Homosexuality and the Bible: Part 2

[-Peacemaker-]

Well you do keep bringing up the Levitical verses condemning me and mine to death, so how does that fit into the bold statement above? Seems to me that you are advocating the penalties for someone else's "sin".

And it is nice to know that I am evil in your eyes, at least I know where I stand.

I believe Jesus raised the bar for mankind and that what God allows in the OT compared to the NT is evidence of that. We see that several things allowed in OT such as polygamy and taking an eye for an eye are not allowed by Jesus. Alot of Christians believe it's because God was patiently moving man's values from what they were in godless days to the ideal that Jesus introduces. I have no doubt that Jesus would treat any one of us sinners like the adulterer who was about to be stoned. The OT verses simply highlight the fact God considers homosexual behavior wrong.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

2 Timothy 4: 2 Preach the word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage—with great patience and careful instruction.

I have yet to read anything in Scripture that commands Christians to:
1. Ignore the fallacies that exist in this world
2. Make sure that culture values supercede Biblical values
3. Just hope and pray people read their Bible, you're not allowed to open your mouth to actually inform people of the error of their ways.

Yes, perhaps what is more important is actually following what is in Scripture. And not use another verse as justification for peeing on the words of Christ.

 

[-Peacemaker-]

Yes, perhaps what is more important is actually following what is in Scripture. And not use another verse as justification for peeing on the words of Christ.

Face it, your definition of judgment is our culture's definition and not God's. You are right about one thing however when it comes to my conduct. While I chastise people of the things JC commands his followers to chastise, I don't always have enough compassion when I do it. For this I am truly sorry.

 

[no-body]

Face it, your definition of judgment is our culture's definition and not God's. You are right about one thing however when it comes to my conduct. While I chastise people of the things JC commands his followers to chastise, I don't always have enough compassion when I do it. For this I am truly sorry.

Where does Christ tell you to judge and chastise people? (bonus points if you leave Paul out of it)

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Face it, your definition of judgment is our culture's definition and not God's. You are right about one thing however when it comes to my conduct. While I chastise people of the things JC commands his followers to chastise, I don't always have enough compassion when I do it. For this I am truly sorry.

Well, I have to marvel at your willingness to use the Bible to harm people while pleasing yourself by ignoring a very simple and memorable teaching of Jesus.

I mean - how could you?

You think that the Bible is so special, but you didn't even know what I was talking about. And it concerns judgment. And it is from Jesus.

It really doesn't take any kind of deep reflection to understand the words of Jesus here. And you're taking it upon your self to teach / instruct / admonish others.

I suppose you also forgot that those kinds of people will be more severely judged... I would definitely learn how to fear God and obey his teaching if I were you.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Where does Christ tell you to judge and chastise people? (bonus points if you leave Paul out of it)

hint: Paul isn't Jesus and Jesus isn't Paul.

 

[-Peacemaker-]

Well, I have to marvel at your willingness to use the Bible to harm people while pleasing yourself by ignoring a very simple and memorable teaching of Jesus.

I mean - how could you?

You think that the Bible is so special, but you didn't even know what I was talking about. And it concerns judgment. And it is from Jesus.

It really doesn't take any kind of deep reflection to understand the words of Jesus here. And you're taking it upon your self to teach / instruct / admonish others.

I suppose you also forgot that those kinds of people will be more severely judged... I would definitely learn how to fear God and obey his teaching if I were you.

You might've noticed in the passage about logs and splinters that it doesn't say ignore the splinter in people's eyes, it says take the log out of yours before you deal with the splinter. If I understand your definition of judgment it means to work on your own spiritual development and mind your own buisness when it comes to other people's, is that right?

 

[no-body]

You might've noticed in the passage about logs and splinters that it doesn't say ignore the splinter in people's eyes, it says take the log out of yours before you deal with the splinter. If I understand your definition of judgment it means to work on your own spiritual development and mind your own buisness when it comes to other people's, is that right?

"21 Then Peter came up and said to him, "Lord, how often shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? As many as seven times?"
22 Jesus said to him, "I do not say to you seven times, but seventy times seven."

"44 But I say to you, Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you"

"39 But I say to you, Do not resist one who is evil. But if any one strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also"

Jesus was totally about cramming and legislating his beliefs on others.

 

[fallingblood]

2 Timothy 4: 2 Preach the word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage—with great patience and careful instruction.

I have yet to read anything in Scripture that commands Christians to:
1. Ignore the fallacies that exist in this world
2. Make sure that culture values supercede Biblical values
3. Just hope and pray people read their Bible, you're not allowed to open your mouth to actually inform people of the error of their ways.

It does say judge not. You have been judging quite a few people here. More so, I think belittling others would also fall there. But go ahead with your arrogant intolerance.

 

[fallingblood]

I believe Jesus raised the bar for mankind and that what God allows in the OT compared to the NT is evidence of that. We see that several things allowed in OT such as polygamy and taking an eye for an eye are not allowed by Jesus. Alot of Christians believe it's because God was patiently moving man's values from what they were in godless days to the ideal that Jesus introduces. I have no doubt that Jesus would treat any one of us sinners like the adulterer who was about to be stoned. The OT verses simply highlight the fact God considers homosexual behavior wrong.

Except you have never shown that the OT says homosexuality is wrong. Instead you told me what I do and do not believe and then you closed your eyes and refused to offer a logical rebuttal.

As for homosexuality, the OT definitely does not say anything about lesbianism. As far as male homosexuality, not really either. Just ignorantly repeating a verse even if you don't understand it is not proof.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

You might've noticed in the passage about logs and splinters that it doesn't say ignore the splinter in people's eyes, it says take the log out of yours before you deal with the splinter. If I understand your definition of judgment it means to work on your own spiritual development and mind your own buisness when it comes to other people's, is that right?

So the question remains. Are you able to remove the log.

Again, you're correcting others, and you didn't even know that Scripture. One has to wonder what else you're ignoring.

 

[-Peacemaker-]

So the question remains. Are you able to remove the log.

Again, you're correcting others, and you didn't even know that Scripture. One has to wonder what else you're ignoring.

Who by your standards is without a log in their eye besides Jesus?

 

[fallingblood]

Who by your standards is without a log in their eye besides Jesus?

I think the message Jesus was getting at is that we all have logs in our eyes and thus should focus on ourselves instead of judging others. I don't think it is a difficult teaching to understand.

 

[-Peacemaker-]

I think the message Jesus was getting at is that we all have logs in our eyes and thus should focus on ourselves instead of judging others. I don't think it is a difficult teaching to understand.

What exactly do you think the Gospel message is? It's a message that differenciates between evil and good and says the evil is what we need to repent of to be saved. That's the message Christians are called to preach everywhere. How can people repent if they don't even know what evil is?

 

[fallingblood]

What exactly do you think the Gospel message is? It's a message that differenciates between evil and good and says the evil is what we need to repent of to be saved. That's the message Christians are called to preach everywhere. How can people repent if they don't even know what evil is?

Why avoid the question A_E presented to you? More so, I don't think the Gospel message is that we have to repent evil to be saved. John 3:16 states something else for one. Even Jesus hung out around sinners and didn't call them evil. Maybe you need to read a little more

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Who by your standards is without a log in their eye besides Jesus?

There you go.

 

[-Peacemaker-]

There you go.

Sorry bro, I just think you're reading that wrong. I don't think Jesus is saying no one is ever fit to correct anybody. Everything Jesus modeled for us says to the contrary. He gave us a discipleship model in which he had 12 disciples but focused a special amount of time on three of them. There's countless Scriptures which when faithfully interpreted teach the opposite of what you advocate.

1 Thessalonians 2: 11 For you know that we dealt with each of you as a father deals with his own children, 12 encouraging, comforting and urging you to live lives worthy of God, who calls you into his kingdom and glory.

Matt. 28:18-20(Jesus said) "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations,"

Acts 20:31​

Therefore be on the alert, remembering that night and day for a period of three years I did not cease to admonish each one with tears.

Col. 1:28-29​

We proclaim Him, admonishing every man and teaching every man with all wisdom, so that we may present every man complete (mature) in Christ. For this purpose also I labor, striving according to His power, which mightily works within me.

​

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Sorry bro, I just think you're reading that wrong. I don't think Jesus is saying no one is ever fit to correct anybody. Everything Jesus modeled for us says to the contrary. He gave us a discipleship model in which he had 12 disciples but focused a special amount of time on three of them. There's countless Scriptures which when faithfully interpreted teach the opposite of what you advocate.

1 Thessalonians 2: 11 For you know that we dealt with each of you as a father deals with his own children, 12 encouraging, comforting and urging you to live lives worthy of God, who calls you into his kingdom and glory.

Matt. 28:18-20(Jesus said) "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations,"

Acts 20:31​

Therefore be on the alert, remembering that night and day for a period of three years I did not cease to admonish each one with tears.

Col. 1:28-29​

We proclaim Him, admonishing every man and teaching every man with all wisdom, so that we may present every man complete (mature) in Christ. For this purpose also I labor, striving according to His power, which mightily works within me.

​

Yes! You take the power of Paul in 1 Thess, the responsibility of Jesus in Matt 28, unfortunately you don't even see anything about self reflection in Acts, and finally Paul again in Col.

The real critical thing is that you throw out the words of Christ. Not wise when you're wanting to BE Christ and Paul. Those are big shoes to fill while throwing out Jesus's words at your pleasure.

 

[-Peacemaker-]

Yes! You take the power of Paul in 1 Thess, the responsibility of Jesus in Matt 28, unfortunately you don't even see anything about self reflection in Acts, and finally Paul again in Col.

The real critical thing is that you throw out the words of Christ. Not wise when you're wanting to BE Christ and Paul. Those are big shoes to fill while throwing out Jesus's words at your pleasure.

1 Corinthians 11:1 Follow my example, as I follow the example of Christ.

1 Thessalonians 1:6 You became imitators of us and of the Lord; in spite of severe suffering, you welcomed the message with the joy given by the Holy Spirit.

Philippians 3:17 Join with others in following my example, brothers, and take note of those who live according to the pattern we gave you.

1 Corinthians 4:17 Therefore I urge you to imitate me

 

[fallingblood]

1 Corinthians 11:1 Follow my example, as I follow the example of Christ.

1 Thessalonians 1:6 You became imitators of us and of the Lord; in spite of severe suffering, you welcomed the message with the joy given by the Holy Spirit.

Philippians 3:17 Join with others in following my example, brothers, and take note of those who live according to the pattern we gave you.

1 Corinthians 4:17 Therefore I urge you to imitate me

So we should imitate Paul and not Jesus?