God and Logic

[A. Leaf]

AtheistAJ; 'You are of God, Intelligent Energy, A Biological shell, and a mind to harness the two,
pure Intelligence is that of God and That of You', love it, Topclass, topman, i think you caught me drift.

 

[AtheistAJ]

AtheistAJ; 'You are of God, Intelligent Energy, A Biological shell, and a mind to harness the two,
pure Intelligence is that of God and That of You', love it, Topclass, topman, i think you caught me drift.

I am of DNA, which is of matter, intelligence of cellular tissue in my head, radiation, and entirely biological, not just a shell. The energy that keeps me going is from my daily nutrient intake, which supplies my cells with food that enables them to multiply and reproduce. And I think "love" slows intellectual development with going inseparably with hedonism.

 

[A. Leaf]

Topnotch

 

[Cordoba]

"Infinite" by what standards? Not even our Universe is infinite as there are others, and there is a widely excepted scientific theory that ours expands and shrinks due to temperature like everything else in it. A god or whatever can't be in this Universe at the same time as others, so even if there is a god and it is infinite in this Universe, it is not infinite in infinity.

Besides, why would something infinite care for little ol' you?

Also you are wrong, matter doesn't "end", just shapeshifts.

Hello AtheistAJ:

God is Eternal as He is not restricted with the constraints of time like we are.

Each creature has a start and an end. It's He who gives life, and He takes it away.

Only The Creator is Ever-Living. He is The Sustainer of all existence.

There is to Him no equivalent.

As for your question Why does God care for us, the answer is because He created us and He loves us. He gave us free will to get to know Him and love Him in return by our own free choice.

 

[JerryL]

Everything that exists, and the universe as a whole, display a magnificent harmony and order in themselves and in their interrelationships. The existence of one part necessitates the existence of the whole, and the whole requires the existence of all parts for its own existence.

So God cannot exist without man... meaning that God was created.

For example, a deformed cell may destroy an entire body.

No, it can't. It can reproduce into a bunch that do; and this does indeed occur. More often, the deformed cells self-destruct or are distroied, or sit and do nothing.

All of creation exhibits an overwhelming artistry of dazzling worth.

Much likg God has worth... proving that God was created.

That said, I suspect that the sun would spin just fine if there were no people.

 

[JerryL]

God of Creation in the heavens = Pure Positive Intelligence in the name of Love.
The Beast on Earth = Negative Intelligence, hinders all Intelligent development to keep financial and mental control of Earth.

The beast is evil.

God created everything.
God created the Beast.
God made evil.

BTW, does this mean God is not all things in that you argue that he's not evil?

 

[JerryL]

God is Eternal as He is not restricted with the constraints of time like we are.

Which means that he cannot act, as action occurs over time. God is impotent.

Only The Creator is Ever-Living. He is The Sustainer of all existence.

Presenting facts not in evidence. Prove.

As for your question Why does God care for us, the answer is because He created us and He loves us. He gave us free will to get to know Him and love Him in return by our own free choice.

Then he's quite the spectacular failure.

 

[Engyo]

Ok, now, is God the greatest, most perfect, brilliantest, amazingest etc. being ever?

Yep, the bestest ever created by the mind of man!

 

[michel]

Yep, the bestest ever created by the mind of man!

I have a feeling of deja vu here, but what the heck - and who created the mind of man - God!

 

[Engyo]

I have a feeling of deja vu here, but what the heck - and who created the mind of man - God!

Oh, well - I supose it's a good thing Buddha reminded us that dwelling on these kinds of improvables is not something that helps improve the lot of any of us, nor does it tend to help eradicate suffering or lead to enlightenment.

 

[michel]

Oh, well - I supose it's a good thing Buddha reminded us that dwelling on these kinds of improvables is not something that helps improve the lot of any of us, nor does it tend to help eradicate suffering or lead to enlightenment.

I couldn't agree more. Forgive my jesting.

 

[Cordoba]

<< God is Eternal as He is not restricted with the constraints of time like we are. >>

Which means that he cannot act, as action occurs over time.

Do you really think that The Creator who created all this immense universe "cannot act" ?

Action occurs over time for us humans who are constrained by time.

For The Eternal Creator, there is no separation between past, present and future, and He acts in the way He likes.

I think you need to be a bit more humble here, Jerry. Just look up to the sky, and you'll realize how small we are compared to the universe.

A drop in the ocean!

 

[JerryL]

Do you really think that The Creator who created all this immense universe "cannot act" ?

I think action is a temporal activity and therefore cannot occur outside of time.

For The Eternal Creator, there is no separation between past, present and future, and He acts in the way He likes.

A self-refuting position.

I think you need to be a bit more humble here, Jerry. Just look up to the sky, and you'll realize how small we are compared to the universe.

I suspect I'm more aware of the scope of the universe than you are; but I see no correlation between "the universe is big" and "action is possible outside time".

 

[Cordoba]

Hello Jerry:

You said:
"I think action is a temporal activity and therefore cannot occur outside of time."

The problem is that you are trying to apply the concepts and laws which govern our universe to The Creator of this universe and its laws.

An example may help clarify this point. Think of a robot designed and built by an engineer.

All the robot knows is its software and hardware. That's what governs its "universe".

Would it be right for the robot to assume that the engineer functions in the same way?

 

[mr.guy]

Would it be right for the robot to assume that the engineer functions in the same way?

If the engineer programed it to, why not?

 

[ChrisP]

Hello Jerry:

You said:
"I think action is a temporal activity and therefore cannot occur outside of time."

The problem is that you are trying to apply the concepts and laws which govern our universe to The Creator of this universe and its laws.

An example may help clarify this point. Think of a robot designed and built by an engineer.

All the robot knows is its software and hardware. That's what governs its "universe".

Would it be right for the robot to assume that the engineer functions in the same way?

Robots can't think

 

[mr.guy]

Robots can't think

Plenty of reasons to assume people can't either.

 

[JerryL]

The problem is that you are trying to apply the concepts and laws which govern our universe to The Creator of this universe and its laws.

No, I'm applying definitions.

Can God make a four-sided triangle? If "no", then he can't act outside of time. If "yes", then you are speaking irrationally and a discussion is no possible as we have no framework.

An example may help clarify this point. Think of a robot designed and built by an engineer.

All the robot knows is its software and hardware. That's what governs its "universe".

Would it be right for the robot to assume that the engineer functions in the same way?

It's a very poor analogy.

It would be an interesting discussion between a deist and a Jew/Christian/Muslim regarding the anthropromorphization (badly spelled) of God. But that is not what I've done. I've discussed what "action" is and how it neccessairily occurs over time... making "action outside time" an oximoron.

 

[Cordoba]

[/u]
If the engineer programed it to, why not?

If the robot consults "the manual", it would learn that its software is not unique, and that a higher level of intelligence is behind its existence.

So for the robot to assume that the engineer is similar to robots is wrong.

The Creator of the universe is Unique.

There is to Him no Equivalent.

 

[mr.guy]

If the robot consults "the manual", it would learn that its software is not unique, and that a higher level of intelligence is behind its existence.

What if the robots wrote an inaccurate manual to begin with?