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Do Souls have freedom of choice?

Terrywoodenpic

Oldest Heretic
During recent Communion prayers, there were thoughts on our freedom of choice and also a prayer for the souls of the departed. Somehow the subjects were linked in my mind. Resulting, for me, a new thought. Do Souls have freedom of choice.

The logical answer is that if God gave us freedom to choose, that freedom would not end with death.

My previous belief has always been that on death we, ’our souls’ return to God. That is to say our souls, whether evil or good are shorn of their sin as they are accepted back to be one with God.

I have also considered that at birth we receive our souls from God like a nearly empty vessel. During our lives we have the opportunity to chose to fill this vessel with good or evil, so increasing it’s worth or not by our actions. This is rather like the parable of the talents. So on our death those who have lived an evil life when shorn of their sins, really become an empty vessel, and take nothing with them, and it is as if they had never existed.

This new thought as to whether souls have freedom of choice. Gives me some possible answers to questions that have always troubled me, Such as the existence of the Devil, and evil spirits, who I previously thought could not exist because God is all powerful.

We are taught that there are Angels who never lived as men, such as the Archangel Michael. It has never troubled me that an angel might exist along side God, because angels must be an aspect or free extension from God. They could only exist because God wants them to.

So where do Evil angels and the Devil come from. And do they really have power over men.

Tradition says the Devil is a fallen angel cast out by God. Now an interesting possibility presents itself. Since God is all-powerful he could, not only have cast the Devil out but totally obliterated him. Why did God not do this?

It is clear to me now that God has indeed given both souls and his angels freedom of choice. And that includes the freedom to choose evil and work against God’s purpose. As to whether they have power over men, I think that they only have a power to tempt and influence us. But that power is limited because we always retain our own power of choice.

These thoughts must modify my previous belief that all souls return to God on death. All souls have that choice to return or not. I can see reasons why a soul might choose either way. During It’s life a good soul might have been fighting the influence of evil and wish to continue the fight as a soul. Could this be where the idea of guardian angels comes from. I have no problem with these ideas, if God wants individual souls to carry on his work then it is so.

On death an evil soul may wish to return to God and be forgiven it’s sins. Plainly God would forgive those sins and give that soul another chance. Perhaps to be tested again in new life.

More frightening are those evil souls, who chose not to return to God but continue to reinforce their evil influence amongst us.. This could well be the reason why there is so much evil in the world today, since so few now profess to believe in a loving God, the balance of influence could be moving towards evil.
 

Ori

Angel slayer
I think that Satan is still important to Gods overall plan, because the way I see it, all will eventually come to paradise.
 

Terrywoodenpic

Oldest Heretic
orichalcum said:
I think that Satan is still important to Gods overall plan, because the way I see it, all will eventually come to paradise.
I don't know Gods overall plan. But certainly Satan is important to the refining process, as are all those souls who chose satans path. I believe we return to God, not go to paradise. I can not see the existance of a place for souls to spend for ever in pleasure and idleness.

To me, to share existance with god in however minute a way is paradise enough.
 

Ori

Angel slayer
I feel the same, I think paradise is not a physichal place, but a spiritual state of one with God.
 

BruceDLimber

Well-Known Member
Hi! :)

I'm a Baha'i, and we definitely believe that we have freedom of choice (aka "free will") in this life! Whether or not we also do in the Next Life, although our scriptures gove some indication that we don't, and that we exist and progress then totally at the Will of God!

(BTW, as an aside since someone else mentioned this, we Baha'is DO NOT believe in an active devil-force competing with God as God is Suprememe and has no rival! Such references are IOV spiritual and metaphoric, not literal. And "satan" refers simply to our own lower <animal> nature when we give it control instead of our higher <spiritual> nature.)

Best, :)

Bruce
 

James the Persian

Dreptcredincios Crestin
Terrywoodenpic,

Your opening post almost sounds Orthodox! It maybe goes a little far towards universal salvation, but then even St. Gregory of Nyssa did that and he's a Church Father. In any case we have prayers for the dead and see salvation as a process (theosis) not a once and for all act. We also believe that the state of hell is a self-condemnation by our rejection of and hatred for God rather than a punishment. God, after all, wishes that all men will be saved. Frubals to you.

James
 

Terrywoodenpic

Oldest Heretic
IacobPersul said:
Terrywoodenpic,

We also believe that the state of hell is a self-condemnation by our rejection of and hatred for God rather than a punishment. God, after all, wishes that all men will be saved. Frubals to you.

James
That has also been my previous belief. Now I am not so sure in as much as there seems to me. there is an evil influence at work, Satan is as good a word for it as any other.
I know almost nothing about the Orthodox beliefs, they sound interesting.
 

michel

Administrator Emeritus
Staff member
I believe that upon death, we are 'in Limbo' in the spirit world, waiting for the opportunity to be re-born (Incarnated) into a body of a child who will live the life that he will need to live, in order to learn the 'lesson' of that lifetime.

So, yes, I believe that the Soul has free will.:)
 
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