Fat and Ashes

[Kemosloby]

Do science and religion meet at the foot of the altar? In the bible OT aka Jewish Tanahk the Lord commanded burnt offerings to cleanse his people of their sins. Could it be an inside joke of the Lord that at the foot of the altar would be the first discovery of soap? Fat and ashes are the basic ingredients of soap.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Do science and religion meet at the foot of the altar?

No. Religion stopped at the altar. Science is going beyond our solar system.

Could it be an inside joke of the Lord that at the foot of the altar would be the first discovery of soap?

It doesn't seem that way, as there is actually no evidence soap was first discovered at an altar (though there are indeed many variations of this story, including the Romans discovering it on the riverbanks where animals/humans were sacrificed, and the fat and ash meeting with the water to create a soapy substance), but evidence to know at least the Babylonians and Egyptians were among the first to use it.

 

[Kemosloby]

No. Religion stopped at the altar. Science is going beyond our solar system.

It doesn't seem that way, as there is actually no evidence soap was first discovered at an altar (though there are indeed many variations of this story, including the Romans discovering it on the riverbanks where animals/humans were sacrificed, and the fat and ash meeting with the water to create a soapy substance), but evidence to know at least the Babylonians and Egyptians were among the first to use it.

Burnt offerings must have been a very old religious practice since Abraham in the time of Melchizedek burned a ram on the altar in place if Isaac. But as God's plan of redemption is revealed to us over time it certainly becomes apparent that the burnt offerings are for a cleansing purpose, inside and out.

 

[BSM1]

Burnt offerings must have been a very old religious practice since Abraham in the time of Melchizedek burned a ram on the altar in place if Isaac. But as God's plan of redemption is revealed to us over time it certainly becomes apparent that the burnt offerings are for a cleansing purpose, inside and out.

Got any information on Melchizedek?

 

[Kemosloby]

Got any information on Melchizedek?

Not much is known about Melchizedek, but Melchizedek was King of Salem, which was the same location as Jerusalem, and he was High Priest of God. Melchizedek blessed Abraham so they must have lived at the same time.

 

[BSM1]

Not much is known about Melchizedek, but Melchizedek was King of Salem, which was the same location as Jerusalem, and he was High Priest of God. Melchizedek blessed Abraham so they must have lived at the same time.

There is some anecdotal information on Melchizedek in The Urantia Book. Fascinating reading.

 

[allfoak]

Do science and religion meet at the foot of the altar? In the bible OT aka Jewish Tanahk the Lord commanded burnt offerings to cleanse his people of their sins. Could it be an inside joke of the Lord that at the foot of the altar would be the first discovery of soap? Fat and ashes are the basic ingredients of soap.

I am sure things like that are everywhere in the Bible.

 

[Augustus]

Burnt offerings must have been a very old religious practice since Abraham in the time of Melchizedek burned a ram on the altar in place if Isaac. But as God's plan of redemption is revealed to us over time it certainly becomes apparent that the burnt offerings are for a cleansing purpose, inside and out.

Sacrifice was a form of 'buy in' to the community. You had to be willing to give something up if you wanted to belong to the group and gain the benefits of membership.

Talk is cheap and all that.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

But as God's plan of redemption is revealed to us over time it certainly becomes apparent that the burnt offerings are for a cleansing purpose, inside and out.

That's rather vicious, don't you think? To kill and burn an animal to be "cleansed?" Do the lives of those animals have no value?

Burnt offerings must have been a very old religious practice since Abraham in the time of Melchizedek burned a ram on the altar in place if Isaac.

Yes, but that doesn't mean they "discovered" (a number of cultures independently discovered the effects of mixing oils and alkali. But, despite the legends and stories, we have no proof that anyone's "sacrificial fire victim + body of water = soap" story actually happened. And if the Jews were doing it then, they likely learned it from either the Babylonians or Egyptians.

 

[Kemosloby]

That's rather vicious, don't you think? To kill and burn an animal to be "cleansed?" Do the lives of those animals have no value?

Yes, but that doesn't mean they "discovered" (a number of cultures independently discovered the effects of mixing oils and alkali. But, despite the legends and stories, we have no proof that anyone's "sacrificial fire victim + body of water = soap" story actually happened. And if the Jews were doing it then, they likely learned it from either the Babylonians or Egyptians.

It doesn't matter, the point is soap is created as a byproduct of burnt offerings. So on the surface one might think burnt offerings are barbaric, though they are ok with BBQ's, but God could be subtly telling sinners to take a bath, clean themselves up. So He was providing them with soap, without actually saying to take a bath. Then He sent John the Baptist, baptizing in water. Rinse cycle?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

It doesn't matter, the point is soap is created as a byproduct of burnt offerings

You can, but even "back then" it was not a requirement. I have no doubts many took the ashes from cooking and heating fires, and added various oils of preference, giving the blend necessary fats. Maybe some did use the remains from burnt offerings, perhaps some didn't because it was given to god.

So on the surface one might think burnt offerings are barbaric, though they are ok with BBQ's

I actually do think meat consumption is barbaric. It is literally the way of the world, and I would never tell a hunter they cannot feed their family, but, yes, killing is a rather barbaric function. I see no reason to believe a god would require such bestial and animalistic behaviors.

 

[Kemosloby]

You can, but even "back then" it was not a requirement. I have no doubts many took the ashes from cooking and heating fires, and added various oils of preference, giving the blend necessary fats. Maybe some did use the remains from burnt offerings, perhaps some didn't because it was given to god.

I actually do think meat consumption is barbaric. It is literally the way of the world, and I would never tell a hunter they cannot feed their family, but, yes, killing is a rather barbaric function. I see no reason to believe a god would require such bestial and animalistic behaviors.

God created everything. He created the whole animals eating animals thing... Originally man was only supposed to eat plants but people want more, and like a God the Father, seems to let people do what they want. So people wanted meat, God gave them meat, and put some soap there for them to find.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Originally man was only supposed to eat plants

Our digestive system says otherwise.

So people wanted meat, God gave them meat, and put some soap there for them to find.

Except even ancient soaps didn't always use animal fats. Olive oil, for example, was likely very common.

 

[Thief]

and God gave them animal skins to cover themselves....
so it is written

until something was done to preserve the skin (tanning)
THAT would stink
all the way to heaven

 

[psychoslice]

its also carcinogenic.