Ben Dhyan
Veteran Member
But once one decides to obey God, it will take time to surrender the ego self to the Divine Self.
Imho, 'death' can be considered a transitional event.
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End Times?
- Thread starter Eddi
- Start date
Imho, 'death' can be considered a transitional event.
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
Do you believe, as do those Christians in the holiness movement, that a person can achieve total sanctification and stop sinning?
Ben Dhyan
Veteran Member
Total sanctification imho exists only after the personal self has surrendered to the Divine Self/God. Only then is there a total cessation of sin.
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
And is that possible in this life?
Ben Dhyan
Veteran Member
Jesus did it, you potentially can. However the destiny to do that would have been decided on high before your birth.
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
I don't think Jesus did it. He desecrated the temple with violence, committing assault and vandalism. However, I do think that some people exist who have unusually high empathy and who are sheltered in highly supportive religious communities, who never sin. I just think they are rare.
Ben Dhyan
Veteran Member
Have these people never had a bad thought? It is impossible imho. But Jesis attained the Son of God status, there is no sin. God does not sin. Isaiah 45:6-7. Thy Lord God is one. I create the light and the darkness, I create good and I make evil, I the Lord does these tings!
InChrist
Free4ever
From my perspective, the scriptures appear to be showing that Jesus was removing those who were desecrating the temple.
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
I don't think bad thoughts are sins. There is no commandment "Thou shalt not think bad thoughts."
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
It was a thing of enormous convenience to be able to buy your sacrifice at the temple rather than have to herd your animal all the way to Jerusalem from your home. No one was required to buy there at the temple, but of course many people did simply because it saved them an enormous hassle. It was a good thing.
Let's assume for the sake of argument that something nefarious was going on, perhaps a priest cheating people. The appropriate response to that is to take the case before the authorities. It is NOT to become a violent vigilante.
Ben Dhyan
Veteran Member
Matthew 15:18 But the things that come out of the mouth come from the heart, and these things defile a man. 19 For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false testimony, and slander. 20 These are what defile a man, but eating with unwashed hands does not defile him.”
Matthew 5:28 But I say, anyone who even looks at a woman with lust has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
Ben Dhyan
Veteran Member
Jesus?
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
Matthew is not the Torah.
Viker
Häxan
Unprecedented world wide catastrophe. Everything turned upside down and inside out. In that darkness, in all the mind bending chaos, a little light shines. That light expands, it is not hope. The little light is the dawn of the end of now and the destruction of all that has been. And then, it happens.
No more. Maybe it'll play again, another way.
Ben Dhyan
Veteran Member
Correct, it is the teaching of Jesus wrt the Torah.
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
Irrelevant to me. We are talking about whether God gave such a commandment to Moses. That's Torah as understood by oral Torah. Nothing from the New Testament suitable to the point.
Ben Dhyan
Veteran Member
Fair enough, but imho the Christ's beatitudes on Moses' commandments are really common sense, and were intended for those who were not living in the spirit of the that intended by God/Moses. I don't think God intended that it was ok for Jews to lust over other men's wives, and have murderous thoughts about others, etc..
flowerpower
Member
For the purposes of discussion imagine that God is someday going to somehow put an end to the world.....
According to your religious beliefs what exactly do you expect to happen?
Eschatology is not one of my strong points and I'm more than a little confused about Christian teachings on the matter and as far as I can see there are many different and conflicting views within Christianity as to what exactly will happen
But how do you (no matter what your religion is) think God will end the world? - and why do you believe what you believe?
And are there currently any signs to be seen that may suggest The End is approaching?
I have started watching YouTube videos about it to educate myself
View attachment 71030
I don't think the apocalypse actually requires any kind of god.
I thought it was scientifically proven that the world will end some day - I actually knew about this when I was only 6 years old - maybe I was a nerdier little kid when I was in Kindergarten than my peers but I remember being pretty much inseparable from some book about space that kids could understand that I got for Christmas one year. I was able to wrap my little walnut around cosmic horror at a remarkably young age - the fact that the earth was so small in relation to the rest of the universe that it kind of seems like nothing we do really matters and that earth and even our sun and galaxy are pretty inconsequential.
It was only when I started to read Bertrand Russell's **** in university that I was able to return to the issue after suffering fools throughout my childhood who seemed to believe that their lives were the centre of the universe or, if they were unusually less self absorbed than most, they'd acknowledge that the world was a little more important than their own egos - still pretty narrow minded as far as my own estimation.
"The world" in it's entirety - involving the full sweep of time and space involved in its existence - is literally like a grain of sand on a long beach.
I'm not convinced that the end of the world is necessarily "near" as far as humans conceive of it but it's definitely coming at some point. Probably pretty randomly like an asteroid or something will wipe us out. The way our sun functions is destined to cook our planet up in a few million years or so anyway and then it'll just explode/collapse into a black whole - by then, humanity will be long extinct.
Kinda makes all the stuff humans do really, really absurd - especially religious dogma and political ideology.
I suppose the most virtuous thing a person can do with their life is try to not die. LOL
I don't recall death as to be considered a ' transitional event '.
When dead Jesus was in biblical hell (aka grave) he wasn't in any transition stage - Acts 2:27
In Scripture Jesus remained 'asleep in death' until his God resurrected dead Jesus ( restored Jesus to life ) .
Jesus was well educated in the old Hebrew Scriptures which teach 'sleep' in death - Psalm 115:17; Isaiah 38:18; Ecclesiastes 9:5
Thus, that is why Jesus also teaches ' sleep ' in death - John 11:11-14
Yes, once one decides to obey God it does take time to surrender the ego self to the Divine Self.
That could be a reason for Jesus' New Commandment found at John 13:34-35
To have the same self-sacrificing love for others as Jesus has.
In other words, to Now love neighbor MORE than self, more than the Golden Rule of Leviticus 19:18