Does Evolution Make Jesus A Liar?

[PruePhillip]

This claim has been made and I would like to hear from those who know more about it than me.

Jesus didn't mention much about creation other than to speak of it
in spiritual terms.
Shouldn't be a problem - the bible tells us that God COMMANDED
the creation to create life. God commanded first the earth to bring
forth life, and then He commanded the seas to bring forth life.
This is exactly what happened - life first emerged on land (in a
fresh water setting)
That life could just come out of the earth or sea was considered
pretty unbelievable to people prior to the 1800's.

 

[WhyIsThatSo]

Seems that AiG claims that this verse is the basis for the claim:

“But from the beginning of the creation, God ‘made them male and female.” (Mark 10:6)​

That's correct.....the "god of this world" took the True Human Being , that was androgynous ( both male and female ),
and "divided" (separated) him/her.

Thus the overwhelming "desire" to this very day.....the urge to merge.

 

[viole]

....and the ones who just believe in fortunate accidents will fudge anything to eliminate the need for an Intelligent Designer altogether.

intelligent?

ciao

- viole

 

[McBell]

For that You can clone the monkeys but you cant clone human!

I honestly have no idea what you are talking about.

 

[McBell]

That's correct.....the "god of this world" took the True Human Being , that was androgynous ( both male and female ),
and "divided" (separated) him/her.

Thus the overwhelming "desire" to this very day.....the urge to merge.

that is nice and all....I guess, but what does it have to do with believing evolution makes Jesus a liar?

 

[WhyIsThatSo]

I honestly have no idea what you are talking about.

Jesus didn't talk about this physical creation, because Jesus despises it . ( like all true Christians do ).
He despises it because He knows who "created" it , including this physical body (flesh), and again, like all true Christians do.

The one that created this physical realm ( world ) separated "Man" into TWO beings ( male and female ),
thereby bringing "death" to the "body".

"Death" in and of itself is not a bad thing for us ( in fact it's a good thing ),
the problem is all the SUFFERING along the way there.

Thus, His (Jesus's) "good news" message ( good news = "gospel" ), about the "Kingdom of God",
the REAL "creation" where we came from.

 

[Deeje]

And what does all of this have to do with evolution making Jesus a liar?

If Jesus spoke about God creating male and female (and he should know because he was directly involved in the process according to Colossians 1:15-17) then science comes along with a theory based on adaptation becoming bigger than Mt Everest, with not a single shred of concrete evidence that an amoeba can morph into a dinosaur given enough millions of years to do so....which means that if their theory is invalid, (which I believe it is) then Jesus was not a liar.

The truth is that the Genesis “days” were not 24 hour periods but epochs of millions of years where a slow and deliberate creation took place. Creation is a process and according to Genesis, God assigned himself specific tasks in each epoch, confirmed by the fact that he was pleased with his efforts on the completion of each “day”. The only day that has no declaration is the 7th day...which is still in the process of completion. Once Jesus has brought mankind back into reconciliation with God by means of his kingdom, then there will be a declaration that everything is again....”very good”. God always completes what he starts. (Isaiah 55:11)

People can’t understand why everything has gone belly up during this period, but it was all in God’s purpose, (once creation was complete) to allow free will to be tested and to determine who, at the end of the “day” gets to enjoy what God had planned all along.....a race of obedient humans taking care of his creation, utilising the qualities that he gave them to be his representatives here. It was to be a life without end, with no sickness, aging or death because God created the means for humans to live forever.....but once they disobeyed, he took that away and allowed them to determine their own destiny. By our own free will, we either earn the privilege of everlasting life in paradise conditions on earth as God first purposed....or we merit permanent eviction. God has never left us without his direction, but it was always up to us to follow it. It was never forced.

At the end of this day, we will have chosen our course and it’s end result, all by ourselves.

 

[SaintUriah]

I honestly have no idea what you are talking about.

China has succeeded in cloning the monkey
Monkeys ancestor of humans The theory of evolution claims this
Why can't they clone Humans? As monkeys

They same?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

May it be that even if there is a God who created all, on the surface it would look like an evolution because of the laws of the physical cosmos? So in a way both creationists and evolutionists are correct?
And could it be possible that if a God is behind it, that it was only the first part He created and the rest was up to the nature itself? For example that the law of the cosmos was made to do that nature could take care of itself, and that it is not a God who do everything in every second of something that is arising?

So you do agree that appearances suggest that evolution was caused by physical forces alone without divine intervention?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

This claim has been made and I would like to hear from those who know more about it than me.

I would have to have some level of confidence about what Jesus has actually said before I could make a decision about whether anything he said was true or false, never mind deciding whether it was deliberately false.

 

[Rise]

This claim has been made and I would like to hear from those who know more about it than me.

No, because evolutionary theory hasn't been proven to be true, and they have not been able to reconcile all the evidence which contradicts the theory.

Evolutionary theory would have to be true before we could start to talk about how it contradicts anything Jesus said about creation or history.

 

[McBell]

Jesus didn't talk about this physical creation, because Jesus despises it . ( like all true Christians do ).
He despises it because He knows who "created" it , including this physical body (flesh), and again, like all true Christians do.

The one that created this physical realm ( world ) separated "Man" into TWO beings ( male and female ),
thereby bringing "death" to the "body".

"Death" in and of itself is not a bad thing for us ( in fact it's a good thing ),
the problem is all the SUFFERING along the way there.

Thus, His (Jesus's) "good news" message ( good news = "gospel" ), about the "Kingdom of God",
the REAL "creation" where we came from.

that is nice and all....I guess, but what does it have to do with believing evolution makes Jesus a liar?

 

[WhyIsThatSo]

that is nice and all....I guess, but what does it have to do with believing evolution makes Jesus a liar?

lol.....Jesus would be the first to agree with "human evolution",
BUT, the True Human is "Man"......not the physical body we have now..of which He himself said many times
that He was the "Son" of .

 

[McBell]

If Jesus spoke about God creating male and female (and he should know because he was directly involved in the process according to Colossians 1:15-17) then science comes along with a theory based on adaptation becoming bigger than Mt Everest, with not a single shred of concrete evidence that an amoeba can morph into a dinosaur given enough millions of years to do so....which means that if their theory is invalid, (which I believe it is) then Jesus was not a liar.

The truth is that the Genesis “days” were not 24 hour periods but epochs of millions of years where a slow and deliberate creation took place. Creation is a process and according to Genesis, God assigned himself specific tasks in each epoch, confirmed by the fact that he was pleased with his efforts on the completion of each “day”. The only day that has no declaration is the 7th day...which is still in the process of completion. Once Jesus has brought mankind back into reconciliation with God by means of his kingdom, then there will be a declaration that everything is again....”very good”. God always completes what he starts. (Isaiah 55:11)

People can’t understand why everything has gone belly up during this period, but it was all in God’s purpose, (once creation was complete) to allow free will to be tested and to determine who, at the end of the “day” gets to enjoy what God had planned all along.....a race of obedient humans taking care of his creation, utilising the qualities that he gave them to be his representatives here. It was to be a life without end, with no sickness, aging or death because God created the means for humans to live forever.....but once they disobeyed, he took that away and allowed them to determine their own destiny. By our own free will, we either earn the privilege of everlasting life in paradise conditions on earth as God first purposed....or we merit permanent eviction. God has never left us without his direction, but it was always up to us to follow it. It was never forced.

At the end of this day, we will have chosen our course and it’s end result, all by ourselves.

So your above sermon is all to support your argument from incredulity?

And are you ever going to directly address the verse in question?
It is Mark 10:6.

I flat out ask you to directly give your take on the verse, because although I do not always, ok very seldom, agree with your interpretations, I do know you have an opinion on it.

I just find it extremely interesting how you are completely avoiding it this thread.

 

[Spirit of Light]

So you do agree that appearances suggest that evolution was caused by physical forces alone without divine intervention?

That is not what i said I say Some form of divine entity created the first life on earth, but it would look very similar to what science say, I do not believe suddenly there were full-grown Adam and Eve. It would have to take time to create it. But no i do not believe we are a form of ape. But when this was created it goes on automatically in form of new plants, animals, and so on. In my understanding there are a lot of automatic systems behind how things works, But i do understand it that way that we would not be here if we were not created by a divine force in the very beginning.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

No, because evolutionary theory hasn't been proven to be true, and they have not been able to reconcile all the evidence which contradicts the theory.

Evolutionary theory would have to be true before we could start to talk about how it contradicts anything Jesus said about creation or history.

Scientific theories do not work that way. No scientific theory has ever been proven true, nor will there ever be one that is.

There is no evidence that contradicts the theory of evolution.

 

[Samantha Rinne]

This claim has been made and I would like to hear from those who know more about it than me.

Why would it? Jesus never made an specific claims to the effect of evolution being wrong.

Also, it is only extremist atheists and theists that contend evolution is something that directly prevents the creation.

An evolving creature must first exist (if this doesn't imply creation, I dunno why not; or you tell me, how do living things come into being without coming into being?) and a creating creature evolves to survive.

Also, you're coming to an (extremely stupid) assumption that Darwin was the only evolution game in town. What about Lamarck? Geoffroy Saint-Hillaire (who btw was a deist)? Linnaeus? Erasmus Darwin? Etc?

Evolution Theories Before Darwin

 

[tas8831]

Evolution means various things.

If you mean a wolf can become other types of dogs, that is true and in know way contradicts anythign Jesus said

If you mean goo to you via the zoo?

So clever - no wonder you never stick around to debate anything. You know you'd get quickly embarrassed.

 

[McBell]

Why would it?

I do not know.
Thus the reason for the thread.

Jesus never made an specific claims to the effect of evolution being wrong.

I agree.

Also, it is only extremist atheists and theists that contend evolution is something that directly prevents the creation.

Ah, so you think the claim has to do with evolution somehow preventing creation?

An evolving creature must first exist

Yes.
It does typically work that way.

(if this doesn't imply creation,

If mere existence is enough for you to claim creation, by all means embrace it.

or you tell me, how do living things come into being without coming into being?)

I have no interest in your strawman.

Also, you're coming to an (extremely stupid) assumption that Darwin was the only evolution game in town. What about Lamarck? Geoffroy Saint-Hillaire (who btw was a deist)? Linnaeus? Erasmus Darwin? Etc?

Evolution Theories Before Darwin

*yawn*
Interestingly enough, this idea that evolution makes Jesus a liar was brought to my attention in the thread Evolution my ToE by a Christian who made the claim to another Christian.

so how about you address the thread topic instead of trying to preach the evils of evolution?

 

[SaintUriah]

It depends on human cloning

If scientists can clone humans

The prophets will be liars

if they cant clone humans

Evolutionists will be liars
It is easy and does not need deep debate

They claim that the monkey is the ancestor of humans

Can they clone humans as they did with the monkey