Has Greta studied this?

[gnomon]

And it remains......Greta Thunberg is not the be all and end all of climate change debate.

 

[Tambourine]

Terry this has been repeated so many times I think learnt as a child in the late 90’s that the whole world was going to end because of our most horrid pollutions to the ozone layer. And the proof was there according to our teacher because the ozone hole at Antarctica we’re getting bigger. Anyway we no longer hear of it. Maybe simply because it’s a natural occurrence with the holes at both poles naturally expanding and decreasing in size all depending on the year. To me personally it’s a rather dangerous weapon to be using future generations at the expense of the present especially when much of the evidence is challenged and controversial. I mean making the present people suffer on assumptions or maybe someone’s agenda. There is really no just reason for making good reliable energy so much more expensive in using alternative unreliable power sources.

135-year-long streak is over: US renewable sources topped coal in 2019

Demand for, and utility of, renewable energy sources have been steadily growing for decades. There is really no point any more in clinging to outdated technologies whose dangerous and environmentally destructive nature has been known for decades at this point.

 

[Prim969]

135-year-long streak is over: US renewable sources topped coal in 2019

Demand for, and utility of, renewable energy sources have been steadily growing for decades. There is really no point any more in clinging to outdated technologies whose dangerous and environmentally destructive nature has been known for decades at this point.

That’s very true renewable energy has been growing. But still with no consistency to be able to match the productivity of coal power to run a daily economy when required. No one has a problem with alternative energy. It’s just that you simply don’t replace a successfully proven source like fossil fuels with ones that are not economically viable as yet. The bottom line is you cannot run a economy on alternative energy as yet. You also have to evaluate the cost factors to see if that alternative energy is cost friendly as well. Common sense says to me you continue with what works effectively and continue to build around that. Modern coal power stations are so much more climate friendly and efficient now anyway

 

[Tambourine]

That’s very true renewable energy has been growing. But still with no consistency to be able to match the productivity of coal power to run a daily economy when required.

Then why are people abandoning coal power in favor of literally every other source of energy?

 

[Notanumber]

China continues to rely on the stability of coal and natural gas power while selling unstable solar power to the rest of the world - China Set for Massive Coal Expansion in Threat to Climate Goals

 

[Notanumber]

Is true science outdated?

A live TV debate between Naomi and Greta would be interesting.

"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act" -George Orwell

 

[Tambourine]

Is true science outdated?

A live TV debate between Naomi and Greta would be interesting.

"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act" -George Orwell

Did you change your mind? Or did you just admit your position's lack of credibility?

Climate scientists with any credibility would not need a child as a spokesperson.

Climate scientists of Patrick Moore’s calibre would find that embarrassing.

If those reports were convincing they would not need the support of a child.

 

[exchemist]

That’s very true renewable energy has been growing. But still with no consistency to be able to match the productivity of coal power to run a daily economy when required. No one has a problem with alternative energy. It’s just that you simply don’t replace a successfully proven source like fossil fuels with ones that are not economically viable as yet. The bottom line is you cannot run a economy on alternative energy as yet. You also have to evaluate the cost factors to see if that alternative energy is cost friendly as well. Common sense says to me you continue with what works effectively and continue to build around that. Modern coal power stations are so much more climate friendly and efficient now anyway

Coal is dying out. Its economics are poor, compared to gas or even renewables. See for instance this recent article in Forbes: Is The US Coal Industry Completely Burned Out?

According to the article, the average coal power station in the US is >40 years old. It seems unlikely any new ones will be ever be built. A dozen US coal mining companies have filed for bankruptcy in the last five years.

Coal is not a good power source to use to fill in the gaps in renewable power generation, because it takes hours or days to fire up a furnace and raise steam. It works best for base load generation. The solution to the intermittent nature of renewables is to have firstly a mix of different renewables, e.g. solar, wind and hydro, then storage systems (pumped storage and increasingly batteries) and then use quick response fossil fuel capacity for peak shaving, e.g. gas turbines. (Hydro is also ideal for peak shaving.) It is also likely in future that demand management will play a bigger role, i.e. by providing incentives for industry to use power when it is plentiful.

Natural gas (CH4) produces only half as much CO2 per unit energy as coal does, so moving to gas is already a big step in the right direction, while we wait for the economics of renewables to improve further, which they are doing every year.

Coal has had it.

 

[Notanumber]

Did you change your mind? Or did you just admit your position's lack of credibility?

Naomi is a free spirit, not a caged bird.

 

[Tambourine]

Naomi is a free spirit, not a changed bird.

So you admit that your position lacks credibility and needs a teenage girl as a spokesperson.

China continues to rely on the stability of coal and natural gas power while selling unstable solar power to the rest of the world - China Set for Massive Coal Expansion in Threat to Climate Goals

Is that what your blonde teenage spokesperson told you? That solar energy is "unstable"? Is that why you're in favor of ancient, dangerous and environmentally destructive energy sources like coal and oil, instead of modern renewable technologies?

On China:

While China is gaga for coal, it also is more green than anyone else. China owns half the world’s electric vehicles and 99 percent of the world’s electric buses. One quarter of its electricity comes from renewable power like solar or wind. Its cheap silicon panels have driven down the price of solar energy worldwide, and Chinese manufacturers are now starting to export EV batteries to automakers in Europe, Asia and the U.S.

For Chinese leaders, boosting global green energy isn’t a moral issue, it’s an economic one, according to Jonas Nahm, assistant professor of energy, resources, and environment at the Johns Hopkins University School of Advanced International Studies. “It doesn’t come from an altruistic place,” Nahm said. “They are doing this as an economic development strategy.”

Nahm has been studying the disconnect between green energy targets announced by party leaders in Beijing, and the actions of local leaders in China’s far-flung provinces. He found that up to 40 percent of renewable energy is wasted because there’s no national power market in China. That means that wind and solar power generated in one province can’t be sent to an adjacent province, so more coal plants are fired up even if there’s cheaper green energy next door.

But China’s reliance on dirty coal has come back to haunt its own citizens, according to Nahm. “The air pollution crisis is a reason to get away from coal,” he said. “That’s the first environmental crisis that’s pushed the government to act, and then the impact of climate change. There’s desertification, water shortages, giant dust storms and some of these problems are getting more severe.”

Nahm and the other experts believe that China is headed in the right direction on climate change, but its economy is so big and so dependent on coal that it takes a while to get there.

(my bold, Source)

 

[Notanumber]

So you admit that your position lacks credibility and needs a teenage girl as a spokesperson.

Unlike Greta, Naomi is not a spokesperson for anyone.

 

[Tambourine]

Unlike Greta, Naomi is not a spokesperson for anyone.

She sure seems to be a "climate scientist" on roughly the same level as Patrick Moore or Nigel Farage.
I can see why you've latched onto her, she even uses capital letter headlines, the sign of a true expert on any subject.

 

[Notanumber]

Is that what your blonde teenage spokesperson told you? That solar energy is "unstable"? Is that why you're in favor of ancient, dangerous and environmentally destructive energy sources like coal and oil, instead of modern renewable technologies?

On China:
(my bold, Source)

China is not the cuddly saviour of the world that you seem to think it is.

China must pay Britain £351bn in coronavirus damages - report calls for UN to step in

China's fearsome plot to 'leverage' COVID-19 vaccine to further world domination

Tory MP Tobias Ellwood warned the Chinese Communist Party could use the vaccine as a "leverage".

He tweeted: “I predicted this. China will leverage vaccine rollout to further its global political influence.”

China warns US to stay out of Hong Kong or it will retaliate

 

[Notanumber]

She sure seems to be a "climate scientist" on roughly the same level as Patrick Moore or Nigel Farage.
I can see why you've latched onto her, she even uses capital letter headlines, the sign of a true expert on any subject.

No one is forcing you to listen to what she has to say.

 

[Tambourine]

China is not the cuddly saviour of the world that you seem to think it is.

China must pay Britain £351bn in coronavirus damages - report calls for UN to step in

China's fearsome plot to 'leverage' COVID-19 vaccine to further world domination

Tory MP Tobias Ellwood warned the Chinese Communist Party could use the vaccine as a "leverage".

He tweeted: “I predicted this. China will leverage vaccine rollout to further its global political influence.”

China warns US to stay out of Hong Kong or it will retaliate

This is the thread about climate change. Please stick to the topic under discussion.

 

[Tambourine]

No one is forcing you to listen to what she has to say.

Is your objection to Thunberg that she is forcing you to listen to what she has to say?

Who is applying this threat of force to you? Is it the British government?

 

[Notanumber]

This is the thread about climate change. Please stick to the topic under discussion.

It is all connected.

 

[Notanumber]

Is your objection to Thunberg that she is forcing you to listen to what she has to say?

Who is applying this threat of force to you? Is it the British government?

I stopped listening to Greta when it became obvious that she was being manipulated.

You can stop listening to Naomi for any reason you like, but do not try to stop others from listening.

 

[Tambourine]

I stopped listening to Greta when it became obvious that she was being manipulated.

You can stop listening to Naomi for any reason you like, but do not try to stop others from listening.

Where have I tried to stop others from listening?

 

[Notanumber]

Where have I tried to stop others from listening?

If you are not, then welcome to the Naomi supporters club.