Faith in no God

[tas8831]

Science can and often does disprove things. As example, Math has shown, that there is no integer solution to the equation a^3+b^3=c^3.

Science has also disproved the notion of Adam and Eve, and has proven that humans share an ancestry with other animals. It is in the genetics.

 

[tas8831]

Existence is a pretty solid argument for a transcendent Creator. That is just one of the reasons atheism is an irrational worldview.

Existence is a pretty solid argument for a lack of a transcendent Creator. That is just one of the reasons theism is an irrational worldview.

Say - that was easy!

 

[tas8831]

The Sagan Standard is an aphorism that claims that “extraordinary statements require extraordinary evidence” (ECREE). [12]. A criticism against the Biblical Creation is just too bold a statement.

OK, then let's see the extraordinary evidence for it.

And surely, a brilliant scholar such as yourself, will not be so jejune as to think that bible verses will count...

 

[tas8831]

God has an IQ off the charts.

Yup... Sure...

Female Hyenas Have a "Penis" That They Use To Give Birth

...female hyenas do have a penis-like organ, complete with a fake scrotum and testes
... If that wasn’t weird enough, the female hyenas have to give birth through these things. Spotted hyenas have the largest carnivoran young relative to their mothers’ weight, so not only does their clitoris rupture during birth, but often, 60% of their first litter dies of suffocation inside their pseudopenis. So, for some reason, hyenas evolved to make childbirth even more painful and traumatic.​

That took a super intelligence to create.

 

[Howard Is]

There must be a God. "God" also fulfills Occam's razor test since the simplest explanation for how everything can exist as it does is that there is a Creator.

Wrong. It is overcomplication to assume a Creator.

If you want to apply Occam’s Razor, the simplest explanation is - there was no creation, this is the same eternity as ever was. Easy. Couldn’t be simpler.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Existence is a pretty solid argument for a transcendent Creator. That is just one of the reasons atheism is an irrational worldview.

You're skipping a few steps in that argument.

 

[Jim]

Since it can not be proven there is no God any more than it can not be proven there is a God, it would take no less faith to believe there is no God than it would take to believe there is a God.

Without faith in one or the other, the only true thing someone could say is they don't know if there is not, or there is a God. At least that would accord with the lack of evidence one way or the other.

If there is a difference in the faith required to believe one way or the other, I'd be curious to hear about that difference.

One faith is words and the other is trust.

Words: The faith of people saying that they believe in God is just some words that they say to themselves and others, associating that with some thoughts and feelings about the world around us. It may or may not say anything about how they live their lives.

Trust: The faith of people whose ways of thinking don’t include any God beliefs is trust, trusting that there really are no such gods. They may not consciously think of it that way, and if they do, they don’t call it “faith.”

One faith is words, the other is trust.

I see that same faith in no God sometimes, in some of the behavior of people who say that they believe in the God of their scriptures. Sometimes they act like they’re trusting that there really is no such God.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Well, I totally agree with you. I'm as much a Christian as God ever birthed.

I was just saying that those who denigrate Christians for living by faith are in fact themselves also living by faith. Somehow it smacks of hypocrisy.

"Living by faith" in the sense of living as if there are no gods is the same sort of "faith" we use when we buy groceries:

How you be sure that you really do need eggs and bread? Maybe someone broke into your house and restocked your kitchen after you left to go to the supermarket. Maybe bread has magically become poisonous. Maybe squatters have taken over your house while you're gone and you won't be able to get back in before your frozen food melts! You can't prove that these things aren't true.

This is quite different from the "faith as belief in spite of evidence" that's typical of religious faith.

 

[ratiocinator]

There must be a God. "God" also fulfills Occam's razor test since the simplest explanation for how everything can exist as it does is that there is a Creator.

It not only isn't the simplest explanation for how everything can exist, it isn't even an explanation at all. The existence of a god that creates a universe is no less mysterious and unexplained than just a universe.

 

[Seek truth]

Since it can not be proven there is no God any more than it can not be proven there is a God, it would take no less faith to believe there is no God than it would take to believe there is a God.

Without faith in one or the other, the only true thing someone could say is they don't know if there is not, or there is a God. At least that would accord with the lack of evidence one way or the other.

If there is a difference in the faith required to believe one way or the other, I'd be curious to hear about that difference.

The biggest evidence that God exists is the Quran.

Here are some Reasons Why The Qur’an is A Miracle:

• It contains many Scientific Statements even though it has remained exactly the same for over 1400 years - This is accepted by everyone !

For Example It Describes:
 Embryology (How a baby forms – Read Prof. Keith Moore)
 The Big Bang Theory (The Start of The Universe)
 The Expanding Universe
 How Gravity Works (Planets 'Swim' in Orbits)
 The Construction of Mountains
 The Water Cycle (Formation of Clouds)
 Pain receptors in the skin

• It contains God’s challenge - to try and produce even one chapter like it. This still stands today !
• It was given to a man who could neither read nor write.
• It’s words have the effect of changing peoples’ lives.
• It does not contain a single contradiction despite the fact it was revealed over a period of 23 years.
• It has produced ‘The Largest Practised Religion’ of about 1.7 billion followers and ‘The Fastest Growing Religion’.

The Qur’an contains Good News and a Warning.
For those who worship The One Almighty God and follow the example of The Messengers of God, there is Good News of success in this life as well as Eternal Paradise in The Hereafter. Those who reject the message are warned of The Hell-fire. The Messengers of Almighty God include:
Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Muhammad (peace be upon them).

 

[Jim]

I was just saying that those who denigrate Christians for living by faith are in fact themselves also living by faith.

Many people who live their lives trusting that there is no God like the one you believe in, do not denigrate Christians at all. Many people who denigrate Christians are people who say that they believe in your God.

 

[viole]

Since it can not be proven there is no God any more than it can not be proven there is a God, it would take no less faith to believe there is no God than it would take to believe there is a God.

Without faith in one or the other, the only true thing someone could say is they don't know if there is not, or there is a God. At least that would accord with the lack of evidence one way or the other.

If there is a difference in the faith required to believe one way or the other, I'd be curious to hear about that difference.

well, try to say at a party that it takes faith to believe the planets are not moved by some invisible angels inside of them. Angels who love conic sections, and that is why they follow elliptical curves. And see the difference your self in the faces of your friends.

for, can you prove that there are no invisible angels moving the planets along elliptic trajectories, because of their obsession with conic sections?

ciao

- viole

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

The biggest evidence that God exists is the Quran.

So if we find the Quran unconvincing, we don't need to look further: we can be sure that any other evidence for God will be even less convincing... right?

 

[tas8831]

 Embryology (How a baby forms – Read Prof. Keith Moore)

I taught Embryology last semester. I use Moore's textbook.

Where in that text is there evidence that the Quran is 'describing' embryology?

 

[Polymath257]

Science can and often does disprove things. As example, Math has shown, that there is no integer solution to the equation a^3+b^3=c^3.

It wasn't science that proved that. It was math. They two are different disciplines.

 

[rrobs]

Nope. I don't accept any significant claim without evidence, thus I don't require faith.

Not being able to prove God does not exist, you must necessarily have faith that He does not exist. The only other option is that you don't know if God exists or not. He might or might not exist. Pure logic dictates it be such.

 

[rrobs]

Not how it works. My lack of faith in any god is based on a lack of evidence for same. Absolutely no faith is required. As for proving the non-existence of something... again, that's not how it works. It's impossible to prove a negative.

Yes, it is impossible to prove a negative. That is my whole point and precisely why one must deny the existence of God by faith and nothing but faith.

 

[rrobs]

Replace all instances of 'God' with 'Cthulhu' in your post, read it back, and tell me if you think the logic holds up.

Replace 'God' with whatever you want, the logic remains the same. Not having proof that God does not exist, you must go by faith alone. Of course you could also say, "I don't know" but few are willing to admit that. They already "know" He doesn't. Self delusion at it's finest.

 

[rrobs]

So if one doesn't know, why would a person conclude or declare there is definitely a God?

Do they also believe in the existence of every other unknown and unproven entity or idea?

The difference is that one set of humans declare there is this god *depending and varying on culture and exposure*, stating it as undeniable fact, and the other people who do not believe those claims. For the millionth time.

There is a difference. And why theists always want to depict atheists as 'just the same as they are' when it comes to having faith, is beyond me.

Theists usually want to point out the difference between atheists and themselves. So why the attempt to put them in the same boat when it comes to faith? I would think they would revel in the superior position of having faith in the not knowable answer about God/gods.

I think your last paragraph makes more sense than the rest. Yes, without proof of the existence or non-existence of God, one must take their position by faith. I think it may gall many to think that (faith typically being considered some lesser thing), but that's the way it is.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I think your last paragraph makes more sense than the rest. Yes, without proof of the existence or non-existence of God, one must take their position by faith. I think it may gall many to think that (faith typically being considered some lesser thing), but that's the way it is.

I think you're approaching this issue with some assumptions about God's importance that are probably unfounded.