chasing bunnies.

I am not even especially talking about physical cruelty.

I guess I was aiming more from the perspective of we humans (self-styled "Top dogs of the animal kingdom) have a nasty habit of "using " the rest of the animal world for our entertainemt. This photo below is an example (and that is 'in good taste' as far as the animal is concerned):-

This was taken by my son James in Spain; a little village called"Cortes de la Frontera". This little 'game' is actually mild for the Spanish.

A bull is set free in the narrow streets of the town, and anyone who fancies himself a potential matador can 'play' at escaping from the bull; the bull is not physically harmed; if anything, some of the vilagers are.

I still believe though, that even this must be a traumatic occasion for the Bulls in question. Imagine yourselves, in a land of giants, suddenly let out of the fild in which you quietly graze, sent into a townful of giants screaming and goading you.........

oops! sorry about the size!

 

[kreeden]

Imagine yourselves, in a land of giants, suddenly let out of the fild in which you quietly graze, sent into a townful of giants screaming and goading you.........

In a land of giants , the Bull would be the giant . That is one small " bull " in the pic .... still outwieghs a man though .

Personally , I don't see the sense in this sort of thing . Do imagine that the animal enjoys it , but don't think it does any real damage to the animal ? But I could be wrong , on both accounts .

 

[Flappycat]

I'm sure that the horses aren't crazy over it. I must say I have some sympathy for them, so I'd be supportive of any more humane retirement program. Whether it actually replaces the simple approach of putting a hole in the backs of their skulls, however, depends upon how willing people are to support it. They do have good genetic background, however. I don't think it should be difficult to find them owners.

 

[Flappycat]

A bull is set free in the narrow streets of the town, and anyone who fancies himself a potential matador can 'play' at escaping from the bull; the bull is not physically harmed; if anything, some of the vilagers are.

I still believe though, that even this must be a traumatic occasion for the Bulls in question. Imagine yourselves, in a land of giants, suddenly let out of the fild in which you quietly graze, sent into a townful of giants screaming and goading you.........

They're bulls. There's nothing a bull enjoys more than having an excuse to charge at something. I think that this actually is pretty mild in terms of animals being used for entertainment. It isn't much different from using a dog's play instincts to provide us with a reason to throw around a frisbee. Unless they're in some way abusing the fellow, such as prodding him with sharp objects or hitting him with things, I can't find any objection with this particular sport, and I don't think that the bulls really take much offense to it.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Wow; would you say the same to an illeterate, deaf and dumb human?

Perhaps when any goup of horses get together and write that all horses have certain inalienable rights, then we can give them what they ask for. If it is reasonable.

 

[Jaymes]

Show me a group of fetuses that can write and ask for rights, please... otherwise it'd be inconsistent to say they have rights and horses don't.

 

[jonny]

Show me a group of fetuses that can write and ask for rights, please... otherwise it'd be inconsistent to say they have rights and horses don't.

Along these same lines, a lot of the people who tend to rant and rave about animal rights (liberals *cough* *cough*) don't give a damn about the rights of an unborn child.

Just one more hypocrisy in our society.

EDIT: I'm not saying you're a hypocrite. I'm saying that the idea I described above seems hypocritical to me.